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Continuing Care Retirement Communities

clifffaith

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Do any of you TUG members live in a CCRC? Cliff had a virtual friend living at Stoneridge Creek in Pleasanton, CA. She is now a face to face friend after inviting us to visit her and her husband this week while we were semi-nearby while staying at the River Pointe timeshare in Napa. The development was beautiful, and assuming the numbers work for us because it was not inexpensive, I'd be delighted to live out my days in such a place. Cliff figures I'll die alone and our cats will eat me if he doesn't get us moved into a community where I have plenty of things to do, they'll feed me since I don't cook, and they'll know when it is time to encourage me to move from my personal dwelling to the assisted living area of the campus (he is 79, I'm 61, so presumably he will long pre-decease me). We are just at the very beginning of our research. The Pleasanton development has a sister community in San Juan Capistrano which is much closer to our Los Angeles home. When we get home from Napa we'll look into that community, which I believe is still in the early construction mode.
 

rapmarks

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I actually think we will start looking next year, in sw Florida


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

Passepartout

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I'd like to explore these myself, but getting my DW to give up all her accumulated 'stuff' that represents bygone youth and memories, is probably something that isn't going to happen. It's tough to tell the (well grown) offspring that when one of us departs, to just have the 'mother of all' estate sales and order the biggest dumpster available for the rest.

Jim
 

clifffaith

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Not sure we could afford a three bedroom unit, but the two we saw (our friend's and then a friend of theirs that happened to be in the elevator as we were on our way up) had lots of room. And this facility also had separate storage lockers somewhere so your holiday decorations, etc, could also be put away. There were also "hotel units" on each floor so if you had a one bedroom you could still have a guest onsite. And 30 meals per month were included (in the independent living area) so if you went out to dinner one night, you could have your friend with you for dinner the next. Our friends were leaving for an Alaskan cruise, so feeding us on Thursday didn't "take food out of their mouths". No carry over of unused meals to the next month, but if you were going to be gone all month you could get a credit.
 

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We are getting close to retirement age, but have ruled out these types of communities for the most part until we get in our late 70s, if we make it that long. I think there are several factors going on here as you know. The age difference is huge; I suspect your husband is of an age that this type community is more appropriate for. Will you be happy living in this type community? Also, I have been reading where property in these types of communities is harder to sell, should you want to after your husband passes.
 

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I only know about this one community, but we would need to buy/move in before Cliff hits 90. The maximum age for men is 89, I think she said 92 for women. At age 61 most of the residents we saw yesterday would be running rings around me between classes, clubs and outings. The units are "sold" by the property giving your estate 75% of what you bought in for (there is a sliding scale that hits the 75% return after about 7 years) and then reselling to the next person on the wait list. (Again, don't quote me on anything because we only had a very brief talk with the sales office because we will not be moving to this area, a 7 hour trip from Los Angeles). Prices are California real estate prices, as we've started talking about this we are also floating a move out of state.
 

b2bailey

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I put in a vote for the San Juan Capistrano location if it fits your needs. My question about such an arrangement, and it's pure curiosity because I don't have a spouse, what happens if one person needs the care provided in the assisted living facility while the other is still in the regular housing? It seems there would be two units being used during that period of time?
 

Talent312

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I'd like to explore these myself, but getting my DW to give up all her accumulated 'stuff' that represents bygone youth and memories, is probably something that isn't going to happen...

I hear that.
It's just the two of us, but we live in a 4BR house and need every inch of the closets and part of the garage, just to house our museum of historical clothing and artifacts -- that we might need someday. <sigh>

.
 
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clifffaith

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My belief is one of the reasons that couples would find the arrangement a good fit, especially with the age discrepancy Cliff and I have, is that we pay enough going in and then monthly per person, that when one goes to skilled nursing then you are occupying two units. Possibly the more able bodied partner would then want to move to a smaller unit. We can actually move in with my mom for an extra so much per month, as long as she moves in within the age limitation. The four cats are an issue, however! One is preferred, two so you don't have the trauma of giving up an extra cat. Our Scooter won't be with us that much longer (she's seventeen), but then we still have three. One of the good things about thinking about this now is not to accumulate or replace any more cats!
 

isisdave

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I hear that.
It's just the two of us, but we live in a 4BR house and need every inch of the closets and part of the garage, just to house our museum of historical clothing and artifacts -- that we might need someday. <sigh>

.
I briefly explored downsizing to a smaller house, but renting an industrial-area "office" of about 1500 sf in which to conduct hobbies, etc. In our area, it turned out to be not cost-effective, but it might in some places, depending on relative pricing of residential/industrial space. At least it would get half your floor area out of sight half the day, and reduce cleaning costs and labor at home.

Near us, there's a complex of indoor RV-storage units, all about 15 feet wide and 60 feet long. You're not allowed to sleep there, but several RV-less people use them for workshops. Some storage units will permit this too, as long as your hobby isn't welding or anything likely to start a fire.

So think outside the box!
 

WinniWoman

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We have looked at a couple In New Hampshire. Very preliminary for us as we are still working and also would have a house to sell. Expensive, and in two situations we did not like that you had to pay for meals even if you are not at the point of wanting a meal plan. (We are in our 60's).

In one you could live in a really nice cottage but had to drive (or walk) up a big hill to get to the dining room and tiny gym and to get your mail and if you had two cars you had to move your car in winter so they could plow! Well- how is this senior friendly? The community was isolated as well. They had apartments but no way would we live in them. Just not for us- we are used to being in a home. A condo we could see or a townhouse.

In another it was just cottages- no club house or pool or anything. The main campus was in another town- the one with the assisted living and skilled nursing care. Too isolated. Several miles from town and the lake.

Again- really expensive- not just the buy in- but the monthly charges! Wow!

Then we looked at a 62+ community- we liked it- again- expensive. If you have to move you (or your heirs if you pass) get 95% of your buy in back. But again- monthly fees very expensive! I know what it costs at our current home to have our 700 foot driveway plowed - and the town here plows the road- we have a tiny lawn (though we live on 10.5 acres) My husband mows it in about 15 minutes. We have minimal landscaping- if any really- all natural. Doesn't cost much or involve work for any of it- nowhere near what the 62+ community charges in the monthly fees!

Well- there are tiny lawns around those cottages and minimal landscaping. And there was no pool or clubhouse or gym - just a church hall they use for activities. The lake is nearby but you have to drive. They do have transportation available to doctors and shopping. Ok - well a good thing is they take care of the outside AND the inside of the cottages. But when I asked how often they paint or change out the carpeting and so on- they surprisingly did not have a regular schedule for maintenance of those kinds of things. There was also a sinkhole on one of the lawns which made me leery of buying a lot there.

And- of course- this was not a CCC.

So- we are still going to continue to check some more out but I am thinking we might just have to try to find a small one level town home or better yet a little cottage. If we are paying HIA fees I want to get our moneys' worth.

Or- we will have to look in another state, but that's a whole 'nother story..
 

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There is SO MUCH more to aging then just a warm bed and 2 squares a day.

My 92 yo aunt ... who I joined me for lunch yesterday at a local diner does NOT spend her days watching TV. She always is reading at least 2 hard back books at a time, does needlepoint and makes sure she watches TV News shows every morning. And she still lives in alone in her apartment. She has a private duty aide who does food shopping prepares most of her meals ... leaving prepared platters in her refrigerator for lunches. She cooks a simple early dinner plus a breakfast. Monday thru Friday. The aide used to work every other Saturday morning ... every other week .... for a hairdressing appointment and food shopping (which got to be TOO much for my aunt).

Auntie ... still has a neighborhood school girlfriend who graduated HS with her (it seems most kids where 16yo at HS graduation then) who DRIVES and they do things together. Let me tell you all, THAT IS THE SCARY PART ...she still DRIVES.

My aunt's youngest sister's (auntie is the last of her siblings still alive) husband is still alive and has a live in aide. Her BIL usually does something every week or two with together. HIS live in aide does the driving .... so it is more like the 3 of them, go out for a meal where the driving and going to, is all part of the day's adventure. And he is the same age as auntie.

And just to make sure Tuggers are really understanding this .... I have business in a little town where the High School is celebrating its 100 year anniversity. YES ... the HS building. And the local True Value hardware store is still run by a local family where the old man (dad of the kid who technically owns and runs the family business) ALSO graduated HS with my Auntie. Dad works MOST mornings at the store .... as his wife cleans up their house. And his Dad always asks, "How is Auntie doing?" And my answer is "Still above ground like you. And still running the show." He & auntie graduated HS together... same class as my aunt's other friends.

So these OLD 90+ year old PEOPLE are in a "continuing care" community... living where they always have lived ... same general places/homes that they grew up in ... and driving their relatives crazy. And I just HOPE I can live AS WELL AS THEY when & if I am at/near that age.
 

WinniWoman

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That is wonderful, Linda! I wish we could do the same but no one is here so we would be isolated. We know almost no one. Will be the same whereever we move. Which is why we will need to be in some kind of community or at least where there are people around that will notice if suddenly we "disappear". LOL!

And the home health care here is the pits. I worked in home care management most of my life and I can tell you it is incredibly expensive and unreliable unless you hit it just right with a good person.
 

clifffaith

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I often thought that when Cliff is gone I'd sign up for some sort of medical alert system that would check on me if I didn't check in each day by a certain hour (the CCRC we looked at has a button to push to let them know you woke up that morning). My main issue is having cats that need care if I woke up dead like a family friend did this January--went to bed feeling fine and husband woke up to find she'd died during the night.
 

vacationhopeful

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Private duty in my post above is NOT via an agency. PRIVATE arrangements are private deals between individuals. When my mother had to be supervised ALL the time (dementia) and my father was REQUIRED to allow people into the house (my mother dialed ZERO on the phone and told the operator a STRANGE MAN was in her house) ... 5+ police cars in the driveway by the time I got there.

I knew my dad would DRIVE an agency nuts .... I had to find people who would put up with HIM to take care of my passive/quiet mother. So the first person was a woman who owed me RENT money ... and her husband WAS trying to get his wife to understand, she HAD to work verses being the stay-at-home MOM. So we (me & her husband) had MONTHS of my Dad micro-managing this woman and her quitting every 2 or 3 weeks. I would talk to her husband, he would tell me WHAT my dad was doing AND I would yell at my Dad & her husband would tell his wife to GET BACK to work the next day. She LIKED my mom & the two of them would watch the afternoon soap stories....my Mom pointing at the TV, going "oh,oh" and the aide telling the storyline or some other comment ... my Mom being engaged in her very limited world.

Eventually, we had almost round the clock people into the house ... but when my mother got too UNSTABLE on her feet and my mom collapsed/dropped to the floor ... dead weight drop several times ... with both my dad & one of the aides on either side of her holding her arms.... I knew my dad realized she HAD to be moved to a nursing home. And I called another sister (the Texas one) to FLY home the next day .. to handhold my dad in moving her into a nursing home. She lived another 13 months there ... slowing slipping away...and my dad visiting her multiple times a day at first and then, less & less.

But all along .. til the day she passed away ... I always had to instruct the staff ... NEVER, NEVER ask about a SON or anything about having a SON. Daughter(s) all day long ... NEVER, NEVER about SON(s). My mother never got over her 2nd son dying via a crib death at 3 months of age ... he was 3 years younger than me. She would totally become agitated for hours. And my older brother was just the most valued person in her life ... she was afraid he would gone, too. And it never helped that my surviving brother 'gets' lost in his own schedule of life ... only plan that he is going anywhere WHEN he walks in thru the door.
 

VacationForever

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There is SO MUCH more to aging then just a warm bed and 2 squares a day.

My 92 yo aunt ... who I joined me for lunch yesterday at a local diner does NOT spend her days watching TV. She always is reading at least 2 hard back books at a time, does needlepoint and makes sure she watches TV News shows every morning. And she still lives in alone in her apartment. She has a private duty aide who does food shopping prepares most of her meals ... leaving prepared platters in her refrigerator for lunches. She cooks a simple early dinner plus a breakfast. Monday thru Friday. The aide used to work every other Saturday morning ... every other week .... for a hairdressing appointment and food shopping (which got to be TOO much for my aunt).

Auntie ... still has a neighborhood school girlfriend who graduated HS with her (it seems most kids where 16yo at HS graduation then) who DRIVES and they do things together. Let me tell you all, THAT IS THE SCARY PART ...she still DRIVES.

My aunt's youngest sister's (auntie is the last of her siblings still alive) husband is still alive and has a live in aide. Her BIL usually does something every week or two with together. HIS live in aide does the driving .... so it is more like the 3 of them, go out for a meal where the driving and going to, is all part of the day's adventure. And he is the same age as auntie.

And just to make sure Tuggers are really understanding this .... I have business in a little town where the High School is celebrating its 100 year anniversity. YES ... the HS building. And the local True Value hardware store is still run by a local family where the old man (dad of the kid who technically owns and runs the family business) ALSO graduated HS with my Auntie. Dad works MOST mornings at the store .... as his wife cleans up their house. And his Dad always asks, "How is Auntie doing?" And my answer is "Still above ground like you. And still running the show." He & auntie graduated HS together... same class as my aunt's other friends.

So these OLD 90+ year old PEOPLE are in a "continuing care" community... living where they always have lived ... same general places/homes that they grew up in ... and driving their relatives crazy. And I just HOPE I can live AS WELL AS THEY when & if I am at/near that age.

Linda,

Thanks for sharing. That is pretty much our plan. Age in place with a private duty home care aide if or when we no longer want or be able to cook and clean. We bought LTCI for this reason. We are introverts and in no way we want to move into community type living. Our condo is single level, no steps unless you wish to use, in the entire building.

Private duty means private pay, not through Medicare, as Medicare does not pay for this type of work. We always go through a business to ensure that we do not become an employer.
 

WinniWoman

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Linda,

Thanks for sharing. That is pretty much our plan. Age in place with a private duty home care aide if or when we no longer want or be able to cook and clean. We bought LTCI for this reason. We are introverts and in no way we want to move into community type living. Our condo is single level, no steps unless you wish to use, in the entire building.

Private duty means private pay, not through Medicare, as Medicare does not pay for this type of work. We always go through a business to ensure that we do not become an employer.


We are introverts also, and, besides the privacy issue, I also don't like the idea of someone in our home ready to steal and take advantage of us. Hard to trust strangers.

I pretty much don't like any of the choices. We are going to have a tough time with the aging thing. LOL!:confused:
 

lizap

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Private duty in my post above is NOT via an agency. PRIVATE arrangements are private deals between individuals. When my mother had to be supervised ALL the time (dementia) and my father was REQUIRED to allow people into the house (my mother dialed ZERO on the phone and told the operator a STRANGE MAN was in her house) ... 5+ police cars in the driveway by the time I got there.

I knew my dad would DRIVE an agency nuts .... I had to find people who would put up with HIM to take care of my passive/quiet mother. So the first person was a woman who owed me RENT money ... and her husband WAS trying to get his wife to understand, she HAD to work verses being the stay-at-home MOM. So we (me & her husband) had MONTHS of my Dad micro-managing this woman and her quitting every 2 or 3 weeks. I would talk to her husband, he would tell me WHAT my dad was doing AND I would yell at my Dad & her husband would tell his wife to GET BACK to work the next day. She LIKED my mom & the two of them would watch the afternoon soap stories....my Mom pointing at the TV, going "oh,oh" and the aide telling the storyline or some other comment ... my Mom being engaged in her very limited world.

Eventually, we had almost round the clock people into the house ... but when my mother got too UNSTABLE on her feet and my mom collapsed/dropped to the floor ... dead weight drop several times ... with both my dad & one of the aides on either side of her holding her arms.... I knew my dad realized she HAD to be moved to a nursing home. And I called another sister (the Texas one) to FLY home the next day .. to handhold my dad in moving her into a nursing home. She lived another 13 months there ... slowing slipping away...and my dad visiting her multiple times a day at first and then, less & less.

But all along .. til the day she passed away ... I always had to instruct the staff ... NEVER, NEVER ask about a SON or anything about having a SON. Daughter(s) all day long ... NEVER, NEVER about SON(s). My mother never got over her 2nd son dying via a crib death at 3 months of age ... he was 3 years younger than me. She would totally become agitated for hours. And my older brother was just the most valued person in her life ... she was afraid he would gone, too. And it never helped that my surviving brother 'gets' lost in his own schedule of life ... only plan that he is going anywhere WHEN he walks in thru the door.

Linda, it is not always gender specific. In our mom's later years, my sister did almost nothing. It was my brother and me that provided intensive care for her. He was wonderful - don't know what I would have done without him.
 

lizap

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Linda,

Thanks for sharing. That is pretty much our plan. Age in place with a private duty home care aide if or when we no longer want or be able to cook and clean. We bought LTCI for this reason. We are introverts and in no way we want to move into community type living. Our condo is single level, no steps unless you wish to use, in the entire building.

Private duty means private pay, not through Medicare, as Medicare does not pay for this type of work. We always go through a business to ensure that we do not become an employer.

If you are planning on private pay, I hope you have alot of money, and I mean alot. We had promised our mom we would not put her in a nursing home. Our mom was relatively well off with an excellent retirement, but when you need round-the-clock care, it goes fast, very fast..
 

VacationForever

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We are introverts also, and, besides the privacy issue, I also don't like the idea of someone in our home ready to steal and take advantage of us. Hard to trust strangers.

I pretty much don't like any of the choices. We are going to have a tough time with the aging thing. LOL!:confused:
One key reason of using a good agency. My son wants me to move in with him, although I prefer to have him move in with me, if my husband goes before I do. We also have a significant gap in age.
 

VacationForever

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If you are planning on private pay, I hope you have alot of money, and I mean alot. We had promised our mom we would not put her in a nursing home. Our mom was relatively well off with an excellent retirement, but when you need round-the-clock care, it goes fast, very fast..
We both have high value LTCI.
 

WinniWoman

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One key reason of using a good agency. My son wants me to move in with him, although I prefer to have him move in with me, if my husband goes before I do. We also have a significant gap in age.


Believe me. I was a manager and District manager for several agencies ranging from a national one to a mom and pop to a regional one- over 20 years. They all pull from the same pool of people. In some areas of the country you might have a nicer pool than others. Some states have stricter licensing requirements for both the agency and the personnel than others.

You pay the agency like $25 per hour, they maybe pay the aide like $12-$15 per hour. (A lot more for nurses of course.)
That could be a decent wage or a very low wage depending on the area and thus that will also have a big affect the type of person that is hired. In some states like NY, the aide is not allowed to drive her car with the "patient" in it due to liability issues. The aide can drive the "patient's" car however.

And, because a lot of home care jobs are per diem or part-time, again- it attracts a different type of person and sometimes that person does not take the job very seriously. Many need the flexibility because their lives are complicated and they have problems at home and you quickly learn this.

This all said, if you are lucky you might get a wonderful, caring, trustworthy individual.
 

vacationhopeful

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If you are planning on private pay, I hope you have alot of money, and I mean alot. We had promised our mom we would not put her in a nursing home. Our mom was relatively well off with an excellent retirement, but when you need round-the-clock care, it goes fast, very fast..

AND that is extremely true. My dad paid for care for my mother; he qualified for LTC insurance. I have LTC policy... covering 3 years. Mom was home care for 2+ years; nursing home for almost 18 months before passing.

My mom did not qualify for LTC when he realized my mom had memory issues. But my sister, the RN who lives 3000 miles away, decided I did NOT need to know my mom was a 'raging, untreated diabetic' health status ... a BIG cause of memory issues. My mom was tall and skinny ... never even 5 pounds overweight. As for her care, I found people .. to care for her in the home. One was a tenant who was unemployed ... to earn money to pay her rent; another was a girl whose friend was a waitress working a diner; another was a group of my TX sister's friend's friend who organized a rotating crew from her hospital workplace for the overnight shift. CASH works.

My 92 yo last person (standing of my Dad's 4 other siblings) ... is in GREAT HEALTH with a near-perfect health. Of course, she NEVER has been overweight, doesn't drink, walked regularly as exercise and eats a great diet ... salads, soups, few red meats, not a drinker, few sweets.

As for me, I have a 3 year LTC policy. And my local nephews ... I try very hard to be on their 'A' list for relatives. ;)

PS And I lost 40+ pounds 5 or so years ago ... and YES, I was miserable ... started with on the QVC "lose weight" 30 days nurtra-system program. At least, I learned 'portion control', eat 5 small meals a day and drink lots of water. And I total EVERYONE, "I am on a diet; I am miserable; I have to LOSE weight. Got it?"
 
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We both have high value LTCI.

Not to sound too negative, but.. LTCI is better than nothing but it's not a sure thing. For example, only as good as the financial soundness of the insurance company. Usually, they will only pay for certain things and for a limited time period. LTCI companies can drastically raise premiums as many have been doing in recent years. If possible, it is best to have a sizable nest egg to supplement LTCI.
 

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Not to sound too negative, but.. LTCI is better than nothing but it's not a sure thing. For example, only as good as the financial soundness of the insurance company. Usually, they will only pay for certain things and for a limited time period. LTCI companies can drastically raise premiums as many have been doing in recent years. If possible, it is best to have a sizable nest egg to supplement LTCI.
True. It is all about risk mitigation. We are pretty sure we will do alright whatever happens.
 
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