Owner's "update" NYC Midtown 45 5-29-2017 UNBELIEVABLE!

[schoolmarm]

NEW changes (besides Voyager) to Wyndham revealed at this dilly of an update on Monday. Truth or stretch or lies? Has anyone else had this info? There was some funky math floating around. This was a VIP update (how did they let me in??? My resale doesn't qualify me!)

1. The biggest change is that contracts are now sold in 400K, 700K and 1M bundles. If you have 908,000 and want to be Platinum, you have to buy a new 1M "membership" to ADD to your 908K. So Wyndham is now JUST selling "silver VIP" at 400K, OR Gold OR Platinum packages. You cannot combine. BUT your "equity" in a silver or gold purchase will get you a discount on your Gold or Platinum purchase for ONE YEAR!

2. Points are currently $251/1,000. They were selling CWP at NYC. The Monthly Assessment is $164.67 for 400K points. That comes out to $4.94/1000. She said that that was the WAY LOWEST MF in the system. I did the math. My three contracts (Bali Hai, NH, and Sedona) have MF (plus program fees) of $4.71 so NO, NYC is not the WAY LOWEST in the system. Sedona is higher than Bali Hai and NH, but it is still under $5.00/1,000.

3. Oh, and NYC and the "Central Collection" (formerly Avenue Collection--the smaller resorts in urban areas) are all now Presidential Reserve resorts and 1/2 of the units would be held for VIP members. She said that with limited inventory, it would be impossible to get a reservation at these resorts. NASHVILLE is one of them. It is (was) easy to get into Nashville. I booked 3 express ressies at NYC for June and July and another for January--all the day before Voyager took over. Let's see how this one shakes out.

4. She said that there would be no more split reservations because NO ONE would have more than one contract...not because they are eliminating the restrictions on check in dates or weeks. (!!??)

5. She said that Wyndham has a resort in London. Ummmm....does anyone see this? She said that it is brand new, less than 3 months, and I probably couldn't see it because I'm not VIP.

6. She said that NO ONE could have small contracts anymore. Everyone had to have one BIG contract. She also said that you have to buy additional contracts in 400K, 700K, or 1M packages, even if you had PARTIAL points to earn the next level, you had to buy a totally new package to add to it. Well, then you would have TWO contracts, right? (!!??)

7. They are calling the big resorts "megasites". These are the ones like Bonnet Creek that have capacity of 10,000 or more. Surely I didn't write that down correctly. Is Bonnet Creek really that big?

8. EVERYONE would have a January use year. There would be no more April, July, or October use years.

9. FYI, there will be no more timeshare development in NYC because of a law forbidding any more timeshare conversions (I think that this is true). Wyndham has bought the New Yorker on the west side and it was thought that it would convert to Timeshare. Now it will be hotel.

10. The update started with a really good presentation (focused on the Central Collection, The Good Life/VIP, and Voyager), then the break outs. My saleslady said that I had misinformation (thanks, TUG) and SHE knew everything because she had been trained by Wyndham at "Wyndham University" or something like that. The plated breakfast was a choice of Oatmeal and fruit or Bacon/sausage, Eggs and potatoes. I had the eggs and it was delicious. The update lasted for 2 hours and 20 minutes. I know that I could have left earlier, but I decided to try to get as much info as possible for y'all!

11. The gift was a choice between 15,000 Wyndham Reward points OR a "pull tab" thing that awarded an AMEX gift card worth between $50-1000. I got $50.

12. The new CEO is here at the resort today (Tuesday)! I wish I could find him and talk to him about the hot mess of Voyager.

So, if you want to buy into Wyndham now you will need $100,000 for a 400,000 point package.

But that was at MY update. Your mileage may vary.

What have YOU heard lately?

 

[buckor]

NEW changes (besides Voyager) to Wyndham revealed at this dilly of an update on Monday. Truth or stretch or lies? Has anyone else had this info? There was some funky math floating around. This was a VIP update (how did they let me in??? My resale doesn't qualify me!)

1. The biggest change is that contracts are now sold in 400K, 700K and 1M bundles. If you have 908,000 and want to be Platinum, you have to buy a new 1M "membership" to ADD to your 908K. So Wyndham is now JUST selling "silver VIP" at 400K, OR Gold OR Platinum packages. You cannot combine. BUT your "equity" in a silver or gold purchase will get you a discount on your Gold or Platinum purchase for ONE YEAR!

2. Points are currently $251/1,000. They were selling CWP at NYC. The Monthly Assessment is $164.67 for 400K points. That comes out to $4.94/1000. She said that that was the WAY LOWEST MF in the system. I did the math. My three contracts (Bali Hai, NH, and Sedona) have MF (plus program fees) of $4.71 so NO, NYC is not the WAY LOWEST in the system. Sedona is higher than Bali Hai and NH, but it is still under $5.00/1,000.

3. Oh, and NYC and the "Central Collection" (formerly Avenue Collection--the smaller resorts in urban areas) are all now Presidential Reserve resorts and 1/2 of the units would be held for VIP members. She said that with limited inventory, it would be impossible to get a reservation at these resorts. NASHVILLE is one of them. It is (was) easy to get into Nashville. I booked 3 express ressies at NYC for June and July and another for January--all the day before Voyager took over. Let's see how this one shakes out.

4. She said that there would be no more split reservations because NO ONE would have more than one contract...not because they are eliminating the restrictions on check in dates or weeks. (!!??)

5. She said that Wyndham has a resort in London. Ummmm....does anyone see this? She said that it is brand new, less than 3 months, and I probably couldn't see it because I'm not VIP.

6. She said that NO ONE could have small contracts anymore. Everyone had to have one BIG contract. She also said that you have to buy additional contracts in 400K, 700K, or 1M packages, even if you had PARTIAL points to earn the next level, you had to buy a totally new package to add to it. Well, then you would have TWO contracts, right? (!!??)

7. They are calling the big resorts "megasites". These are the ones like Bonnet Creek that have capacity of 10,000 or more. Surely I didn't write that down correctly. Is Bonnet Creek really that big?

8. EVERYONE would have a January use year. There would be no more April, July, or October use years.

9. FYI, there will be no more timeshare development in NYC because of a law forbidding any more timeshare conversions (I think that this is true). Wyndham has bought the New Yorker on the west side and it was thought that it would convert to Timeshare. Now it will be hotel.

10. The update started with a really good presentation (focused on the Central Collection, The Good Life/VIP, and Voyager), then the break outs. My saleslady said that I had misinformation (thanks, TUG) and SHE knew everything because she had been trained by Wyndham at "Wyndham University" or something like that. The plated breakfast was a choice of Oatmeal and fruit or Bacon/sausage, Eggs and potatoes. I had the eggs and it was delicious. The update lasted for 2 hours and 20 minutes. I know that I could have left earlier, but I decided to try to get as much info as possible for y'all!

11. The gift was a choice between 15,000 Wyndham Reward points OR a "pull tab" thing that awarded an AMEX gift card worth between $50-1000. I got $50.

12. The new CEO is here at the resort today (Tuesday)! I wish I could find him and talk to him about the hot mess of Voyager.

So, if you want to buy into Wyndham now you will need $100,000 for a 400,000 point package.

But that was at MY update. Your mileage may vary.

What have YOU heard lately?

So, they are going to turn down money from someone who wants to purchase a 189k contract, or 84k? I don't think so...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320AZ using Tapatalk

 

[tschwa2]

If the smallest package they will sell is 400,000 for $100,000, they aren't going to have many sales per day. Heck I doubt they would have that many system wide per week. $20,000 is there bread and butter. They need those $20,000 sales so they can add bonus points and then get repeat sales.

 

[staceyeileen]

Someone just yesterday or today posted on FB that they purchased an 84,000 point contract.

 

[scootr5]

2. Points are currently $251/1,000. They were selling CWP at NYC. The Monthly Assessment is $164.67 for 400K points. That comes out to $4.94/1000. She said that that was the WAY LOWEST MF in the system. I did the math. My three contracts (Bali Hai, NH, and Sedona) have MF (plus program fees) of $4.71 so NO, NYC is not the WAY LOWEST in the system. Sedona is higher than Bali Hai and NH, but it is still under $5.00/1,000.

In addition to the ones you mentioned, Grand Desert is $4.52, and South Shore is $3.83.

4. She said that there would be no more split reservations because NO ONE would have more than one contract...not because they are eliminating the restrictions on check in dates or weeks. (!!??)

I think it's true that split reservations are gone, but her reasoning is flawed.

5. She said that Wyndham has a resort in London. Ummmm....does anyone see this? She said that it is brand new, less than 3 months, and I probably couldn't see it because I'm not VIP.

No, no mention of it anywhere.

 

[Pietin]

The update lasted for 2 hours and 20 minutes. I know that I could have left earlier, but I decided to try to get as much info as possible for y'all!

Thanks for taking one for the team!

 

[55plus]

NEW changes (besides Voyager) to Wyndham revealed at this dilly of an update on Monday. Truth or stretch or lies? Has anyone else had this info? There was some funky math floating around. This was a VIP update (how did they let me in??? My resale doesn't qualify me!)

1. The biggest change is that contracts are now sold in 400K, 700K and 1M bundles. If you have 908,000 and want to be Platinum, you have to buy a new 1M "membership" to ADD to your 908K. So Wyndham is now JUST selling "silver VIP" at 400K, OR Gold OR Platinum packages. You cannot combine. BUT your "equity" in a silver or gold purchase will get you a discount on your Gold or Platinum purchase for ONE YEAR!

Keep in mind, sales weasels tend to lie, a lot. If there is no more working one's way up to a VIP level with several purchase sales will suffer and if an existing owner wants more points, they'll go to resell, which they should anyway.

 

[cayman01]

I got offered 84k at Edisto Beach. I got offered NOTHING at Bonnet Creek. She knew we weren't buying her lines and didn't bother.

 

[Jan M.]

My saleslady said that I had misinformation (thanks, TUG) and SHE knew everything because she had been trained by Wyndham at "Wyndham University" or something like that

There are several options.
1. What she learned at "Wyndham University" is how to lie convincingly or maybe that is something she was already skilled at doing and she just learned some new lies.
2. She was playing on her phone the entire time and didn't learn anything so just keeps coming up with inventive b.s. that she passes off as factual.
3. She slept through her classes.
4. She is a sociopath who craves the boost she gets from manipulating with her lies. Note: Not all salespeople are like this but Wyndham provides a perfect opportunity for those who are.

 

[OutSkiing]

There are several options.
1. What she learned at "Wyndham University" is how to lie convincingly or maybe that is something she was already skilled at doing and she just learned some new lies.
2. She was playing on her phone the entire time and didn't learn anything so just keeps coming up with inventive b.s. that she passes off as factual.
3. She slept through her classes.
4. She is a sociopath who craves the boost she gets from manipulating with her lies. Note: Not all salespeople are like this but Wyndham provides a perfect opportunity for those who are.

Adding another one:
5. What is taught at 'Wyndham University' is itself a lie or at the very least partial information slanted toward direct sales.

 

[OutSkiing]

NEW changes (besides Voyager) to Wyndham revealed at this dilly of an update on Monday. Truth or stretch or lies? Has anyone else had this info? There was some funky math floating around. This was a VIP update (how did they let me in??? My resale doesn't qualify me!)

1. The biggest change is that contracts are now sold in 400K, 700K and 1M bundles. If you have 908,000 and want to be Platinum, you have to buy a new 1M "membership" to ADD to your 908K. So Wyndham is now JUST selling "silver VIP" at 400K, OR Gold OR Platinum packages. You cannot combine. BUT your "equity" in a silver or gold purchase will get you a discount on your Gold or Platinum purchase for ONE YEAR!

During the last few updates / account reviews we attended we were also told that 'from now on the contracts offered will be bigger' and in fact those leave-behind offers they now give you to go home and think about have all been multi hundred thousand points. I thought it may just be an effort to 'brain wash' existing owners .. if we are obviously not interested to buying today and hear the 'big contract' spiel enough times from enough salespeople we'll start believing it if someday we really want to step up to presidential reserve or whatever (not a chance). I still think they'll offer the $20k contracts to new recruits and sell anything to anyone who shows a genuine interest.

Bob

 

[JohnPaul]

FWIW Shell and WM are also spouting the idea that you won't be able to work your way up to the various elite levels because too many people are getting elite and it is losing value. Fortunately these two systems don't have all the crazy things that Wyndham does and elite levels provide limited benefit when it come to actually booking and using the resorts. The big push is all the things you can do that aren't resort stays.

 

[markb53]

During the last few updates / account reviews we attended we were also told that 'from now on the contracts offered will be bigger' and in fact those leave-behind offers they now give you to go home and think about have all been multi hundred thousand points. I thought it may just be an effort to 'brain wash' existing owners .. if we are obviously not interested to buying today and hear the 'big contract' spiel enough times from enough salespeople we'll start believing it if someday we really want to step up to presidential reserve or whatever (not a chance). I still think they'll offer the $20k contracts to new recruits and sell anything to anyone who shows a genuine interest.

Bob

I really suspect that is just a way to get you to buy now before they invoke the new requirements. Were they really saying that you couldn't buy into VIP without spend $100,000.00 on 400k point that day. It sure seems to me that if I walked in with 50 grand to bring myself up to permanent VIP silver, they wouldn't turn it down.

 

[chapjim]

I really suspect that is just a way to get you to buy now before they invoke the new requirements. Were they really saying that you couldn't buy into VIP without spend $100,000.00 on 400k point that day. It sure seems to me that if I walked in with 50 grand to bring myself up to permanent VIP silver, they wouldn't turn it down.

Just checked in to Wyndham National Harbor for four nights. After years of not having anyone even ask if we wanted to attend an update, I asked to attend one!! It will be at noon on Saturday. I told the guy there had been some massive changes at Wyndham and I wanted to see how it was being presented. Tellingly, he said, "We are mostly looking for non-owners to attend." Yeah, no kidding!! Owners, at least the ones who have been paying attention, would make for a pretty antagonistic presentation.

I'll be good. I think.

 

[Bigrob]

There used to be an affiliate location in London... mostly for a dot on the map. It was outrageously priced and seldom had any availability. I believe Wyndham lost the affiliation about 12-18 months ago.

I think if a salesperson were to tell me they only sell in packages of 400K, 700K, or 1M, I'd laugh out loud and say, "yeah, good luck with that."

 

[markb53]

There used to be an affiliate location in London... mostly for a dot on the map. It was outrageously priced and seldom had any availability. I believe Wyndham lost the affiliation about 12-18 months ago.

I think if a salesperson were to tell me they only sell in packages of 400K, 700K, or 1M, I'd laugh out loud and say, "yeah, good luck with that."

I think their sales would fall through the floor if the minimum purchase was $100,000.

 

[schoolmarm]

Yeah, that is some kind of crazy. I even asked if I could get 250K points to add to my 154 full freight National Harbor to get up to Silver VIP and she said NO! You have to buy 400K for $100,000.

I see that others have posted about their updates (and that they were offered smaller contracts).

 

[BellaWyn]

Tellingly, he said, "We are mostly looking for non-owners to attend." Yeah, no kidding!! Owners, at least the ones who have been paying attention, would make for a pretty antagonistic presentation.

I'll be good. I think.

People are going to buy regardless, especially because they are on vacation crack and the resorts do a great job keeping them on that high, at least until they get them into a presentation. There was a time that this didn't bother me that much because there have historically been a lot of great things about the ownership.

Of late, even sans the rollout of an incredibly stupid website, that has changed. Wyn's attitude toward the owners is just getting exponentially worse on a continuum. They are, as always, targetting "fresh meat" but there was a time in the not too recent past that owners were a good source of developer-buy contracts because they we happy owners.

It's going to take some effort on WYN's part to flip 400K existing owners with new ones. Especially if it's an initial $100K buy-in. Young families cannot afford that these days.

 

[breezez]

It's going to take some effort on WYN's part to flip 400K existing owners with new ones. Especially if it's an initial $100K buy-in. Young families cannot afford that these days.

Yah but while they are on the Vacation Crack High, they are more than happy to help people not thinking to sign up for PayPal credit to buy one if these overpriced contracts. When they get them that way they don't even have to provide them a truth in lending statement showing how long it will take and how much will be paid to pay it off. Plus if you default it doesn't cost them.

 

[ronparise]

Yah but while they are on the Vacation Crack High, they are more than happy to help people not thinking to sign up for PayPal credit to buy one if these overpriced contracts. When they get them that way they don't even have to provide them a truth in lending statement showing how long it will take and how much will be paid to pay it off. Plus if you default it doesn't cost them.

Do they let you finance the whole thing with paypal? I always thought that the bulk of the deal was financed internally and only the downpayment world be put on a card (or paypal)

The financing is an enormous profit center for Wyndham, I cant imagine them giving that up

 

[md8287]

You can finance almost the entire thing, like 90%, and put the rest on other credit cards

 

[ronparise]

I understand their focus on new owners now, because the existing owners are all unhappy with the new website, but this would be a major change. They have, for some time, had a 2/3 - 1/3 target

Every successful sales organization knows its easier and cheaper to upsell a existing satisfied customer, than to develop a new one. and if nothing else Wyndham is a successful sales organization. The only reason that they sell to non owners at all is that today's new sale becomes tomorrows upgrade

And to make the minimum sale $100000 seems to me to be the dumbest thing ever.... of course I was never a great salesman so what do I know?.. But maybe it makes sense for existing owners. They have already tried the product, and like it. The sales pitch could be... "lets stop playing around. You like this stuff. Its time to step up to a level of ownership" that makes sense. Timeshares used to be sold a week at a time... looks like Wyndham is moving to a 2 week model

there are real estate agents in Florida that make their living selling to second home buyers from "up north" Its not unusual to sell a $300000 home to someone thats going to use it just 3 or 4 months a year. Maybe Wyndham is going to position their product as a "second home" product rather than as a weeks vacation product. 3 months at a Wyndham resort would be something like 2 or 3 million points. ($400000-$500000) The new 14 day reservations (400000 points or $100000) may be a step in that direction.. There are a lot of us baby boomers looking for a deal like that

 

[schoolmarm]

Funny thing...I live in a cheap real estate area. Two of the three offers were for more than the price of my house...it was $133K for 3 bedroom house with pool, hot tub, deck, etc. My folks live in a rural area where you can get an acreage with a huge house for about $50K-60K.

The deposit on the $100K purchase was $30K (30% of purchase price). They finance the rest at 17% for 10 years.

I didn't even put 20% down on my house!

 

[vacationhopeful]

Vacation home prices INCREASE where you can see or smell water ... bays, oceans, gulfs, rivers, lakes, recreation rivers cost MORE dollars than a place on a hill or next to a freeway. Disney World is great .. you can print your own money if you are inside the Disney gate on their bus stops with EMH access. And these are areas Wyndham has resorts plus the city resorts.

Building and running resorts means selling MORE points to more people at higher per 1K than ever. I think the resale INTERNET market (eBay) is driving this PUSH for 400,000K minimum buy (selling this product to new owners). Who is going to sell a $100,000 item for $1,000 on eBay. Thus maybe .. .Wyndham will take a 400K contract back with listing it for sale by taking a 40% commission based on the buyer's original purchase price. Owner who brought a contract for $100,000, gets $60,000 back when SOLD again by Wyndham ... and Wyndham sells it for a higher price, say ... $135,000 .... all on the "JUST IN TIME" principal.

This to me would explain WHY they are upsizing in the "PRODUCT" packaging (bigger points contracts). Plus, it seriously decreases the number of contract and owners they are servicing.

Wyndham is walking away from its "blue collar and union" buyers of yesteryear. They want buyers who have the disposal income to get credit and to buy a 'second home' for $100,000-250,000+ (and can afford in future years to buy at a higher cost). And these buyers might not dump these size contracts on eBay for $1.

I thought a bit on WHY Wyndham would move to these point package levels. CWA has made points into a currency to 'use' a condo by season, unit size and resort locations. They have learn it takes MORE effort to manage lots of SMALL OWNERS .... than a fewer LARGE contract holders. Within 10 years, I believe the owner base will have decreased by 35+% in total numbers. And CWP points will be a very RARE point product.

And I would also forecast, Wyndham will dump (sell off, convert to private ownership, etc) some of the older resorts ... as Wyndham appeals MORE to the executive base of clients (aka vacationers) buying a $100K buy in product. And stepping those owners UP to the $250,000 buyer.

 

[CandyLancaster]

I got offered 84k at Edisto Beach. I got offered NOTHING at Bonnet Creek. She knew we weren't buying her lines and didn't bother.

Hahahahahahaha!!!!