[2008] Grand Regina Villa Cabo San Lucas [Not Starwood]

SDKath said:

I agree with you Fred. But is the hotel side fairing any better? The first thing people cut back on when money is tight is vacations. Same with business clients. They are not filling those hotels as readily as they were 5 years ago?! Seems like the hotel side is suffering just as badly. I just saw an ad pop up on google for me saying Starwood stay 1 night, get 1 night free!

Katherine

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Katherine, the 2009 picture is not pretty for the hotel side. You are absolutely right about family and business travel cutbacks.

Is the hotel side fairing any better than VO? For 2009, I think so.
Business will be off comparing year to year. Nonetheless, new hotels are entering the system, and new management contracts are being written.

VO, on the other hand, is at a standstill until credit markets return to normal. Which is the point I was really trying to make.
The thread started with the status of Grand Regina, and discussion expanded to other pipeline questions.

All issues considered, they will be making money, not losing money. It is not growth, but they are not going out of business. Making profits while waiting for the economic climate to improve is not a bad place to be.

Some stockholders may not like it, but the stock has already been pounded into the dirt. Fairly conservative valuations suggest that the current business is worth $65/share. It is trading around $19.
One person's paper loss is another person's longer term buying opportunity.

Meanwhile, those of us who do have occasion to stay at a hotel are getting benefits from the slowdown.

Don't worry, be happy!

grand regina villa cabo san lucas

nanaboat said:

Yeah, check the site out now. Its over.

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I am a owner at the Grand Regina and have been contacted that Starwood has backed out and the villas will not be completed. We are suppose to hear by the end of the year our buy out, since we paid in advance. Lesson to be learned.

clsmit said:

How about:
"Date: Wednesday, April 18 2007
Starwood Vacation Ownership, a division of Starwood Hotels & Resorts Worldwide, Inc. (NYSE: HOT), announced today that it has broken ground on its second Westin-branded vacation ownership resort in Mexico. The Westin Los Cabos Ocean Villas is the first vacation ownership resort in Los Cabos, Mexico to be developed by a major U.S.-based lodging company. ... 'The location is one of the most beautiful in Los Cabos and we are eager to continue our expansion,' said Sergio Rivera, president of real estate development, Starwood Hotels & Resorts, Worldwide, Inc. "

http://www.allbusiness.com/services/business-services/4320265-1.html

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How about I am a owner at Grand Regina and got my email saying Starwood had backed out and further info. regarding a buy out would be coming by the end of the year. This means MY BUYOUT since I paid in advance. NEVER pay before the product is produced!

I realize that Starwood has had your money since 2004, Nanaboat. And that stinks. On a positive note, Starwood must return 100% of your money. Had you not given it to them, it might have been invested in the stock market and been down 60% of it like the rest of us!

Small consolation, I know.

Probably not with starwood

LisaRex said:

I realize that Starwood has had your money since 2004, Nanaboat. And that stinks. !
.

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I do not think that nanaboat paid his money to the starwood. Starwood entered the game late and nanaboat's money may well be with the original developer, raintree??

Grand Regina Cabo

sjuhawk_jd said:

I do not think that nanaboat paid his money to the starwood. Starwood entered the game late and nanaboat's money may well be with the original developer, raintree??

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You are correct! It is with Raintree and who knows what is going to happen, and by the way, I am in the stock market, too!!!

I'm sorry, I am posting a portion of this post as a double since I found 2 different threads to which it would apply.

I am here at Club regina and I am confused. A walk down the beach from the Westin one sees a full building where the Grand Regina is. I can't really tell if it's occupied but I see towels on some Lanai's and umbrellas and staff sweeping around the pool. The Raintree staff also claims it is ready to visit (he lied about some other things too but that's another post).

Is this the property that others have purchased and been told have not been completed? What's the story?? I will try to take some photos to post.

To make sure I am not confused. There is a finished road to the right of the hotel as you drive in with a Grand Regina sign and a security guard (no gate like the Club Regina however). We are in the Club Regina units on one side of the property....then there is the Westin Hotel. These units look different and are on the other side, multi-storied with large Lanai's.

Grand Regina

mindy35 said:

I'm sorry, I am posting a portion of this post as a double since I found 2 different threads to which it would apply.

I am here at Club regina and I am confused. A walk down the beach from the Westin one sees a full building where the Grand Regina is. I can't really tell if it's occupied but I see towels on some Lanai's and umbrellas and staff sweeping around the pool. The Raintree staff also claims it is ready to visit (he lied about some other things too but that's another post).

Is this the property that others have purchased and been told have not been completed? What's the story?? I will try to take some photos to post.

To make sure I am not confused. There is a finished road to the right of the hotel as you drive in with a Grand Regina sign and a security guard (no gate like the Club Regina however). We are in the Club Regina units on one side of the property....then there is the Westin Hotel. These units look different and are on the other side, multi-storied with large Lanai's.

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You are looking at the Private Residences of the Grand Regina. The Villas are not built and will not be.

1. Raintree built Grand Regina - the buildings you see. They are Oceanfront, 2 and 3 bedroom units. They are beautiful inside and out. The pool area is wonderful - had a bar and a restaurant.

2. Started selling Oceanview on the side of the property away from the hotel, abutting the golf course. My business partner bought one pre-construction about 3-4 years ago and waited and waited.

3. Raintree finally sold the new phase to Starwood who put their own name on it. Unfortunately, as you can read elsewhere, they never did anything with it. The lack of new business forced the developer of Grand Regina to close the restaurant. People still have the hotel next door but not as convenient for breakfast and lunch.

4. Starwood finally pulled out due to the credit markets without every building anything. It was turned back to Raintree. My partner is hoping to get his money back but who knows!

so yes - those building exist and can be rented or traded into

Raintree's Offer

Well, my business partner is not a happy camper. Here are the numbers:

1. He paid a total of just over $64,000 for a vacation week. He has two options:

a. $15,000 cash, payable over four years + $49,000 credit to buy something else from Raintree.

b. No cash back and a $64,000 Raintree credit. In this scenario, Raintree will offer him a 40% discount off their normal prices. In addition, he can buy resales at the existing Grand Regina Private Residence Club at a 40% discount. The prices (before the discount) would range from $44,000 for a "value" week in a 2 BR to $99,000 for a Holiday week in a 3 bedroom.

If everything else was equal, taking a 3 BR Holiday week for the same money he was prepared to pay for the 2BR oceanview would be a no-brainer. But there are some serious concerns about the long term stability of GR - they already closed the restaurant and seem to be cutting back on other things.

As I said, he's pretty pissed but there seems to be little he can do except make a decision and move on. Interesting to see what his purchase options are.

Wow. I'm absolutely aghast that Starwood hasn't stepped up to the plate to make him whole. He paid a premium, no doubt because of the Starwood name and reputation, not to mention his ability to trade within SVN. I think they (Starwood) should be working with him and giving him credit and a discount at another SVO location, should that be his preference.

LisaRex said:

He paid a premium, no doubt because of the Starwood name and reputation, not to mention his ability to trade within SVN.

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Didn't he buy before Starwood took over? Or, did I misunderstand?

While I feel bad for the people in this situation, I don't believe Starwood had actually begun sales. In that case, I'm not sure why they would be responsible for people Raintree originally sold to. See posts #55-56 above.

Glorian

I can't figure out why they aren't giving him a complete refund . Obviously he never got what he paid for since the villas were never built. How can they only offer him credit?! Can he sue, or is that too expensive? Isn't there something in a contract that says that whoever sold it to him has to deliver the product or else he gets his money back?

grgs said:

Didn't he buy before Starwood took over? Or, did I misunderstand?

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Ah, if that's the case, then it makes more sense, although I think I remember seeing Cabo on the SVO website so I do believe they were marketing it at some point. Perhaps the folks who contracted with Starwood did get a full refund.

My sense if that:

1. Very hard, if not impossible for one person to sue a Mexican company for not delivering.

2. Class action suits rarely do anything but make a fortune for a law firm. The cash he was offered as part of the first scenario represented about 25% of his cash outlay. I have never seen a situation where a class action suit yielded anything approaching that! Again, I could be wrong here.

3. Raintree knows 1 & 2 very well. They are being totally dishonest. I don't think Starwood has any exposure at all. He was happy when Starwood took it over but he never paid them a penny.

There are talks on a Google Board about suits, etc. Seems to be a bunch of truly aggrieved people just blowing off steam. I think Raintree can be embarrassed - people across the states can speak to the press and get on TV to show how they were duped. After Madoff, seems all TV stations are ready to broadcast the next scandal. But in the end, other than revenge, what do you get since the only good answer may be taking up the offer for a Raintree resort.

Sad, sad, sad...

LisaRex said:

Here's hoping a new resort is on our horizon...

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From some of the posts after yours, it sounds like we'll get your wish (maybe )

This all sounds like a real mess

At my "owners update" at WPORV last month I was told that Cabo is in the network and will be completed soon. When I questioned this and mentioned everything that is going on with the property and advised the sales rep of the info posted on the starwoodvo website he promptly changed the subject.

I think with comments like this continuing Starwood would be exposing themselves to some type of liability and exposure.

We purchased a prime week at the Villas at Grand Regina in 2006 through an exchange with Raintree's Club Regina.
We were angered by the "proposal" for buyback, which was giving us 24% of the cash we paid for the week.
We received an e-mail today from a private residence club member who gave us the name of the attorney they residence club members are using in a class action lawsuit against either/both Raintree and Starwood. Not sure what their complaint is about.
I would love nothing than to get my cash back and want nothing to do with either timeshare organization. When Starwood bought the rights for the villas, we were not thrilled. We had visited the resorts they built in Maui and were not impressed with the price, the units nor the resort (too crowded, too noisy.....). Yet, we were hopeful that the project would be completed. In hindsight, we owners/purchasers should have requested a buyout then since the "project" were purchased was going to be different.
It will be interesting to see how many purchasers of the villas will unite in a lawsuit. (There is a meeting and conference call with owners scheduled for March) It will not be pretty...........

Sorry about your troubles, Bruin. I can completely understand your anger.

The saddest part to me is that these people did absolutely nothing wrong. They purchased into an existing project that was building a new phase. yes, it was preconstruction but the project and its amenities were all standing and functional.

It was a major league screwing. I think my business partner is going to accept the offered deal rather than fight for a few more years. And hell, we've made investment mistakes before. But it certainly stings.

We received another e-mail from Grand Regina "FAQ" stating that their is not enough money to give full refunds to the Villa investors. I wrote back stating that I would accept an offer of some cash up front, with the remaining investment dollars paid back in installments over a period of 5 years. A company the size of Starwood, once the economy is better, should be able to come up with the cash.
We do not plan to "wait around" while Starwood decides if/when the Villas will be built. The development appeared to be in trouble from the start, and with possible litigation from the PRC against RAintree/Starwood, we would rather use our "refund" to purchase something else........

Grand Regina Buy out Sucks!

stevens397 said:

Well, my business partner is not a happy camper. Here are the numbers:

1. He paid a total of just over $64,000 for a vacation week. He has two options:

a. $15,000 cash, payable over four years + $49,000 credit to buy something else from Raintree.

b. No cash back and a $64,000 Raintree credit. In this scenario, Raintree will offer him a 40% discount off their normal prices. In addition, he can buy resales at the existing Grand Regina Private Residence Club at a 40% discount. The prices (before the discount) would range from $44,000 for a "value" week in a 2 BR to $99,000 for a Holiday week in a 3 bedroom.

If everything else was equal, taking a 3 BR Holiday week for the same money he was prepared to pay for the 2BR oceanview would be a no-brainer. But there are some serious concerns about the long term stability of GR - they already closed the restaurant and seem to be cutting back on other things.

As I said, he's pretty pissed but there seems to be little he can do except make a decision and move on. Interesting to see what his purchase options are.

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Join the club. I too bought a villa four years ago and will incur the same loss. I would be happy not to pay maintenance fees for the equivalent value and equal years.

Grand regina

Does anyone know want Starwoods liability is? Did they cancel the sale from Raintree. In the last letter thay say we retain the right to our villa ownership. Is this from Starwoods or Raintree?

Is there a group out there thinking about a lawsuit?

"CR resorts will return an equivalent RVC membership to you" What does equivalent mean?

What options are people taking out there?

Jaydin said:

Does anyone know want Starwoods liability is? Did they cancel the sale from Raintree. In the last letter thay say we retain the right to our villa ownership. Is this from Starwoods or Raintree?

Is there a group out there thinking about a lawsuit?

"CR resorts will return an equivalent RVC membership to you" What does equivalent mean?

What options are people taking out there?

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I don't believe Starwood has any liability because they never concluded the contract. This is totally Raintree. I traded my Club Regina twobedroom prime time and put up cash for one week at the GR villas. I am assuming I will be my two bedroom back and about 25% of my cash.

It is unbelievable that we put our money up front for four years and now we get back 25%. I think the best thing we can do is post as many things on the internet to let others be aware and not buy into Raintree.

Maybe we should have t-shirts made and wear them when we visit stating "We Got Screwed by Raintree" on one side and "Do Not Buy" on the other side.

What happen to the up front money we forked out 4 yrs. ago? Pay us 25% cash and lower our maint. fees 50% for the remaining money owed.

Grand Regina Buy out Sucks!

nanaboat said:

Join the club. I too bought a villa four years ago and will incur the same loss. I would be happy not to pay maintenance fees for the equivalent value and equal years.

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I would not put anymore money into Raintree.