Marriot Point System Conversion

littlestar said:

Yep. That's the same way I feel about all the uncertainty with health care changes, unemployment, and the deficit. Everything is so uncertain now days that I don't need or want one more thing to worry about.

I'm not going to go out and buy anything and feel confident about doing it when everything is up in the air.

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Keep in mind I'm only talking about the uncertainty with the Marriott system and any changes the may or may not happen, not the overall state of the national economy in general. The economy could be great and I still would not buy another Marriott week until the sales staff backs off the rumors and fears or Marriott actually makes whatever changes they plan known to all members/owners. I do not buy based on fear and uncertainty. I buy when I feel the product is sound and on stable ground. Right now, with what's being reported from those attending sales presentations, that's not the case with Marrriott.

You know what is really odd, is the fact I went to a presentation in June at the Surf Club and specifically asked about the points program and my rep had no idea what I was talking about!

The Twilight Zone makes more sense...

Thinking back to July of 2008 and we took a sales tour in Tahoe at the Timber Lodge – the salesrep there was boasting about the, soon to be released, internal Points exchange system – it would be out shortly. Don't even think of buying resale that summer.

I don’t know when the first rumor became part of the Marriott spiel but I’m guessing we are approaching 2 years. 2 years of touting a theoretical system that is devoid of specifics – no idea what the cost will be, no idea what’s in it for the owners and the salesreps. No idea but the idea seems to have taken over Marriott.

You would think that the rumor would become embellished each year – “Buy a Gold week at Summit Watch and stay at a Platinum week during President’s week at the Maui Ocean Club” Oops, that’s not a rumor that’s reality because an exchange company is involved and the insane rules they operate under that we get to exploit.

The salesreps have no idea how much an internal Points exchange system will alter their way of selling – and the impact to Marriott owners. But for some reason Marriott keeps pitching this – it makes no sense at all and it even points out some crazy thinking by upper management.

Personally, I’ve never heard of Marriott losing a sale to the lack of an internal Points exchange system – just what is going on here?

I think if there was a Marriott TS that I realy wanted for use and I found one on the re-sale market for a great price I would buy now. If on the other hand if there was thinking about buying form Marriott in the past there is NO way I would buy from them untill this is all sorted out. I would hate to buy from Marriott, then in a short amount of time have them tell me I needed to pay them thousands more for a new feature that they are giving away to members who buy from them from that point forward. Then on top of that also find out the re-sale value of my week has droped because of this new feature.

Ray

More details???

rsackett said:

I think if there was a Marriott TS that I realy wanted for use and I found one on the re-sale market for a great price I would buy now. If on the other hand if there was thinking about buying form Marriott in the past there is NO way I would buy from them untill this is all sorted out. I would hate to buy from Marriott, then in a short amount of time have them tell me I needed to pay them thousands more for a new feature that they are giving away to members who buy from them from that point forward. Then on top of that also find out the re-sale value of my week has droped because of this new feature.

Ray

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If I had to guess, which I'm doing, the fee to convert a traditional Marriott week will be 10% - 15% of the current sales price. Initially the conversion will be free to new sales but at some point this is pure profit and will be separate. Marriott will dump the cash rebate now offered and offer free enrollment instead. The grace period will be 6 months.

Resales will qualify if they pay the 10% - 15% fee plus a penalty fee of at least 25% or so. This would provide for Marriott making 35% pure profit from a resale.

See how easy it is to rumor....its a lot of fun; probably why Marriott salesreps do it.

Pass this on to your Marriott salesrep so they have more to talk about...

First of all, the current system works marvelous. If you add the quality of Marriott resorts to that, you end up with one the the most desireble systems around.

Marriotts owners get what they want almost everytime with the current system, and in most cases with an upgrade. Who can beat that? A new point system? I don't think so.

From Marriott's point of view, they have to have profits and sell the inventory, sell Crystal Shores and Oceana Palms, resorts that are going to cost a lot more than they should, and nowadays just a few people around to buy them.

I do believe that the best chance they have is to tell the truth (it should always be the best option): show the great resorts they have, the current option to points (which works fine for a lot of people), the easy transfer, easy finace, discount and extra points on the current inventory, etc ... but painting resale as a horrible thing to do will only diminish the value of Marriott's resorts. Resale is an alternative and it will always be there, because of the financial crisis, resales are really cheap weeks now, sometimes bargains, but probably next year we won't see those prices around anymore.

So let's help those sales rep, let's teach them to shown only the great qualities of Marriott resorts, and stop with all those non sense rumors that only diminish what they are selling!! Try to do this next time during a presentation.

Take me to your leader....

ldanna said:

First of all, the current system works marvelous. If you add the quality of Marriott resorts to that, you end up with one the the most desireble systems around.

Marriotts owners get what they want almost everytime with the current system, and in most cases with an upgrade. Who can beat that? A new point system? I don't think so.

From Marriott's point of view, they have to have profits and sell the inventory, sell Crystal Shores and Oceana Palms, resorts that are going to cost a lot more than they should, and nowadays just a few people around to buy them.

I do believe that the best chance they have is to tell the truth (it should always be the best option): show the great resorts they have, the current option to points (which works fine for a lot of people), the easy transfer, easy finace, discount and extra points on the current inventory, etc ... but painting resale as a horrible thing to do will only diminish the value of Marriott's resorts. Resale is an alternative and it will always be there, because of the financial crisis, resales are really cheap weeks now, sometimes bargains, but probably next year we won't see those prices around anymore.

So let's help those sales rep, let's teach them to shown only the great qualities of Marriott resorts, and stop with all those non sense rumors that only diminish what they are selling!! Try to do this next time during a presentation.

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I did my part, at the last sales presentation I told the salesrep that this was a stupid rumor for him to spread. I'm not a bashful kind of guy and told him we would not buy another Marriott until a) Marriott sent a letter denying the rumor or b) sent a letter explained the new system and its implications to buying before the damn thing was released.

My salesrep informed me that this was not the first time he had burning ears from spreading the rumor but he was instructed to spread the rumor by management.

It's almost as if an alien has taken over Marriott hell bent on destroying it's host.

PerryM said:

It's almost as if an alien has taken over Marriott hell bent on destroying it's host.

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It's called a virus!

Perry- if you look at the Asia Pacific program, and the cost to convert to points there, for most owners it was more than 10-15%. Phuket owners, even Gold week owners of a property costing in the area of 20k, were being charged $5000 to convert. Adding insult to injury, they'd be hard pressed to get a week in a studio in Hawaii on exchange.

m61376 said:

Perry- if you look at the Asia Pacific program, and the cost to convert to points there, for most owners it was more than 10-15%. Phuket owners, even Gold week owners of a property costing in the area of 20k, were being charged $5000 to convert. Adding insult to injury, they'd be hard pressed to get a week in a studio in Hawaii on exchange.

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If Marriott foists this unneeded system on hundreds of thousands of Marriott owners when our country is being flushed down the toilet then Marriott deserves what is about to blow-back from that toilet in their face.

This is what's so insane about Marriott keeping the rumor going - this is THE worst time to do this - I can't think of a worst time to do this.

For this very reason I don't believe they will introduce such a crazy scheme until real estate recovers and makes new highs from 3 years ago. I can't see that happening for 5-7 years at least.

Now if Marriott were to merge their timeshare division with their Destination Club division that's a totally different concept and worthy of study.

I agree with Perry. It's pretty dumb for sales reps to talk about a program they can't sell now. They are ensuring that you will not buy something that day. So, they probably only bring it up when they have decided you aren't buying anything. It's dangerous for sales to do this because it's almost like punting on 3rd down. They still haven't exhausted all options for selling you when they introduce it. I don't know many NFL coaches who give the QB the options to punt the ball on 3rd down when they are in the shot gun formation. That is in essence what Marriott is doing by introducing a subject that isn't ready for prime time.

Also, if Marriott is going down the $4250 conversion path, they are just doing what every other developer has done when changing to a point system. They offer a conversion program. You either pay a conversion fee or you buy more points to convert your week into points. It depends on how they structure the program. Will they preserve the concept of a deeded week? Or, will they just sell UDI points?

Given the approach that appears to be manifesting itself, I wouldn't be converned about it at all if I am a Marriott floating week owner. They aren't going to eliminate II. That would be foolish. So, owners will continue to operate as they are until the convert.

This will likely impact the sales at the resorts as all new inventory will be in the point system. So, to access new resorts, you will need some points. And, as Marriott buys back units to resell as points, we will start losing some inventory. But, as we all know, Marriott isn't buying back much today.

The average point program takes 7-10 years before there is any noticable change to the floating week owners as owners balk at the conversion fee.

But, on the other hand, this creates an opportunity to load up and convert to points. That is what we should be looking at on TUG. What is the loophole that Marriott will create that we can exploit? This should be very fun.

Why not.....

If a Point exchange system is so great why don't we Marriott owners ban together and just start our own?

Marriott has been dangling this in front of us for 2+ years now - why can't someone else just do the same thing?

I don't believe there is anything to stop folks from doing this and a $99 initiation fee would easily pay to start the system. The system would be transferable in a resale. $99 per trade should work just fine.

Oh I'm sure there are some hurdles but Marriott owners are probably free to do this since we would then reserve our weeks, as now, and deposit them into this new system just as if it were II.

Why II doesn't offer this is beyond me. Hell, RedWeek is already doing this same thing and it doesn't cost thousands of dollars to join. Talk about a gold mine....

I really wonder how many sales this rumor has truly cost Marriott. I bet very few. The sales people usually bring it up at a point when they are almost 100% sure that the person they are selling to won't be buying.

For those who indicate you wouldn't buy based on this rumor, what is the chance you would buy direct from Marriott anyway void of the rumor, probably about 5%? I am sure when Perry went on his recent tour he certainly wasn't going to be buying and wasn't convinced to buy at any time before the rumor was brought up by the sales person. The rumor certainly didn't cause the loss of a sale.

The sales staff isn't saying this to try and score a sale, they just do it to see what kind of reaction they get. They know the sale is already lost, so they figure they will have some fun too. They don't want the ole wise person taking the tour to have all the fun talking up resale.