[Q/A merged] At Grand Vista now might ask "point man" questions. Do you have any?

Well we are finishing up 2 weeks in a 3 and then 2 bedroom with our AC's from Aruba Surf. They have a short meeting you can go to to ask about points. I have been reading the past few months and trying to understand. We have a resale Oceanside (bought several years ago) and at this point expect to keep it and hope II will still have inventory. We were able to trade to Hawaii July 4th 2009 and got Marbella this June and a last minute AC in Andulucia. Since we primarily bought to use we will stay as is.

Anyone have any questions for us to ask if we can set a time to meet with the sales rep??

Sue

Not sure what else could be asked that hasn't already been asked. And if it is asked again, there is no guaranty that the correct or same answer would be provided.

Points Cost For One Week

I've raised a question in several threads and haven't received any response. My question is will the cost for a resort week remain the same forever?

For example, if I buy 7400 points, which is the points needed for one week OF in MOC Lahaina Tower, will my points always equal what it costs for that OF unit?

Said another way, if anyone buys enough points to stay one week at a favorite resort is there any gurantee that the points purchased will always be equal to that week? Or is Marriott free to increase the cost for a week, thus requiring the future purchase of additional points for the same week at the same resort?

Ask why anyone would buy into the points program if the points program does not transfer to a potential buyer (if you had to resell)?

It is like buying a BMW 5-series and when and if you had to sell it, it would carry the value of a Chevy Cobalt.

This does not make financial sense.

Lawlar said:

I've raised a question in several threads and haven't received any response. My question is will the cost for a resort week remain the same forever?

For example, if I buy 7400 points, which is the points needed for one week OF in MOC Lahaina Tower, will my points always equal what it costs for that OF unit?

Said another way, if anyone buys enough points to stay one week at a favorite resort is there any gurantee that the points purchased will always be equal to that week? Or is Marriott free to increase the cost for a week, thus requiring the future purchase of additional points for the same week at the same resort?

Click to expand...

It's my understanding that while they can raise or lower the points required in any given week the total points allotted to that resort have to remain the same. If they want to raise prices they just charge more for the points to a new buyer or raise the MF to all points owners.

Hyatt just did something like this at their Carmel resort. They doubled the amount of points required to stay there and also doubled the amount of points to each owner at Carmel. It was a great deal for the owners of Carmel but not so good if you owned at another of their resorts and wanted to trade into Carmel.

I don't know enough about the legalities of Marriott's system to know if they could do this or not down the road.

jimf41 said:

It's my understanding that while they can raise or lower the points required in any given week the total points allotted to that resort have to remain the same. If they want to raise prices they just charge more for the points to a new buyer or raise the MF to all points owners.

Hyatt just did something like this at their Carmel resort. They doubled the amount of points required to stay there and also doubled the amount of points to each owner at Carmel. It was a great deal for the owners of Carmel but not so good if you owned at another of their resorts and wanted to trade into Carmel.

I don't know enough about the legalities of Marriott's system to know if they could do this or not down the road.

Click to expand...

While that's the way Disney works, Marriott eoes not have this in writing ANYWHERE to the best of my knowledge. Since I have lost all trust and respect for Marriott as a result of this new program, I would like to see this in writing somewhere before we make any assumptions. If it's not in writing, Marriott can raise points as much as they want as often as they want whenever they want - considering Marriott's new "Greed first, Customer Second" policy, I'm sure they will raise points in a heartbeat if owners have no protection in writing!

Best wishes,
David

I have listed the questions but the one I have that I am not really clear on is what the points represent. Is Marriott selling points tied to a specific resort? Or just points in general? Does each resort have a max of points that can be sold (like there are a max number of weeks sold) or can they sell an infinite number of points one has to find a resort for.

Will see what the sales people say. I will try to stay clam and listen. Sales people are not my favorite group to interact with...

Good Luck

rosepointe said:

Will see what the sales people say. I will try to stay clam and listen. Sales people are not my favorite group to interact with...

Click to expand...

Good Luck. And leave your checkbook and credit cards in your room - Don't bring them to the sales presentation!!!

Lawlar said:

Good Luck. And leave your checkbook and credit cards in your room - Don't bring them to the sales presentation!!!

Click to expand...

I never have money on hand....also see no benefit for us in the points just trying to understand more. I grew up with salesman and know how to stear clear. Luckily I married a philosopher....

Really curious about what spin we will get. My husband would rather be at the pool.

Well our sales rep was a lovely women who is convinced this is the best system ever. I don't think the answers given are correct but if they are or were it might be a good system. I am doubtful for the moment.

I will highlight the posted question and provide the best answer I got...which did not always make sense to me.

Sue

Asia2000 said:

Ask why anyone would buy into the points program if the points program does not transfer to a potential buyer (if you had to resell)?

It is like buying a BMW 5-series and when and if you had to sell it, it would carry the value of a Chevy Cobalt.

This does not make financial sense.

Click to expand...

I was told that you can sell your points and transfer them to someone else. The rep stated that one still has a deed with "beneficiary interest."

On the other hand she did state that Marriott has no program at this time to buy points back however it is still a deed as stated above and you can sell it.

I asked where this is written and we did not get an answer.

I tried to understand (we both hold post graduate degrees...a philosopher and a therapist) and was more confused when we left than when we walked in.

Sue

Lawlar said:

I've raised a question in several threads and haven't received any response. My question is will the cost for a resort week remain the same forever?

For example, if I buy 7400 points, which is the points needed for one week OF in MOC Lahaina Tower, will my points always equal what it costs for that OF unit?

Said another way, if anyone buys enough points to stay one week at a favorite resort is there any gurantee that the points purchased will always be equal to that week? Or is Marriott free to increase the cost for a week, thus requiring the future purchase of additional points for the same week at the same resort?

Click to expand...

Oh this one was even more complicated to answer.

I think we were told if you own more than 6500 points one has VIP status. And that only 3% of people will have that. She said that while the points to get a unit might in fact rise (as I suspect it might in the summer months at the Aruba Surf Club) you would still get the unit for what you originally were told you would but new point people buying into the system would not. One is buying points and not into a specific property.

However if one has less than that number of points they would not be in a VIP status. Points required for a stay will probably be adjusted at all places as time goes by (we suspect.)

On the other hand she stated that we could join the point system today for $585 and still book our Surf Club Unit as we always did as though we are doing our one week thing as we do now. She said we would also be able to trade so much easier because Marriott will not give the inventory to II.

This makes no sense to me whatsoever. So we decided to go to the pool.

Basically she said there are 3 things that could happen

1-Book the unit you originally bought as you do now.

2-Exchange your unit as you do now as we do through Interval but only through their new Marriott Interval (neither of these involve points).

3-Use the points you have for that year to book anyplace through Marriott's destination program as long as you have enough points.

Financial Information...to join the program would cost us $585 onetime fee for life to register our property...there would be an annual fee of $165 that would cover membership, interval and the Marriott exchange company. The 165 covers all exchange fees as well as the membership fees to interval. The current maintenance remain the same and may be raised. One can buy additional points for $9.20 per point (1000min.)

Land Trust (not certain we got this)
Finally she said that either by joining the program or buying additional points you are participating in the Land Trust which involves all of Marriott's "unsold" property. Which she claims will give you many more opportunities.

I still have no idea where the inventory of rooms are coming from if they are not selling specific weeks at properties and wonder if we will be able to secure reservations as easy as they say. My impression was that Marriott does not need or want Interval to exist and eventually everyone will have to join the point system.

Just sharing all this info for others to compare. I will remain as we are and watch as it all unfolds before we do anything. Our oceanside unit at the Surf Club has already been devalued in Marriott's system. They have clustered the OV and OS units as one even though we paid a premium for an oceanside building.

Balloons and banners all read:
NEW DAY NEW DREAMS...............................


Sue

Responses from our meeting with a Representative at Grand Vista Today

Here are some notes you can compare from our meeting today with the Marriott Rep regarding the point program. I have included some questions that were asked by others before we met.
If this is a duplication feel free to delete.
Sue
.............................................

Well our sales rep was a lovely women who is convinced this is the best system ever. I don't think the answers given are correct but if they are or were it might be a good system. I am doubtful for the moment.

I will highlight the posted question and provide the best answer I got...which did not always make sense to me.
......................
Question #1
I've raised a question in several threads and haven't received any response. My question is will the cost for a resort week remain the same forever?

For example, if I buy 7400 points, which is the points needed for one week OF in MOC Lahaina Tower, will my points always equal what it costs for that OF unit?

Said another way, if anyone buys enough points to stay one week at a favorite resort is there any gurantee that the points purchased will always be equal to that week? Or is Marriott free to increase the cost for a week, thus requiring the future purchase of additional points for the same week at the same resort?

Response from me:
Oh this one was even more complicated to answer.

I think we were told if you own more than 6500 points one has VIP status. And that only 3% of people will have that. She said that while the points to get a unit might in fact rise (as I suspect it might in the summer months at the Aruba Surf Club) you would still get the unit for what you originally were told you would but new point people buying into the system would not. One is buying points and not into a specific property.

However if one has less than that number of points they would not be in a VIP status. Points required for a stay will probably be adjusted at all places as time goes by (we suspect.)

On the other hand she stated that we could join the point system today for $585 and still book our Surf Club Unit as we always did as though we are doing our one week thing as we do now. She said we would also be able to trade so much easier because Marriott will not give the inventory to II.

This makes no sense to me whatsoever. So we decided to go to the pool.

Basically she said there are 3 things that could happen

1-Book the unit you originally bought as you do now.

2-Exchange your unit as you do now as we do through Interval but only through their new Marriott Interval (neither of these involve points).

3-Use the points you have for that year to book anyplace through Marriott's destination program as long as you have enough points.

Financial Information...to join the program would cost us $585 onetime fee for life to register our property...there would be an annual fee of $165 that would cover membership, interval and the Marriott exchange company. The 165 covers all exchange fees as well as the membership fees to interval. The current maintenance remain the same and may be raised. One can buy additional points for $9.20 per point (1000min.)

Land Trust (not certain we got this)
Finally she said that either by joining the program or buying additional points you are participating in the Land Trust which involves all of Marriott's "unsold" property. Which she claims will give you many more opportunities.

I still have no idea where the inventory of rooms are coming from if they are not selling specific weeks at properties and wonder if we will be able to secure reservations as easy as they say. My impression was that Marriott does not need or want Interval to exist and eventually everyone will have to join the point system.

Just sharing all this info for others to compare. I will remain as we are and watch as it all unfolds before we do anything. Our oceanside unit at the Surf Club has already been devalued in Marriott's system. They have clustered the OV and OS units as one even though we paid a premium for an oceanside building.

Balloons and banners all read:
NEW DAY NEW DREAMS...............................


Sue
................................................................................
Question #2
Ask why anyone would buy into the points program if the points program does not transfer to a potential buyer (if you had to resell)?

It is like buying a BMW 5-series and when and if you had to sell it, it would carry the value of a Chevy Cobalt.

This does not make financial sense.

Answer:
I was told that you can sell your points and transfer them to someone else. The rep stated that one still has a deed with "beneficiary interest."

On the other hand she did state that Marriott has no program at this time to buy points back however it is still a deed as stated above and you can sell it.

I asked where this is written and we did not get an answer.

I tried to understand (we both hold post graduate degrees...a philosopher and a therapist) and was more confused when we left than when we walked in.

Sue

rosepointe said:

She said we would also be able to trade so much easier because Marriott will not give the inventory to II.

Click to expand...

Gotta love the consistency of this scare tactic. I guess we call it FUD these days?

rosepointe said:

This makes no sense to me whatsoever. So we decided to go to the pool.

Click to expand...

Great choice!

Great Effort!

Rosepoint: Thank you for asking my question and bravely trying to understand Marriott's response [and good for you for not buying into the scam].

The bottom line seems to be that Marriott will gradually drain the best weeks out of the current system and put them into a trust for the suckers who they con into buying points. Then they will increase the amount of points that it will take to acquire the weeks taken from the current system.

And during this whole process Marriott will continue to increase our MFs that they charge us for Marriott to operate "our ownership interest." Never mind that the MFs often approach the rental value of our TSs.

What a great system. I think its called a ponzi scheme.

rosepointe said:

................................................................................
Question #2
Ask why anyone would buy into the points program if the points program does not transfer to a potential buyer (if you had to resell)?

It is like buying a BMW 5-series and when and if you had to sell it, it would carry the value of a Chevy Cobalt.

This does not make financial sense.

Answer:
I was told that you can sell your points and transfer them to someone else. The rep stated that one still has a deed with "beneficiary interest."

On the other hand she did state that Marriott has no program at this time to buy points back however it is still a deed as stated above and you can sell it.

I asked where this is written and we did not get an answer.

I tried to understand (we both hold post graduate degrees...a philosopher and a therapist) and was more confused when we left than when we walked in.

Sue

Click to expand...

Thank you for asking this. Clarity on this issue has been poor since the launch and continues to be so. If it is not important for Marriott, they must not think it is important for potential buyers and tranferees into the Destinations Program.

Enjoy your stay.

rosepointe said:

Here are some notes you can compare from our meeting today with the Marriott Rep regarding the point program. I have included some questions that were asked by others before we met.
If this is a duplication feel free to delete.
Sue
.............................................

Well our sales rep was a lovely women who is convinced this is the best system ever. I don't think the answers given are correct but if they are or were it might be a good system. I am doubtful for the moment.

I will highlight the posted question and provide the best answer I got...which did not always make sense to me.
......................
Question #1
I've raised a question in several threads and haven't received any response. My question is will the cost for a resort week remain the same forever?

For example, if I buy 7400 points, which is the points needed for one week OF in MOC Lahaina Tower, will my points always equal what it costs for that OF unit?

Said another way, if anyone buys enough points to stay one week at a favorite resort is there any gurantee that the points purchased will always be equal to that week? Or is Marriott free to increase the cost for a week, thus requiring the future purchase of additional points for the same week at the same resort?

Response from me:
Oh this one was even more complicated to answer.

I think we were told if you own more than 6500 points one has VIP status. And that only 3% of people will have that. She said that while the points to get a unit might in fact rise (as I suspect it might in the summer months at the Aruba Surf Club) you would still get the unit for what you originally were told you would but new point people buying into the system would not. One is buying points and not into a specific property.

Click to expand...

6500 points is only good for Premier status. That will account for the top point owners that own at most 20% of the total points. So not sure where the 3% came from. Perhaps referring to Premier plus owners that will be the highest point owners that own 5% of the points.

However if one has less than that number of points they would not be in a VIP status. Points required for a stay will probably be adjusted at all places as time goes by (we suspect.)

Click to expand...

There is no way they will keep seperate points charts and points offering for different level of owners. "VIP" won't be treated any differently on how many points they are given for their week or how much it costs to exchange in to a resort.

On the other hand she stated that we could join the point system today for $585 and still book our Surf Club Unit as we always did as though we are doing our one week thing as we do now. She said we would also be able to trade so much easier because Marriott will not give the inventory to II.

Click to expand...

It is actually harder to trade, because you need more points to make the trade. I am still skeptical that there will be less availability in II.

This makes no sense to me whatsoever. So we decided to go to the pool.

Basically she said there are 3 things that could happen

1-Book the unit you originally bought as you do now.

2-Exchange your unit as you do now as we do through Interval but only through their new Marriott Interval (neither of these involve points).

3-Use the points you have for that year to book anyplace through Marriott's destination program as long as you have enough points.

Financial Information...to join the program would cost us $585 onetime fee for life to register our property...there would be an annual fee of $165 that would cover membership, interval and the Marriott exchange company. The 165 covers all exchange fees as well as the membership fees to interval. The current maintenance remain the same and may be raised. One can buy additional points for $9.20 per point (1000min.)

Land Trust (not certain we got this)
Finally she said that either by joining the program or buying additional points you are participating in the Land Trust which involves all of Marriott's "unsold" property. Which she claims will give you many more opportunities.

I still have no idea where the inventory of rooms are coming from if they are not selling specific weeks at properties and wonder if we will be able to secure reservations as easy as they say. My impression was that Marriott does not need or want Interval to exist and eventually everyone will have to join the point system.

Just sharing all this info for others to compare. I will remain as we are and watch as it all unfolds before we do anything. Our oceanside unit at the Surf Club has already been devalued in Marriott's system. They have clustered the OV and OS units as one even though we paid a premium for an oceanside building.

Balloons and banners all read:
NEW DAY NEW DREAMS...............................


Sue
................................................................................
Question #2
Ask why anyone would buy into the points program if the points program does not transfer to a potential buyer (if you had to resell)?

It is like buying a BMW 5-series and when and if you had to sell it, it would carry the value of a Chevy Cobalt.

This does not make financial sense.

Answer:
I was told that you can sell your points and transfer them to someone else. The rep stated that one still has a deed with "beneficiary interest."

On the other hand she did state that Marriott has no program at this time to buy points back however it is still a deed as stated above and you can sell it.

I asked where this is written and we did not get an answer.

I tried to understand (we both hold post graduate degrees...a philosopher and a therapist) and was more confused when we left than when we walked in.

Sue

Click to expand...

dioxide45 said:

6500 points is only good for Premier status. That will account for the top point owners that own at most 20% of the total points. So not sure where the 3% came from. Perhaps referring to Premier plus owners that will be the highest point owners that own 5% of the points.



There is no way they will keep seperate points charts and points offering for different level of owners. "VIP" won't be treated any differently on how many points they are given for their week or how much it costs to exchange in to a resort.



It is actually harder to trade, because you need more points to make the trade. I am still skeptical that there will be less availability in II.

Click to expand...

I am also suspecting II will still have inventory at least for the next 5 years or so.

The really sad thing for me is I think the rep was really trying to explain things and could not....

Now that my husband is retiring after 39 years at PSU we do not need high weeks for a change so I will stay with my resold week at the Aruba Surf (Oceanside.)

BTW thank you all. I did find TUG before we bought and read day and night before we made an offer. This was 5 or 6 years ago.
Sue