free Harborside at Atlantis weeks

There is someone on Redweek that just posted two one bedrooms silver seasons for free. Just need to pay the closing costs and 2010 MF's for your use this year.
The deluxe is only good for someone that doesn't have school aged kids and wants to travel to this resort each year and not have to pay rental prices.........no value at all beyond that b/c silver doesn't rent as well, and would only barely rent for more then the MF's no big profit.
The premium onebedroom is a steal! If I didn't have little kids I would take it myself, but it will be so many years before I could use weeks 35-46. That one rents for about $700 a year more then the MF's. You just have to want to go to Harborside on the years it doesn't rent b/c it is a waste to deposit harborside in II b/c you can get the exact same trades with a much less expensive MF week. But I guess that is still an OK back up plan?? I already own in gold season, so don't have much need for these, but thought someone else retired might like them.
They are in phase I and weeks 42, and 43 and you can use them back to back and stay for 2 weeks a year, or he said lots of times he combined them to use as a 2 bedroom lock off instead. You just have to request this thru starwood and it is based on availability, but not a very difficult request to meet.

Wow, I sympathize with this seller. Just looked at their offer and am trying to think of someone I know who would use this week. It's about $2k for closing in the Bahamas, isn't it?

closing costs

closing costs are around $1500-1700ish. Depending on who does it.

wish they'd post on TUG bargains or TS4MS freebies section...

zcrider said:

There is someone on Redweek that just posted two one bedrooms silver seasons for free.

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Not surprising. With the MFs they are charging, why would anyone lock themselves into a contract with Starwood, who has shown that they can and will increase MFs every year to ridiculously high, unsustainable levels. Just because you can rent the unit out for $700 more than MFs TODAY doesn't mean that in two years that will be the case.

Too risky. If I really wanted to go to HRA, I'd rent.

LisaRex said:

Too risky. If I really wanted to go to HRA, I'd rent.

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I agree. Especially with the closing costs so high.

Ownership would still be an option for someone who went every year (or almost every year), but I wouldn't want to lock myself into silver season.

true but still value

That is true for a lot of people, but there is still value as the rent seems to go up with the MF's and they still rent for MF's or more even in silver which is obviously the worst season. And I say if they cover their own expense in an economy like this then they have value!!!! That is more then most of timeshares out there. I looked at all starwood properties before I bought Harborside (gold) and the reason I picked Harborside was b/c they DO rent. Other posters put up of rent the same price as the MF and still no one bites, so you are stuck with the MF no matter what. At harborside plenty of people bite and will pay more then MF to go, so worst case you rent for only your MF, but someone will almost always rent for that, so that said........you get a great location when you want to use it, and it pays for itself when you don't. If I were childless or retired I would take these for sure! I just already own gold and have young kids so it will be many years before I could ever use a silver week. I have no reason to buy JUST to own a rental. I would want to be able to use it sometimes too.
Someone who likes the Bahamas will have a woderful time with these weeks b/c they say May and Nov. are the best times to go to the Bahamas to avoid hurricane season and crowds and these silver do cover the first half of Nov.
Gold season gives you May and second half of Nov. as well as summer, that is why I picked gold so I could use what I bought, but harborside is one of the few places that silver season still has some value.
It is true MF's go up about $100 per year, I was told to expect that when I bought, so if you go into it knowing that then it isn't such a shocker to you.

Hello,

Could this have some value to someone trying to do an upgrade and retro, who also wants to own at Harbourside? It seems to me if you were considering a developer purchase there, this might be a good trade in.

Just a thought,

Michael

Well, the reality is that Harborside in silver (the new "gold plus", ie Fall) season is readily available via StarOption exchange, at least whenever I call. So even though this is a "free" unit, if you only want a 1-bed premium for a week it's just 44,000 SOs. Assuming this seller has two deeds, which it sounds like though I wouldn't be surprised if it's really a 2-bed, it would be less expensive to simply buy a resale WKV 1-bed deluxe platinum (with 67k SOs) and use that to exchange. The annual MF would be half that of Harborside and quickly justify the initial purchase price (compared to "free" + closing in the Bahamas). And, you'd be able to stay for 11 nights with 67k as well.

So I agree that owning at Harborside for this season doesn't make sense to me even if free.

This is really an interesting example of how rising fees can destroy the value of a great timeshare. And if off-season weeks become so undesirable that educated TUGGERS can make a case for not taking one free, that tells me there's a big, big risk of many off-season weeks going into default and driving the fees even higher.

ondeadlin said:

This is really an interesting example of how rising fees can destroy the value of a great timeshare. And if off-season weeks become so undesirable that educated TUGGERS can make a case for not taking one free, that tells me there's a big, big risk of many off-season weeks going into default and driving the fees even higher.

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High maintenance fees + Low season.

James1975NY said:

High maintenance fees + Low season.

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Doesn't Starwood get it?

Ken555 said:

Well, the reality is that Harborside in silver (the new "gold plus", ie Fall) season is readily available via StarOption exchange, at least whenever I call. So even though this is a "free" unit, if you only want a 1-bed premium for a week it's just 51,700 SOs.

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Actually, 1BR premium, silver season is 44,000 SO.
With extremely high closing cost, maybe new owner should help closing cost when they sell these units again.

RLOGO said:

Doesn't Starwood get it?

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No, unfortunately.

yumdrey said:

Actually, 1BR premium, silver season is 44,000 SO.
With extremely high closing cost, maybe new owner should help closing cost when they sell these units again.

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Sorry, you're absolutely right. Make that 11 nights for the 67k!

Ken555 said:

it would be less expensive to simply buy a resale WKV 1-bed deluxe platinum (with 67k SOs) and use that to exchange. The annual MF would be half that of Harborside and quickly justify the initial purchase price (compared to "free" + closing in the Bahamas). And, you'd be able to stay for 11 nights with 67k as well.

So I agree that owning at Harborside for this season doesn't make sense to me even if free.

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Interesting. What are WKV 1-bed deluxe platinum (with 67k SOs) pricing out at nowaday's with closing?

It is already sold.
I had seen the post and someone on there said they would buy it and to post his info--redweek deleted it because they don't allow that I guess--yesterday he posted he had listed it and when I checked today it was already sold.

they are gone

these weeks are gone for now. He has someone he is working with (a Tugger) and a backup picked out all ready.
I have not looked up the resale value of Westin Hawaii in the last few months, but I think a one bedroom premium there last time I looked has about the same MF's as Harborside one bed premium($1372-$1550 depending on phase one or two). There was very little difference in MF's when I was shopping to buy, and although you see lots of availability within starwood internally for silver. I can still get a two bedroom at your Westin for a one bedroom (small) at Harborside by going thru II. (This is not necessarily the least expensive way to get there as worldmark can pull it with just 10K points also!!!) But with the Starwood priority now I can get a 2 bedroom during summer months in Westin Kannapali with request first and that is about equal to Hawaii getting silver season interal trade for 11 nights at Harborside.??. Both are great trades really!!!!
It is all about how you work what you own and for people living on the east coast or Texas areas the Bahamas are much closer and cheaper to fly to. So for some that works better to own something you will actually want to travel to most of the time. And Harborside rents for more then MF........Hawaii does not (often.....sometimes it does, but I see LOTS of weeks go by unrented). I was mainly trying to pick between Hawaii and Bahamas when I was looking. The selling factor was #1 Harborside has NO competition, so if you want to go to Atlantis resort in a nice timeshare.........nobody else owns rights there. That keeps demand high. Hawii has several nice resorts to pick from. Hawaii has more star options, but my friend owns there and can't ever get harborside or st. johns in summer time thru starwood trade, and if you can't use it, and the economy is in the dumps and lots of poeple (2008-2009) are not traveling as much.......I saw tons more Hawaii sitting unrented then Harborside. I want to know that in hard times my timeshare will pay for itself. Also if I want to go to a nice Maui resort I have several to pick from and I can get there easily any time of year owning Harborside.
There are reasons to own either one. Both are fantastic resorts and both trade well. If I lived on the west coast I might would have leaned more toward Hawaii as a flight time/cost factor, but as for paying for itself I have not seen a timeshare yet better then Harborside (except maybe ski resorts.....but I am not that interested in the snow, so I never looked there). DVC rents very well, but the RTU would keep me from buying there.
I bought a three bedroom gold phase II and my MF for 2010 were 2550 +185 (fee of some kind) for a total of $2,735. I can easily rent that small one bedroom for 2K or a little more and then for about $700 my family gets to use the two bedroom at Harborside each year. I don't mind my MF's all that much, b/c my Harborside pays for itself almost. If it doesn't rent one year I will not sweat it b/c I will just deposit the small lock off last min. with no penality (new rules) and then grab me a westin hawaii two bedroom thru II. Then for my same $2735 MF I get a two bedroom at Harborside in summer and a two bedroom in Hawaii any time of year (all are platinum anyway)..........still not bad!

Silver in any resort is not as desirable, but for free.........come on! I would take it in a heartbeat if I could have used it!!! But I don't want to own something just to be a landlord over it. I am glad someone from TUG is getting these weeks from the giver of them. They still do have SOME value if you know how to work what you own!

zcrider said:

I have not looked up the resale value of Westin Hawaii in the last few months, but I think a one bedroom premium there last time I looked has about the same MF's as Harborside one bed premium($1372-$1550 depending on phase one or two).

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I'm not sure exactly whom you are responding to, but I believe parts were to my posts. I was referencing Westin Kierland (WKV) not Ka'anapali. Kierland MFs are the least per SO in Starwood.

* WKV 2-bed annual MF is $1237.30 for 2010 not counting SVN fee (small 1-bd dlx is less than half that amount, which includes 67k SOs for platinum season).

Ahhhhhhhh my bad

Yep, I got it wrong and thought you were talking about Ka'anapoli. That is a good thing you have going on in AZ there and for a mandatory resort too!!!!!! I looked back at the notes I made while looking at SVO resorts and the reason I didn't pick that one was b/c summer is too hot and off season! Having little kids makes any other time of year more challanging to travel in and Christmas in AZ just doesn't sound as fun. But I think you are exactly right and you probably get the most bang for your SO buck! Good to know for future reference. Have you compared all Starwood resorts MF to star option values?
I never looked at that break down just looked at where we wanted to travel and when and which one was mandatory/voluntary and which ones rented good verse which ones don't. I noted that AZ seemed to rent to cover MF's back when I was looking, so double good for you.
Thanks for clarifying that for me and you have a good point there.

This smells like a clever way of 'giving back' the unit.

At a price of zero, I'm sure Starwood will exercise its ROFR. So the seller gets out of MFs for the year. And Starwood gets another unit to re-sell to someone not informed enough to know that they'll never be able to swap for peak seasons.

komosatp said:

This smells like a clever way of 'giving back' the unit.

At a price of zero, I'm sure Starwood will exercise its ROFR. So the seller gets out of MFs for the year. And Starwood gets another unit to re-sell to someone not informed enough to know that they'll never be able to swap for peak seasons.

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There is no ROFR.

sjuhawk_jd said:

There is no ROFR.

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Technically, there is ROFR at some Starwood resorts, but Starwood has seldom exercised it. This info. is from James1975NY who is a former SW employee (for future reference, it's listed in the Owner Resources sticky, too.)

The following have ROFR (No additional Fee)
Mission Hills

Ka’anapali

Ka’anapali North

Princeville

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sjuhawk_jd said:

There is no ROFR.

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Sorry...all the pitches I've gone through blend together.