Marriott [Rewards] Points

My understanding is that if you do not get Marriott points if you buy a Marriott TS from a third party. Assuming I am correct - Is it worth giving up the points for a lower priced TS? And what else could I be losing by purchasing a TS with third party for this system?

Am I right in thinking Marriott is the only one who gives a third party purchaser no points?

Are you asking about Marriott hotel pts (MR pts) ??

If so YES Only developer bought TS weeks can be turned in for hotel pts BUT it is almost always a very bad deal. Anyone can go to the marriott website and buy MR pts $625/50,000 pts ( or a couple 100,000 pts for $1250) BUT to get pts for your TS week you must pay the MFs (often more than $1000 and pay a fee ~$150) and lose the use of your TS for the same 100,000 MR pts

So the Marriott Rewards points are not seeming like a big deal. Do you know of other things that I could lose when purchasing from a third party? Thank you.

You can have the MR points option purchasing from a third party if you use Marriott as the broker. You might think you are buying from Marriott when you purchase from their resale department but it's really a third party. Marriott does not sell weeks and only acts as the broker between the seller and the buyer.

Buy a timeshare for the timeshare and not the so-called "perks" that you don't even know about. Any unknown perks are not worth knowing. Points are a horrible conversion. They used to be great but those days are long gone after devaluation both from the increased maintenance fees and the points themselves. The are probably not even worth 10% of what they were 12-15 years ago when most of the weeks were sold at development.

akdrc said:

My understanding is that if you do not get Marriott points if you buy a Marriott TS from a third party. Assuming I am correct - Is it worth giving up the points for a lower priced TS? And what else could I be losing by purchasing a TS with third party for this system?

Am I right in thinking Marriott is the only one who gives a third party purchaser no points?

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Are you asking about the Rewards Points that the other answers above refer too (i.e. exchanging your week for Marriott Hotels Rewards points that can be redeemed for Marriott hotel stays, travel packages, etc.)? Or, are you asking about Destination Club points that can be used to book flexible timeshare stays within the Marriott Vacation Club network? They are two different things.

Neither Rewards Points or Destination Club Points come with a resale week purchase, but you can buy Destination Club Points on the resale market.

JIMinNC said:

Are you asking about the Rewards Points that the other answers above refer too (i.e. exchanging your week for Marriott Hotels Rewards points that can be redeemed for Marriott hotel stays, travel packages, etc.)? Or, are you asking about Destination Club points that can be used to book flexible timeshare stays within the Marriott Vacation Club network? They are two different things.

Neither Rewards Points or Destination Club Points come with a resale week purchase, but you can buy Destination Club Points on the resale market.

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I don't yet know what the different points are. I was asking about Rewards points, but what I probably really meant was the Destination Club Points. I would guess that in the absence of either I would just exchange or rent a unit out if I wanted to do something different one year.

Other systems seem to allow you to get Club type points when you purchase a TS through a third party, Marriott does not. I would like to have both, but I think I would rather have the deed than points if I choose to go with Marriott.

As a NewB, am I thinking this right?

Saintsfanfl said:

You can have the MR points option purchasing from a third party if you use Marriott as the broker. You might think you are buying from Marriott when you purchase from their resale department but it's really a third party. Marriott does not sell weeks and only acts as the broker between the seller and the buyer.

Buy a timeshare for the timeshare and not the so-called "perks" that you don't even know about. Any unknown perks are not worth knowing. Points are a horrible conversion. They used to be great but those days are long gone after devaluation both from the increased maintenance fees and the points themselves. The are probably not even worth 10% of what they were 12-15 years ago when most of the weeks were sold at development.

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If you use Marriott as the broker, could you get the Destination Club points as well? And would I really want to do that?

akdrc said:

If you use Marriott as the broker, could you get the Destination Club points as well? And would I really want to do that?

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You can get the DC points allocated to your week if you purchase it via Marriott Resales ONLY if you also purchase a like amount of DC points at the going retail rate. Each week is allocated X number of DC points when it is enrolled in the DC. For a Marriott Resale week to become eligible to be enrolled, you much also purchase a DC points package at least equal in size to the # of points the week was allocated.

The all in price can be in the $7+ per point range, depending on the week. Its pricey, but much cheaper than going the points only route and having a price per point in the $10-$12 range.

To your question....would you really want to do that....it depends on how much you value the DC points game, vs. the traditional weeks game.

The ability to trade your timeshare for Marriott Reward points reminds me of the fairy tale " The Emperor's New Clothes". I don't see it.

In 1995, I did see it. I could trade my timeshare for 130K Marriott Reward points every year. When I purchased the timeshare in 1995, the MF fee was say 500. The highest Category hotel was a 5 and you could stay one week at any Marriott Hotel in the world.

Fast forward 2015. I was in Boston a few weekends ago... the Residence Inn was 40K per day using points or 120K for 3 nights. I could have stayed at the hotel at a AAA rate of 229. ed The Fairfield in at Cambridge was 35K points per night. A fairfield Inn. The rate was 139 per night. BTW my MF is now 1200. This is not a complaint, just facts. I suspect the value will continue to get worse. The travel packages have also gotten worse.

You lose money very time you trade for points. I would not spend 1 cent more for the right to trade for Marriott Reward Points if I was buying resale.

The MR Travel Packages may well have got worse, but at least they still offer the best option for conversion to MR and for us anyway prove reasonably good value for our long haul club class flights/stays.

akdrc said:

My understanding is that if you do not get Marriott points if you buy a Marriott TS from a third party.

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OK so you are asking about MVC DC points. As you said. If you buy a Marriott TS week resale (after June of 2010) you do not have the option of joining the DC and getting MCV DC pts.

Assuming I am correct - Is it worth giving up the points for a lower priced TS? And what else could I be losing by purchasing a TS with third party for this system?

Am I right in thinking Marriott is the only one who gives a third party purchaser no points?

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If you are like my wife and I, and want to visit the same great Marriott resort often and want to trade every once in a while ( I own 2 weeks at the newport coast resort) then buying a cheap (80% discount off the marriott price) is a great deal. If you want to always go to someplace new then buying a resale week isn't a great deal.

Marriott does allow "trust"owners ( people who bought pts in the system and not weeks ) to sell their point ownership to someone else. You can buy these for about a >60% discount BUT Marriott has imposed a huge fee on these sales which amounts to an additional $2/pt so if you buy a 2000 pt resale ownership, you'll pay another ~$4000 to Marriott in junk fees for doing so. Your total cost will likely be around $7/pt which is a 35% discount just not the 80% you will get with a normal resale.

Other TS companies do allow you to buy resale and use their pts to reserve weeks at their other resorts. Hilton and Hyatt both are great for this. Westin has stopped selling TS which allow this but some weeks at older resorts still allow it. Worldmark is a great value in point based TSs.

Hope this helps

A few years down the road, assuming I may want to stay somewhere other than my home resort at least once, is an exchange through RCI/II (or other exchange service) my only option without Club Points?

One other thing to mention is that if you pay for your DC points using your Marriott Rewards Visa card, you'll get five times the purchase price in Rewards points which are worth something more than $1,000.

Since I also received 2500 bonus points when I bought 2500 points at retail, I calculate that I overpaid by about 40%, give or take, compared to buying resale.

Oh, well.

Edit: As I re-read the thread, I've realized that the subject probably wasn't buying DC points at retail. Still, my message is, "Don't do that."

bazzap said:

The MR Travel Packages may well have got worse, but at least they still offer the best option for conversion to MR and for us anyway prove reasonably good value for our long haul club class flights/stays.

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I agree. At our Custom House owner seminar, the emphasis was on never using Marriott Reward pionts for a single night stays. Or even a weekly stay. ONLY use it in conjunction with Travel Package. This is really the only way MR pionts still make sense.

dioxide45 said:

I agree. At our Custom House owner seminar, the emphasis was on never using Marriott Reward pionts for a single night stays. Or even a weekly stay. ONLY use it in conjunction with Travel Package. This is really the only way MR pionts still make sense.

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One acquires MR points from hotel stays, Visa usage and timeshare or DC point exchanges. Looking at purely timeshare exchanges , MR points, even with the travel packages appear to not even break even with MF's required to exchange for those points.

Seat availability using airline points are limited, many more people are using them and 50k points one way is not unusual. The Marriott Hotel category system keeps increasing the number of them making a Fairfield inn should never be a 6. See the one in Cambridge. I paid 139 per night. In general, the cash equivalent of MF's to acquire MR points are not worth the usage.

This is not a compliant nor am I whining. I use MR points often. I like the program. I just don't trade timeshares for MR points.

The question was is it worth paying more for the exchange right. IMO, no.

l0410z said:

One acquires MR points from hotel stays, Visa usage and timeshare or DC point exchanges. Looking at purely timeshare exchanges , MR points, even with the travel packages appear to not even break even with MF's required to exchange for those points.

Seat availability using airline points are limited, many more people are using them and 50k points one way is not unusual. The Marriott Hotel category system keeps increasing the number of them making a Fairfield inn should never be a 6. See the one in Cambridge. I paid 139 per night. In general, the cash equivalent of MF's to acquire MR points are not worth the usage.

This is not a compliant nor am I whining. I use MR points often. I like the program. I just don't trade timeshares for MR points.

The question was is it worth paying more for the exchange right. IMO, no.

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I agree that the value isn't there like it was, but a case can still be made to convert weeks to MR points. THat was the whole premise of the owner seminar I attended. It works especially well for international travel, mostly Europe where there are very few category 6 or even 7. Most properties are an 8 or 9. And in major metropolitan centers in Europe a room doesn't go for $139 a night, they go for €400-€500, if not more. Then tax on top of that. With MR redemptions you pau zero tax. Some weeks have a better redemption rate for MR points than others. Some cost less than a penny a point, some cost more. Many people can get far more value out of hotel redemption than a penny a point, especially when using business class to Europe. Think two to two and a half cents per point.

Sure, airlines have cut FF seat availability, but it is still out there. You just have to plan well in advance and be ready at the 330 day mark. It still seems to work very well for many people.

Sure you could buy MR points, but some people have a limited vacation budget and can't spend extra on top of their MFs. You also get MR points for credit card and hotel use. But for an average leisure traveler, it could take many years to earn enough points for a travel package. One can get there in only a couple years by converting their week to points on top of their credit card and hotel MR points earned.

I hope my post helps....I may restate some of what you've already heard. Let me start by saying: financing a Timeshare is like pouring money down a bottomless well.

1. You loose nothing (of value) if you buy resale vs developer on Marriott. Marriott reward points (MR) are not a good value for most timeshare folks. Maybe for uber-business travelers or specific cases like dioxide pointed out, but not for most regular folk. Yes, the one-time 'bonus MR points' you get for paying developer prices are nice, but research the cost to simply buy/earn those points first. IMHO MR points are not a primary purchase consideration.
2. If you're just after Marriott Destination Club points (DC), then buy them resale. They are cheaper at about $5-6 per point. Please research the high cost of maintenance fees ( MF's ) with points before you buy. Points are flexible, but expensive (overall).
3. If you want flexibility, buy a TS that trades well in Interval International (II). Marriott's (most) trade very well in II. You have Marriott preference (first shot) at trading and can pick up some amazing trades if you are flexible. If you buy a lock-off unit, you can expect to multiply your week into multiple bookings if you trade well.
4. If, after reading, researching and thinking about it, still feel that you need points to make your vacation more 'flexible' then consider buying a fixed week and a minimum amount of points (1500). This option will allow you to have the best of both worlds. The SECRET: renting DC points--the joy of use without the pain of MF's. If you want to purchase weeks/points, this can be done resale (on both) or thru Marriott directly. Marriott will offer a week for sale (a 'resale week' brokered to you by Marriott) --if you buy a matching number of points from Marriott. This results in points cost of around $6-7. This is not that easy, because you must find the perfect blend of units/points values to make the deal work. There are a number of threads here discussing this.

Finally....you have found the info you needed to save yourself thousands of dollars here on TUG. You are getting tons of great advice and ideas. Please do 2 things: Join TUG. Best $15 you will ever spend (already is, right?) Two, fill out the 'what timeshare is best for me' profile here (answer the questions carefully and fully) and you'll get lots of advice on what many, many people feel is best for you. There are many factors that determine 'what is best for me' besides the brand name or 'free reward points.'


One key on filling out the new profile: If you really want a hotel style TS with 4-5 star quality (Marriott, HGVC, Hyatt, Westin) then make that clear. You will pay for this quality and uniformity. If you indicate 3 or 4 star, you'll get a lot of additional suggestions and debate about 'what is 3 star? what is 4 star?' that may not be what you're looking for (or vice versa).


I love Marriott weeks and II, that's why i bought 2 of them resale.


Welcome

dioxide45 said:

I agree that the value isn't there like it was, but a case can still be made to convert weeks to MR points. THat was the whole premise of the owner seminar I attended. It works especially well for international travel, mostly Europe where there are very few category 6 or even 7. Most properties are an 8 or 9. And in major metropolitan centers in Europe a room doesn't go for $139 a night, they go for €400-€500, if not more. Then tax on top of that. With MR redemptions you pau zero tax. Some weeks have a better redemption rate for MR points than others. Some cost less than a penny a point, some cost more. Many people can get far more value out of hotel redemption than a penny a point, especially when using business class to Europe. Think two to two and a half cents per point.

Sure, airlines have cut FF seat availability, but it is still out there. You just have to plan well in advance and be ready at the 330 day mark. It still seems to work very well for many people.

Sure you could buy MR points, but some people have a limited vacation budget and can't spend extra on top of their MFs. You also get MR points for credit card and hotel use. But for an average leisure traveler, it could take many years to earn enough points for a travel package. One can get there in only a couple years by converting their week to points on top of their credit card and hotel MR points earned.

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This is CLOSE to what we are going. We also travel outside of Marriott places (such renegades!!) so we exchanged our BPT EOY for 100,000 MR points. It was *leftover* - we were flat out not going to use it, and this was less hassle than renting it out as property or DC points. We plan on spending a week in Paris ion 2017, and yes - the $$ cost of hotels is high - but with working that credit card, we will have more than enough MR points for a Cat. 9. BUT - this is where we diverge. We do not use the Marriott credit card to rack up points that would transfer for *flights* - for that, we use our Delta SkyMiles card. Did all the math, and for US - spending in plateaus of 25 grand (not hard to do just on normal house expenses) gets us a BONUS of 10 grand in Sky Miles. Did this once last year, TWICE this year, will do it one more time next year (first 6 months, then we book the trip). I have posted this before, and asked for people to either tell me that I am missing something here, or that yes - this CAN be better than at Marriott travel package (for international usage - here, I agree that for domestic, there are better ways.) The Delta card also gets us a BOGO -we always upgrade to Comfort. (I think we are all in agreement that the II BOGO/zone plan is awful.) If there is anything I am missing here - please let me know, before the cement on this hardens in my brain. We have time to readjust - but NO need to dump in any property for MR points again for quite some time - we realize it has limited value for us. Liked always - objects in mirror are closer than they appear, and you mileage my vary. I gratefully await correction, criticism, or validation.

BTW - there was an article that popped up pn my phone from one of the *money* magazines, advising about best airline cards for this kind of scenario. Was going to capture than link and include it - gone, now. We really have no interest in switching boats at this time, anyway.

Mamianka (leaving for a Tauck Danube cruise in less than 2 weeks! So excited!)

taterhed said:

I hope my post helps....I may restate some of what you've already heard. Let me start by saying: financing a Timeshare is like pouring money down a bottomless well.

1. You loose nothing (of value) if you buy resale vs developer on Marriott. Marriott reward points (MR) are not a good value for most timeshare folks. Maybe for uber-business travelers or specific cases like dioxide pointed out, but not for most regular folk. Yes, the one-time 'bonus MR points' you get for paying developer prices are nice, but research the cost to simply buy/earn those points first. IMHO MR points are not a primary purchase consideration.
2. If you're just after Marriott Destination Club points (DC), then buy them resale. They are cheaper at about $5-6 per point. Please research the high cost of maintenance fees ( MF's ) with points before you buy. Points are flexible, but expensive (overall).
3. If you want flexibility, buy a TS that trades well in Interval International (II). Marriott's (most) trade very well in II. You have Marriott preference (first shot) at trading and can pick up some amazing trades if you are flexible. If you buy a lock-off unit, you can expect to multiply your week into multiple bookings if you trade well.
4. If, after reading, researching and thinking about it, still feel that you need points to make your vacation more 'flexible' then consider buying a fixed week and a minimum amount of points (1500). This option will allow you to have the best of both worlds. The SECRET: renting DC points--the joy of use without the pain of MF's. If you want to purchase weeks/points, this can be done resale (on both) or thru Marriott directly. Marriott will offer a week for sale (a 'resale week' brokered to you by Marriott) --if you buy a matching number of points from Marriott. This results in points cost of around $6-7. This is not that easy, because you must find the perfect blend of units/points values to make the deal work. There are a number of threads here discussing this.

Finally....you have found the info you needed to save yourself thousands of dollars here on TUG. You are getting tons of great advice and ideas. Please do 2 things: Join TUG. Best $15 you will ever spend (already is, right?) Two, fill out the 'what timeshare is best for me' profile here (answer the questions carefully and fully) and you'll get lots of advice on what many, many people feel is best for you. There are many factors that determine 'what is best for me' besides the brand name or 'free reward points.'


One key on filling out the new profile: If you really want a hotel style TS with 4-5 star quality (Marriott, HGVC, Hyatt, Westin) then make that clear. You will pay for this quality and uniformity. If you indicate 3 or 4 star, you'll get a lot of additional suggestions and debate about 'what is 3 star? what is 4 star?' that may not be what you're looking for (or vice versa).


I love Marriott weeks and II, that's why i bought 2 of them resale.


Welcome

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Excellent advice!

One thing I would add would be to carefully determine the season you want. I bought a resale Imperial Palms in Orlando - Platinum (because it exchanged for more MR points) in 1999. I never really want to go in Platinum Season as that is when the kids are out of school and the parks are packed! So, I trade it almost exclusively, including trading back into my own resort!

John

dioxide45 said:

I agree. At our Custom House owner seminar, the emphasis was on never using Marriott Reward pionts for a single night stays. Or even a weekly stay. ONLY use it in conjunction with Travel Package. This is really the only way MR pionts still make sense.

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I have used MR points many times for 1 and 2 night stays. There are times "event" weekends occur and prices more than double, but the rewards points always stay the same.

For example, right now in College Station, TX, I have 2 nights reserved at the Fairfield Inn for Oct 30 check in. The rooms are $463 per night but my reservation took only 25K points per night. That's a value of $.0185 per point.

I've also done this in DFW many times.

I just wanted to point out....
I'm not disputing the value of Marriott reward points....I have an account myself.

I'm merely supporting the position that MRP's are not a valid reason to purchase direct from the developer--at full price--for most travelers.

Sure, if you've got em, can use em or need them....go for it. But buying resale vs direct will save you $$$$$ money. That money will go a long way towards offsetting the value of MRP's. For instance: chase ultimate rewards trades 1 for 1 to most reward systems. Including Marriott. You can get 40k free points for signing up and spending 5k in 3mos. Not hard.

So, I still am favoring the resale/discount purchase of Timeshares AND the use of Marriott points.

akdrc said:

A few years down the road, assuming I may want to stay somewhere other than my home resort at least once, is an exchange through RCI/II (or other exchange service) my only option without Club Points?

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Just saw this.... Become a TUG member: There is an excellent 'Owner Exchange' program on this site. For an owner-direct exchange, there is no fee etc... Guest Cert. will be required in most cases.

Also, never underestimate the power of II trades with Marriott preference. Or, SFX trades for that matter.

dioxide45 said:

I agree. At our Custom House owner seminar, the emphasis was on never using Marriott Reward pionts for a single night stays. Or even a weekly stay. ONLY use it in conjunction with Travel Package. This is really the only way MR pionts still make sense.

Click to expand...

So, just accumulate 200,000 points and you can jet off to a ... cat 1-5 hotel for a week, IF you can find an airline willing to take a mere 50,000 travel points when and where you want to go. Hmm. Or, accumulate a mere 370,000 points and get a nice ... hotel room, flying perhaps business class.
But, really, rationally, how much money do you have to spend in the Marriott playpen to get that many miles? How long will that take, in this world?

Quick answer: A LOT. To be sure, not as many nights as in the past, as plain vanilla Residence Inn and Courtyard rooms run upwards of $200/night (plus tax) in most cities in the summer (i.e., when you actually want them). Even so, the spending necessary to accumulate, say 300,000 miles is staggering.

Considering this, the virtues of standard weeks shine brighter and brighter.

Just bought a Newport resale for $8,000, with maintenance fees around $1,100 a year. Even accounting for lost revenue on the investment (call it $400/year), the villa will cost under $225 a night. Trade it to a fairly huge number of alternative sites, and the cost jumps to $250/night. Our Tahoe summer unit works even better, if locking off. Even the lockoff compares very favorably to most standard Marriott rooms.

With the relentless and scarily rising cost of standard hotel rooms, it become hard to argue with the economics of resale. A couple of years ago, folks were whining that rising maintenance fees would destroy traditional weeks. Now, I'm thinking they're getting more and more desirable.

To clarify my position. I don't think it is wise to pay developer prices, or even Marriott "direct" resale prices just to have the option to trade for Marriott Reward points. However, those that already bought developer or those that have a DC enrolled week can trade for MR points for no additional cost. Unless they have an unenrolled direct week, then I think there is a $135 fee to trade for MR points.

For those that can get 110,000 or even 90,000 MR points for just their MF, there is still value in the travel packages. The cost may be less than or the same as Marriott's price of $0.0125pp.

Those that bought resale and enrolled, come out farther ahead. Though some may only be able to trade every other year where a direct purchaser can trade every year. Though this isn't always the case. Paying developer prices for the option to trade for MR doesn't make sense.

Buying Resale From Marriott Just for MR points not worth the cost

I know some people ask if resale from Marriott is worth the MR exchange right. i believe renting, exchanging for other locations and banking units are much better options than exchanging for MR points. I often struggle using points when booking hotels because of various discount options available. The travel packages seem to be the best use of points but I still do not think you get a good value.

This week, my wife and I are going to vacation in Chicago for 5 nights. It is for a delayed 60th birthday celebration that was postponed for personal reasons this past April. Given the event, we wanted to stay at a full service hotel. In April, I was able to get a room at the Renaissance Hotel using my corporate discount for 189 per day so about 1000 for the week. Any full service Marriott in Chicago will run at least 160,000 MR points for 5 days using the 4 for 5 day option. The choice in April was to pay. This week the best discounted rate I could find for the same hotel with tax was 1650 (1850 non discounted). This reservation was made 2 months ago and I keep checking the rates. I am using my MR points. Though my last exchange was 10 years ago when my MF was less, my current MF is 1200. I get 130,000 MR points for the exchange so it is a wash in today's terms.

BTW, every gold or platinum member should always call and ask for an upgrade ahead of time when staying for a special occasion. I was already informed I am upgraded to a 1000 SF 1 br, 1 1/2 bath corner suite. This is just one of the reasons I am loyal to time Marriott brand. My experience over 25 plus years has been well worth the loyalty.

I am not using the 499 per night rate because under no circumstances would I have paid that rate for a 5 night stay in Chicago.

Back on point.... MR exchange is a good option to have if you already have it, but In general not worth any incremental cost more for just resale purchase reasons alone.