NEW FEES for reservations at Bonnet Creek

Explorer7 said:

Manhattan Club in NYC charges non owners $25 per day resort fee, I used Wyn points through RCI, didn't like it but I paid it. If memory serves me their fee was for the GYM and WIFI.

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Actually, I think that's for daily housekeeping (on a 1BR, or $15 on a Studio), and I think it's only for RCI exchanges.

Stayed at a non-Wyndham resort in Atlantic City, New Jersey paid a extra fee that was assessed to people booking through RCI. Do not remember technically what it was for, it was around 50 dollars for a few night stay.

Stayed at a non-Wyndham resort in Atlantic City, New Jersey paid a extra fee that was assessed to people booking through RCI. Do not remember technically what it was for, it was around 50 dollars for a few night stay.

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If you book less than a week's stay using RCI points expect to pay a housekeeping fee. They usually range from $45-$85 for the week and are usually based on the size of the unit. It doesn't matter if you stay one day or 6 days. The original owner paid MF's for one housekeeping per week so they charge for the extra cleaning. It should be only one have of the actual cleaning cost because two are paying it and the second one should be included and if no one stays for the second half it shouldn't need to be cleaned again.

One interesting note (which I'm not sure if anyone in the last almost 300 post has pointed out) guests of the Wyndham bonnet creek hotel pay a similar fee as the timeshare side per day. If you look at the Wyndham hotel, when you look at est fees and taxes, they pay a $16 resort fee on top of the the cost of the hotel room. I wonder if that is where the TS side got it from?

Jason

ronparise said:

Im just repeating what Ive said before..there is no difference between the points from one resort or another when used as currency to "buy" reservations at another resort within the system

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Ron, I pondered you evaluations of Points being Points and have to respectfully disagree. If points were pure currency and the currency was the same then the same amount of currency should get you the same item. So if I work in Illinois and you work in Florida (or where ever) and we both earn $224. We both can take that $224 rent a room at Bonnet Creek. Because I earned this currency in Illinois I have to pay an extra tax on it, $86 But by virtue of you earning that money in Florida you do not have to. This make the value of the currency I have less that the value of the currency you have but his extra taxed amount. Points are no longer Points.

Now you could argue that there difference in maintenance fee (which there are) but if you earn currency there are difference in hourly wage. If you make 100K a year or you make minimum wage, you still can use the same dollar to get a Sweet Tea at Micky D’s that currency is the same, you are not charge an extra tax for going to Micky D’s outside the state you earn your dollar in or because it took you more or less time to earn it.

VIP discount can be argued too, but VIP discount does not change the published rate a resort gets for a room. The discount is off of the published much like a coupon. If you have the coupon you get the discount.

Now Kingsgate has been brought into the conversation. They charge the fee to all who use the resort; this is a tax on all. This is a more far tax because it does not single out a class of ownership it still is a tax and does not make point equal.

It can be argued that ARP makes points unequal. You get a change to book a room before me and vice versa. ARP is does not make point unequal. Say we are both working at two different companies where points are currency. We can ask our bosses of an advance. So I ask for the advance. The boss says ok but you have to use it at the at the company store. I can then book in at the company store. There is no upcharge in the posted rates to book there, no is there a fee on the advance. You could do the same of your company.

CWA is much the same. If could be looked at as a corporation where the privileges and benefits are given to an employee at one location and can be used at another.

Any additional requirements on the use of points from one resort to the other no longer make them equal. The fee changes the playing fee for the Wyndham Points exchange system.

morrisjim said:

As the president of the HOA at Wyndham Glacier Canyon, if someone purposed a waterpark surcharge to all NON-owners, I would consider it because it would save the owners millions of dollars a year on maintenance fees. I don't know what the MOU between Wyndham and the parks developers says about it. I guess I need to ask that question...

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Jim thanks for serving on the board.

My first impressions were that was a good idea to do the same is my knee jerk reaction. Why should someone come here from Bonnet Creek and enjoy what my maintenance fee pay for. After all, our maintenance fees are more so we should get more for our bang. But much like the response to Ron above, I had to think about it. It takes away what we all bought into the Wyndham Points system for, the ability to use our points to trade as currency from one resort to the other. I don’t think anyone was told at the sales meeting that your points will only be good at your home resort.

By imposing taxes on non-owner we are devaluing the system as a whole. If Glacier Canyon charges say $15 a day, which would be a bargain, and then owners at Tamarack look at their maintenance fee and says we are we paying so much more that everywhere else. Then they decided to charge $8 dollars a day. After all if Glacier Canyon could get $15 dollars were are just down the road, we are worth at least $8. Now the owners at Branson decided to charge a fee too because they don’t like staying in the Dells and getting charged a fee. It then becomes a snowball effect. People would then tend to stay at only their home resorts. They system would breakdown.

And maybe this is what Wyndham wants, to keep owners going to their home resorts or to just sell CWA contract.

Or maybe it is just a way for Wyndham to impose more fees on the owners without directly raising the maintenance fees.

I am just an observer it but that what I think.

Steve

Steve...

My point is that points are still points when used at places other than your home resort

Clearly if I own at Bonnet Creek, and you dont and we both want reservations at Bonnet Creek, my points are better than yours. I get a jump on reserving the best weeks (ARP) and now I get a pass on the $12 a day

But neithe one of us owns at Bonnet Creek. For example if I own at National Harbor and you own at Canterbury, our points spend the same at Bonnet Creek..224k plus $84 gets a week in a 2 bedroom in prime season. In their use, my points are the same as your points

ronparise said:

Steve...

My point is that points are still points when used at places other than your home resort

Clearly if I own at Bonnet Creek, and you dont and we both want reservations at Bonnet Creek, my points are better than yours. I get a jump on reserving the best weeks (ARP) and now I get a pass on the $12 a day

But neithe one of us owns at Bonnet Creek. For example if I own at National Harbor and you own at Canterbury, our points spend the same at Bonnet Creek..224k plus $84 gets a week in a 2 bedroom in prime season. In their use, my points are the same as your points

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But you forget to mention my Smokey Mountain points (under the CWA maintance fee rate) compared against your resort that has maintance fees above the CWA rate. in that case my cost per thousand points is less than yours. Therefore, I get more use days for my contract than you do for your contract.

My contract would lose to your contract that has fees under $ 4 per thousand points.

As far as Kingsgate getting into the conversation, lets look at the Wyndham Kingsgate points vs. Wyndham Patriots Place points from a use point of view. Same would hold true with your (fill in the resort points) and the Wyndham Patriot's Place points. I do not know if the Club Wyndham Access owners get treeted like Patriot's Place owners or like Kingsgate owners for the purpose of the Kingsgate fees.

If you were a owner at Wyndham Patriots Place, you get use rights of the Kingsgate facilities without a additional charge. If you are a Kingsgate owner, you get the honor of paying the additional fees. I would therefore suggest the Wyndham Patriot's Place points are more valuable than the Wyndham Kingsgate owners when they are compared from a total dollar spent for equilvant uses.

As it relates to the Wyndham Platinum points vs. non-VIP Wyndham points: Your Wyndham points generally get the coupons that are made reference to in the hypothetical to my coupons. You get about 0 to 40 percent off at some resorts on short notice reservations. Mine start at 50 percent and go up on short notice reservations, typically, I have more resorts to chose from before your availability dries up and mine goes away.

Update: Just checked with Patriots Place, anyone staying at Patriots Place, guest, RCI reservation, owner, etc. do not pay the additional fee that the owners do of Kingsgate.

lcml11 said:

But you forget to mention my Smokey Mountain points (under the CWA maintance fee rate) compared against your resort that has maintance fees above the CWA rate. in that case my cost per thousand points is less than yours. Therefore, I get more use days for my contract than you do for your contract.

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My statement is:

IN THEIR USE points are points

If I have $10 in my pocket and you have $10 in yours, who's $10 bill is better...I would argue that in their use they are exactly the same. a dollar is a dollar. That your grandmother gave you yours for being a good boy, and I had to work an hour in the hot sun putting a roof on some guys house to earn mine is of no consequence to the cashier at Mc Donalds . He doesnt care that yours cost you nothing and I had to work for mine

You can argue all day that your money is better than mine, but when it comes to spending it, it doesnt matter.

I realize some Wyndham points are cheaper to buy than others and the maintenance costs vary..but at the end of the day, when you make a reservation and I make a reservation our points "spend" exactly alike.

ronparise said:

My statement is:

IN THEIR USE points are points

If I have $10 in my pocket and you have $10 in yours, who's $10 bill is better...I would argue that in their use they are exactly the same. a dollar is a dollar. That your grandmother gave you yours for being a good boy, and I had to work an hour in the hot sun putting a roof on some guys house to earn mine is of no consequence to the cashier at Mc Donalds . He doesnt care that yours cost you nothing and I had to work for mine

You can argue all day that your money is better than mine, but when it comes to spending it, it doesnt matter.

I realize some Wyndham points are cheaper to buy than others and the maintenance costs vary..but at the wne of the day, when you make a reservation and I make a reservation our points "spend" exactly alike.

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If you are a Bonnet Creek guest or a Kingsgate owner vs. someone staying at Patriots Place or a owner or Club Wyndham Access member at Bonnet Creek, the difference is when you pay your $10 dollars then leave. I have to come up with more money to clear the bill.

To the limited extent that Wyndham Club Access points are Wyndham Club Access points at this point in time, I would tend to agree.

lcml11 said:

If you are a Bonnet Creek guest or a Kingsgate owner vs. someone staying at Patriots Place or a owner or Club Wyndham Access member at Bonnet Creek, the difference is when you pay your $10 dollars then leave. I have to come up with more money to clear the bill.

To the limited extent that Wyndham Club Access points are Wyndham Club Access points at this point in time, I would tend to agree.

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lcml11 You hit the nail on the head. You said it nice and concise. Either $10 or $10 plus a little more.

Pietin said:

lcml11 You hit the nail on the head. You said nice and concise. Either $10 or $10 plus a little more.

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Thank-you.

If I own bonnet creek points than absolutely my points are better than yours when spent at Bonnet Creek. Im not arguing against that. but when I use my bonnet creek points to stay somewhere else in the system..my points work the same as any other points


The points are points argument is never made without the caveat unless you want ARP at a particular resort...Now we have to add or unless you want to avoid the $12 a day fee at Bonnet...and the only reason I make the points are points argument is to suggest that a buyer look to the resorts with lower than average maintenance fees.

So the statement is (or will be): When shopping for Wyndham points, understand some will cost mere than others to buy, and some will cost more to own. Unless you need ARP (or unless you want to avoid the $12 fee at Bonnet creek) understand when it comes to the use of points, Points are Points. look for a contract with low mf and a low purchase price.

ronparise said:

...When shopping for Wyndham points, understand some will cost mere than others to buy, and some will cost more to own. Unless you need ARP (or unless you want to avoid the $12 fee at Bonnet creek) understand when it comes to the use of points, Points are Points. look for a contract with low mf and a low purchase price.

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Your disclaimer is getting longer than your mess apron.

csxjohn said:

Your disclaimer is getting longer than your mess apron.

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In the interest of being short sweet and to the point, it would just be easyier to say Wyndham Points are not necessarly Wyndham Points.

lcml11 said:

In the interest of being short sweet and to the point, it would just be easyier to say Wyndham Points are not necessarly Wyndham Points.

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Then you will have to tell me other than at your home resort, where do you get more for your Myrtle beach points than I get for my National Harbor points or vice-versa

ronparise said:

Then you will have to tell me other than at your home resort, where do you get more for your Myrtle beach points than I get for my National Harbor points or vice-versa

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You get much more for your National Harbor points than I do on reservations under 10 months (due to the lower maintance fees at National Harbor) unless my VIP discount is taken into account on the under 60 day window. In which case, on average, I probably do better.

For my Myrtle Beach points (including my one Smokey Mountain contract that has receiprical ARP rights into Myrtle Beach, I would win on the ARP reservation window for Myrtle Beach.

To the extent that I chose to use the book book cancel procedure or the book cancel rebook proceedure with my Wyndham Platinum points, I can get 50 percent discounts with a whole lot of free upgrades. Since I have been with Wyndham, I do not think that I have had a completed full frieght reservation. This gives me one heck of a lot more usage of the Wyndham Resorts than your National Harbor one. We can even throw in Wyndham Silver VIP points and this would be true.

All of my Wyndham Points are Wyndham Myrtle Beach/Wyndam Myrtle Beach, LLC and Smokey Mountain points.

P.S. Staying at your resort gets us a heck of a parking bill while staying at my resorts does not.

Sorry, minor correction on my earlier post, I keep forgeting I have a small Club Wyndham Access contract.

lcml11 said:

You get much more for your National Harbor points than I do on reservations under 10 months (due to the lower maintance fees at National Harbor) unless my VIP discount is taken into account on the under 60 day window. In which case, on average, I probably do better.

For my Myrtle Beach points (including my one Smokey Mountain contract that has receiprical ARP rights into Myrtle Beach, I would win on the ARP reservation window for Myrtle Beach.

To the extent that I chose to use the book book cancel procedure or the book cancel rebook proceedure with my Wyndham Platinum points, I can get 50 percent discounts with a whole lot of free upgrades. Since I have been with Wyndham, I do not think that I have had a completed full frieght reservation. This gives me one heck of a lot more usage of the Wyndham Resorts than your National Harbor one. We can even throw in Wyndham Silver VIP points and this would be true.

All of my Wyndham Points are Wyndham Myrtle Beach/Wyndam Myrtle Beach, LLC and Smokey Mountain points.

P.S. Staying at your resort gets us a heck of a parking bill while staying at my resorts does not.

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There is no question that owning at certain resorts gives you more for your money spent in fees per 1000 points, however, I must agree with Ron Parise, once you have those points and use them for standard reservations – a point is a point no matter which resort it came from and no matter whether you are VIP or if you acquired your timeshares resale. The few advantages that VIP owners have with getting discounts and upgrades is a small consolation for the high price we paid initially for our points. As to the extra fees that are charged for parking, transportation, and special amenities at some resorts, they don’t really enter into the equation of “points = points” no matter which resort they came from. You can choose to use your points at those resorts that charge extra fees or you can go where they don’t. A point from Bonnet Creek has the same usage value as one from Ocean Boulevard, National Harbor, Fairfield Glade or anywhere else in the Wyndham system.

rsphelps said:

There is no question that owning at certain resorts gives you more for your money spent in fees per 1000 points, however, I must agree with Ron Parise, once you have those points and use them for standard reservations – a point is a point no matter which resort it came from and no matter whether you are VIP or if you acquired your timeshares resale. The few advantages that VIP owners have with getting discounts and upgrades is a small consolation for the high price we paid initially for our points. As to the extra fees that are charged for parking, transportation, and special amenities at some resorts, they don’t really enter into the equation of “points = points” no matter which resort they came from. You can choose to use your points at those resorts that charge extra fees or you can go where they don’t. A point from Bonnet Creek has the same usage value as one from Ocean Boulevard, National Harbor, Fairfield Glade or anywhere else in the Wyndham system.

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Sorry, minor correction on my earlier post, I keep forgeting I have a small Club Wyndham Access contract. I guess that makes me a owner under what appears to be Bonnet Creeks defination for use purposes. To bad I do not get the other rights of Bonnet Creek ownership, like get a vote in the Board of director's election.

lcml11 said:

Sorry, minor correction on my earlier post, I keep forgeting I have a small Club Wyndham Access contract. I guess that makes me a owner under what appears to be Bonnet Creeks defination for use purposes. To bad I do not get the other rights of Bonnet Creek ownership, like get a vote in the Board of director's election.

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The only thing my vote counted for was the quarum and I'm not sure if they even got that. So you're not missing out on anything by not having a vote. In fact the way it apperars, you have ownership in the way Wyndham is planning for the future. Whether or not thats good or bad, I'm not sure, but if and when every resort becomes part of Club Access, the value of deeded ownership and ARP will be gone.

rsphelps said:

The only thing my vote counted for was the quarum and I'm not sure if they even got that. So you're not missing out on anything by not having a vote. In fact the way it apperars, you have ownership in the way Wyndham is planning for the future. Whether or not thats good or bad, I'm not sure, but if and when every resort becomes part of Club Access, the value of deeded ownership and ARP will be gone.

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I agree. And, the way this ball is bouncing, the traditional UDI ownership may get more and more fees till they give back their deeds to Wyndham to re-sell into Club Wyndham Access.

Update

This just in:

Dear Owner:

As a result of recent feedback, the Bonnet Creek Home Owners Association has reversed the recently communicated $12 per unit / per day transportation fee for guests staying at Wyndham Bonnet Creek Resort. Beginning March 1, 2013, transportation fees will only be applied to individuals who use the Walt Disney World® Resort shuttles at the resort.

We remain committed to delivering exceptional Count On Me! service and creating vacation memories for you and your family and friends.

Thank you for your continued feedback and ongoing support. We look forward to helping you get on your next vacation.

Sincerely,
Richard Scinta, Resort Manager
On behalf of the Board of Directors of
Bonnet Creek Resort Vacation Condominium Association, Inc.

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Heatmerch1 said:

Im new to the site but was trying to keep up and not ask the same thing twice..how would this fee work with somebody that has CWA?

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From the postings of the E-Mails coming from the resorts, it looks like a use fee per person. No exceptions appear to be mentioned.

Heatmerch1 said:

lcm you seem to know alot about timeshare along with everyone on this site. Im very glad to hve found this forum.

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Thank-you for the comment.