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[ 2011 ] True Cost of Points From Wyndham [2011]

timeos2

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So John..If I convert my floating weeks to points. those points will be qualified VIP points...even if the weeks themselves were bought on the secondary market??

Is this a "deal" that has to be negotiated with the purchase of new developer points. or can it stand alone

I understand that the conversion is about $2300 for the first week and under $1000 for each additional week converted at the same time..

And Jim

did you have to pay a conversion fee, plus the $12000 for the 77k points...or just the $12000?

I'll admit I hadn't heard of anyone doing that prior to this post but I do know that Wyndham ideally wants every week to be in points - not fixed weeks of the 90's ilk - so they have always treated conversions of fixed weeks to points as a retail purchase with all benefits that offers. Still, $12K for maybe $200 worth of resale points - if that - will take a miracle to ever even break even. It still isn't any type of good deal but it is a way, for anyone that simply must get the thrill of be VIP, to get there while involving a resale. Just not a POINTS resale. I still wouldn't do at even half that cost - at 1/4 I'd be tempted. Never happen though.

It is still spending money upfront for a possible return 20-30 or more years from now if all else stays as is (and it is guaranteed, unlike VIP, that things WILL change over that time). And it will NOT be to the benefit of the VIP owner. That is an absolute, iron clad guarantee you can bank on. VIP unfortunately you cannot bank on for anything beyond a month or two from now. Paying to get it remains a study in good money spent in a poor manner.
 

BellaWyn

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Ah - technically you did not buy resale POINTS .....

Not understanding why the "technicality" makes a difference. What Jim is saying is that he managed to get to VIP without making a full developer purchase for the total volume of points, only a small percentage of the points.

Ron, since you're asking about how Jim did his numbers, is there a $$ price-point that makes VIP worth the buy in for you? If so, why? (please don't respond to this unless it's in PM)

Also, wouldn't it be somewhat prudent for you and Jim to take the discussion to a more private place? The more you wave the flag in WYN's face, the higher the likelihood they will yank it out from under you. Tread carefully in this public forum. WYN lurks more than you realize.
 

timeos2

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Not understanding why the "technicality" makes a difference. What Jim is saying is that he managed to get to VIP without making a full developer purchase for the total volume of points, only a small percentage of the points.

Ron, since you're asking about how Jim did his numbers, is there a $$ price-point that makes VIP worth the buy in for you? If so, why? (please don't respond to this unless it's in PM)

Also, wouldn't it be somewhat prudent for you and Jim to take the discussion to a more private place? The more you wave the flag in WYN's face, the higher the likelihood they will yank it out from under you. Tread carefully in this public forum. WYN lurks more than you realize.

It's a technicality because the question posted is can you use resale points today to get VIP. The correct answer is NO - the example was a resale week then converted, as part of an expensive retail package, to a VIP account. It was not in anyway or form a resale purchase of points being converted to a qualified VIP points account. Again, don't want the uninformed newbie thinking it had been done recently (resale points to VIP) it HAS NOT. They are immovable on that.

Oh, they do read the forums but you can be sure they already know the "tricks" - they choose to allow them - we're not fooling them in anyway (but they sure are fooling far too many buyers that fall for the VIP as a value nonsense at today's buy-in prices). Discussing it here isn't giving anything away they don't already know.
 

BellaWyn

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....the question posted is can you use resale points today to get VIP.
Interesting. For some reason I misunderstood the question to be:

"what is the best price anyone has seen on new Wyndham points with the discount? "

.... and it has subsequently EVOLVED into the VIP question (musing, argument, discussion, ranting, information-gathering, etc).

Also, while Wyndham may already be privy to the "tricks" I agree they are certainly not fooled. What they don't know, until a couple of owners start chatting each other up about in a highly public forum, is who specifically is attempting to navigate the deal to their advantage. I agree with Pam! If you're going to attempt a short-cut to VIP you run the risk of WYN pulling it out from under you the more you publicize it! To paraphrase another frequent poster in this forum that recently shared the same good advice she wisely told me "shut up and stop talking about it!"

I'm just "sharing forward" ..... :rolleyes:
 

ronparise

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ronparise

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learnalot

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So my 8 fixed weeks (valued at 126000) at $89 each,
plus a 77000 purchase at about another $12000
added to my existing 575k points Im up to 1.6mm

Do I have that right??

Ron,

I don't know about the $89 figures. As to the rest, I would say that this is something that SALES (commissioned, remember?) might write up but that corporate COULD reject (or overturn on further review). There is historical precedent for stripping of VIP status that was obtained partially using resale. I would say that the higher the publicity on the transaction, the more scrutiny might be brought to bear. And I feel pretty confident that even the Wyndham corporate folks would not have too much trouble determining your identity...;) Just saying...
 
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bnoble

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In the past, conversion of fixed weeks was treated as developer points, period. I've since heard rumblings (that may or may not be true) that the underlying fixed week must be an original developer purchase, and not itself a resale. Your mileage may vary.
 

ronparise

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BellaWyn

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I'm afraid that If i was to get Platinum with this strategy it wouldnt be permanent. I might lose my vip status and a salesman lose their job
The likelihood of you loosing your Plat VIP status is higher than the salesman loosing his job. WYN will scrutinize Plat a LOT harder than other levels of VIP.

Aren't we ready yet to let this thread die.... just saying.
:rolleyes:
 

rrlongwell

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Absolutly agree with the earlier post that Wyndham probably already knows of what the items being discussed on Tugs, they probably leave the loopholes for one of two reasons. The first being it benifits the Wyndham Family of Corporations overall or second, the underlying contracts, etc. Require them to exist. One sales presentation that I was at made a public presentation to old Fairfield owners saying that it was a one time offer to buy out their underlying deeds because Wyndham signed agreements when they took Fairfield that gives the holders of those deeds rights over and above what Wyndham gives under Club Wyndham Access and under newer contracts sold by or through Wyndham. The emphis in a number of threads to withold information only serves to limit the rights of owners, VIP or resale, that simply do not know of what rights they may have in the purchasing of the old Fairfield contracts.
 
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rrlongwell

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I have just read the Members Directory for 2011 2012. On page 287 towards the bottom of the right hand column, it lists a string of tracts that can be the VIP eligable points. One of this is ... or through PIC conversions count towards VIP status. The next paragraph then indicates that ownership interests bought from privete indivuals or re-sale companies do not count towards VIP status. The post that talks of a possable different tract for thoughs resale contracts bought directly from Wyndham or its affilates and thoughs bought from privete indivuals or re-sale companies may very well be a point well taken. This wording is very interesting in that at one sales presentation, a major sales point was that Wyndham would probably be entering the re-sale market shortly. This was very credable to me because I have bought prior owned contracts from Wyndham before I heard this is a sales pitch. By creating a two tier re-sale market (which this wording makes possable) Wyndham would have one heck of an advantage. Buy re-sale through a re-sale company - no VIP - Buy re-sale through Wyndham - VIP Status included. I can see the sales pitch coming if Wyndham does expand their presence in the re-sale market. This would be very close to the sales pitch for retail coming from Shawnee Mountain. Their pitch is the sales person comparing a retail purchase to a re-sale purchase in a pro-active manner, that asks the customer why would a re-sale customer get VIP Benifits when these benifits are paid for directly to Wyndham.
 
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jebloomquist

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bamasteve

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Then again, at least one (National Harbor) has a VIP Check-In, but will not wait on the VIP guest until all of the non-VIP guests are checked in, even the ones that come after you.

Hah. I never found the VIP checkin at National Harbor to be anything special. I'm VIP Gold. They have some sign on the corner of the checkin desk as if it's VIP - but there really was no seperate line. I didn't make a fuss about it.

In Branson and Myrtle Beach Ocean Blvd - there were seperate lines for VIP and I received priority service. It was a nice little perk.
 

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By no means will everyone check avail as often as I do nor do most people have the flexibility to travel that my wife and I enjoy but for those who do I think one of the top benefits is the upgrade to the next available highest unit
So far this year I have had 17 less than 1 week get aways all at 65% of the point value and upgraded about 90 percent of my reservations that have included a 35% discounted 1br at National Harbor upgraded to a 4br Presidential unit.

This summer two 3br's upgraded from 1br’s at Gov Green and a studio upgraded to a 2br presidential at Panama City. By watching the last minute cancelations at National Harbor around the 4th of July I snagged a 3br for a discounted 1br for the 3rd and 4th of July.

Yes the benefit can go away any day and I doubt that most people will work as hard as I do to dig in and get these things but from speaking to others as I travel I have encountered others that do.

Most of the time with married couples "The nerd" which is me in my marriage is the one that enjoys figuring out and taking the time to work the system. The "free spirit" which is my wife enjoys the ride by helping to choose destinations, however she does not know how to get deals on the Wyndham site or stay on top of the changes and "press the envelope" to stay on top. When I meet people while traveling the Wyndham resorts I fine one partner in the marriage knows everything I do and the other knows nothing and does not want to.

This is not a product for a “free spirit” who just wants a fun ride without the work of fully understanding the product better than the sales person and pressing the envelop to figure out how to get great deals …

Most often I am reluctant to chime in when others are warning about VIP benefits because I really don't think most new buyers will ever do what it takes to make it pay and of course the rules can change at any time. I also rarely hear about the upgrades that likely only the savviest VIP’s are taking advantage of and rarely talk about, I should probably keep my mouth shut too.

One thing that keeps me sober is thinking about those who purchased Wyndham points expecting to get 2br’s from their 28K RCI deposits which no longer works. Like the 28K upgrades that went away for RCI deposits made after Jan 11 the huge upgrades and discounts that I enjoy can go away too. But for now they are great and my family is enjoying to the max!

I hope I balanced the benefits with the risk well enough for someone to make a well informed decision during their hopefully extensive research.
Dear Ira,
I am just getting into the research part of my wyndham TS. What advice can you give someone regarding resources to fully take advantage of points/benefits? Are there any webinars or videos available on this?

Thanks

Barry
 

Explorer7

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Dear Ira,
I am just getting into the research part of my wyndham TS. What advice can you give someone regarding resources to fully take advantage of points/benefits? Are there any webinars or videos available on this?

Thanks

Barry
Hi Barry, yes there are webinars on the Wyndham website but I have never participated in one. Most of what I have learned is by consistently reading the posts on this forum and by trial and error. What type of ownership do you have?
 
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