Re-thinking purchase!! HELP

samthepoodle · Nov 7, 2009

We really need help! We are staying at the Kaanapali ORV (renting from a friend) and did the sales pitch and signed up for an EOY 2 BR at the Kauai property. It's $36k with 1,300 per year maintenance. We have 6 more days to rescind and are re-thinking our purchase.

We would like to own one of these but are thinking maybe we should buy re-sale. What are the downsides to that? I realize you can't get the hotel points and we don't care too much about that. Do they make it harder to reserve your week or trade the studio for another resort when you're a re-sale owner? The salesperson made it sound like there are all kinds of drawbacks but we need unbiased information...

Thanks!

lprstn · Nov 7, 2009

Rescind!!!! Now!!!! You can purchase resale and save lots of money.

LisaRex · Nov 7, 2009

Sam, I'm glad you found this place while you're still in the recission period. Do yourself a huge favor and rescind immediately, using the instructions included in your packet. Then I'd enjoy the rest of my vacation, stress free, and re-visit Tug when you return home.

In the meantime, here's food for thought:

a) The Kauai property is very different from the Kaanapali property. For instance, it sits on a bluff overlooking the ocean. It's not directly on the beach like Kaanapali.

b) Have you even been to Kauai? It has a completely different vibe to it than Maui -- way more low key, with fewer restaurants and activities. For sure, ome people love Kauai, but make sure that you visit, and love, the island before committing to a TS purchase.

c) Starwood controls their HomeOwner's Associations. Our maintenance fees (MF) in Kaanapali have nearly doubled in five years. This is making it increasingly difficult to own there and even more difficult to try and recoup your purchase price when selling. Currently there are THOUSANDS of Westin Hawaii resales on the market.

d) You can't use your unit but every other year, so $1300/year translates to $2600 in MFs. That is $350 a night over and above what are paying out of pocket to own it -- you can rent hotel rooms in this economy for $200/night. And we have no say in these rising MFs.

e) With Timesharing, you have to reserve your unit 12 months in advance in you want the best room. That means that you have to reserve your unit well before you can price out good airfare deals. If you use frequent flyer miles, this present problems as well.

f) If November works for you, that is the lowest season on Maui and it would be silly to own at a location that soaks you for $2600 in MFs that you could rent for less than, or close to, the MFs. It would be far more economical to buy one of the cheaper mandatory locations (such as Westin Kierland, Sheraton Vistana Villages) and simply trade into a Hawaii property. Hawaii is very easy to get into, especially in November. Data: A platinum 2 bdrm at Westin Kierland (Phoenix) goes for about $20k, and gives you sufficient Star Options to trade into any 2 bdrm in the system for less than HALF of Kauai's annual MFs.

g) Westin Princeville is a voluntary resort. That means that when you go to sell it, the new owner does not inherit the ability to trade within the Starwood network. Translation: Your unit loses most of its value on the resale market. So if you pay $36k today, you'd be lucky to fetch $12k on the resale market. (Data point: Currently there is one EOY 2 bdrm on Redweek for $15.8k; There are 7 EY units, with the lowest asking price of $24k. And note that there haven't been any recent sales.)

h) If the salesman said that you could trade easily to Westin St. John or Atlantis with your StarOptions, he lied. You may get into Atlantis during hurricane season. Don't count on trading into St. John ever, though some have gotten lucky. Certainly don't expect it during the summer. And those are the only two resorts where it would make sense for you to trade because the MFs are equivalent to what Hawaii owners pay. (Why pay $2600 in MFs to trade into a location where the MFs are $1300?)

i) If you love Kaanapali, definitely check out resales on these in a few months. Owners are getting their staggeringly high MF invoices now, and resale prices should drop like a stone. I paid $50k for my OF unit in 2007; I'd be lucky to fetch $30k now.

j) See my related thread about the rumor re Westin Princeville.

Good luck!

jarta · Nov 7, 2009

sam, ... You will get unanimous TUG advice to rescind this purchase. It is good advice. Princeville is a nice, new resort, but you can get to vacation there with an outlay of 1/2 the dollars - or less.

Buying resale at Princeville means that you cannot convert the Staroptions to hotel Starpoints. But, it also means there are no Staroptions that can be used for an internal Starwood exchange. Because Princeville is a "voluntary" resort, the resale buyer does not get them or their benefit.

Buying resale at Princeville means that you are limited to vacationing at Princeville in your season or depositing the week in Interval International and using that external timeshare trading company.

However, if you purchase resale at a "mandatory" Starwood resort, the Staroptions transfer with the purchase and can be used for an internal exchange into Princeville (or any other Starwood resort) at 8 months prior to arrival. As long as you do not absolutely need a specific prime week at Princeville, you should be OK at 8 months.

Until you better understand the intricacies of Starwood buying and trading, please do yourself a favor and rescind!

You can do better by reading the stickys at the very top of the TUG Starwood page, watching the posts on TUG for a while and making an informed decision later as to how to enter the Starwood timeshare system and what will work best for you.

What you need to do as a minimum if you really want to commit to the Starwood timeshare system is to first buy an inexpensive resale unit with many Staroptions associated with it and then "retro" that unit back into the Starwood system when you buy a week from the developer. Buying from Starwood directly without a "retro" of a resale unit already owned is throwing money away.

GLTY! ... eom

DeniseM · Nov 7, 2009

Please read this FAQ about rescinding.

My personal experience - we bought from the developer and paid $45K and the same unit went for $15K on ebay recently....you should absolutely rescind!

LisaRex · Nov 7, 2009

Oh, and to answer your specific question -- If you buy a voluntary unit on the resale market, you lose two things: the ability to trade within the SVN network and the ability to convert your unit to StarPoints (Starwood hotel program points).

If you love your resort and want to go there EOY, then neither of these perks will ever come into play. However, if you want to easily trade to other Starwood TSs, not being able to trade within SVN may be a significant loss in value.

However, it's becoming less of a perk everyday. Why? Because Starwood made a mistake when they created their system. Instead of tying MFs and/or demand, to the number of StarOptions an owner gets, they assigned generic, static values. In some cases, such as Westin St. John, their SO valuations are way below what demand and MFs would indicate. So St. John owners, who are paying a fortune to own there, rarely exchange anywhere else in the network because it would be a trade down. Ergo, few villas are ever available to trade INTO. So while tons of folks within the network have sufficient SOs to trade into St. John, and WANT to trade into St. John, it's useless currency because there's no inventory!

In other cases, like Cancun and Arizona, the SO valuations are way too high. A 2 bdrm villa in platinum season in Hawaii is assigned the same SOs as a 2 bdrm villa in platinum season in Cancun. So if a Hawaii owner, who pays $2500 in MFs, wants to use his 148,100 SOs to trade into Atlantis, he is competing against owners in Cancun or Arizona, who are paying ~$1400 for their 148,100 SOs. That's a crazy system.

Finally, the entire SVN network was created with the idea that the network would continue to grow into sought after locations such as Aruba and Cabo, which would ultimately spread the demand more evenly among people from the East Coast who want to escape to a warm place in the winter. They've completely scrapped those projects or put them on indefinite hold. We won't see another SVN resort enter into the equation for at least 3 years.

So the SVN network is really limited and there's a glaring disparity in demand, and cost of owning there, among their properties. Exacerbating the issue is the lack of common sense equity in SO assignment. That has created a bottleneck into 2 or 3 properties, leaving many owners frustrated and which is ultimately diluting the SVN benefit for SVO members.

**

Not being able to convert to StarPoints is less than an issue because the number of StarPoints they give you remains the same even as your MFs increase. I believe Princeville owners get 86,000 SPs if they want to convert, while Kaanapali owners get 80,000 SPs. However, you can BUY SPs off Starwood's website for 3.5 cents per. So even if you can get a great value out of those SPs (and those who travel to Europe, especially, can get great values per SP), you can get the same price per StarPoint right off the Starwood website (though you can only buy 40k per year per couple.)

The Starwood Vacation Network is in a state of flux right now. The top 2 resorts (Harborside and Westin St. John) are impossible to trade into, where the remaining resorts are fairly easy to trade into.

pointsjunkie · Nov 7, 2009

the SO in orlando for a 2 br LO during top season is only 95700, not 148100.

optimist · Nov 7, 2009

Good for you LISAREX

I am always amazed at the kindness that people show to others on this board.
You are amazing to take the time post such a detailed, informative and helpful answer. The OP is indeed lucky to have found you.

LisaRex · Nov 7, 2009

pointsjunkie said:
the SO in orlando for a 2 br LO during top season is only 95700, not 148100.

Thank you for that, pointsjunkie. You are absolutely correct. I've corrected my post to reflect reality, as I don't want to mislead anyone.

jerseygirl · Nov 7, 2009

LisaRex --

Your post #6 is the best summary of the situation I've ever seen. Very well done !!! :clap:

-- Jerseygirl

LisaRex · Nov 7, 2009

optimist said:
I am always amazed at the kindness that people show to others on this board.
You are amazing to take the time post such a detailed, informative and helpful answer. The OP is indeed lucky to have found you.

Thank you, optimist. I try to tell it like it is.

tinkerbell2 · Nov 7, 2009

LisaRex,

I read TUG almost everyday trying to educate myself. I like Westin resorts very much and would like to expand our " portfolio" one day . Your post is really to the point and clarifies the big picture very well. Thanks !

Rina

AwayWeGo · Nov 7, 2009

Voluntary & Mandatory.

Those 2 words strike me as just about the oddest terms in the whole specialized & semi-strange timeshare vocabulary.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.

Fredm · Nov 7, 2009

AwayWeGo said:
Those 2 words strike me as just about the oddest terms in the whole specialized & semi-strange timeshare vocabulary.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.

:rofl: :rofl:

Almost as good as calling the seasons Platinum, Gold , and Silver.
Precious metals sound sexier than Red White, Blue.

What could be next? Sexier yet are the precious stones; Diamonds Rubies and Emeralds. And don't you know... :hysterical:

vacationtime1 · Nov 7, 2009

LisaRex said:
g) Westin Princeville is a voluntary resort. That means that when you go to sell it, the new owner does not inherit the ability to trade within the Starwood network. Translation: Your unit loses most of its value on the resale market. So if you pay $36k today, you'd be lucky to fetch $12k on the resale market. (Data point: Currently there is one EOY 2 bdrm on Redweek for $15.8k; There are 7 EY units, with the lowest asking price of $24k. And note that there haven't been any recent sales.)

An every year Westin Princeville sold on eBay a couple of weeks ago for $13,300. We don't know whether the transaction actually closed, but it gives an indication of true market value.

Fredm said:
:rofl: :rofl:
Almost as good as calling the seasons Platinum, Gold , and Silver.
Precious metals sound sexier than Red White, Blue.

What could be next? Sexier yet are the precious stones; Diamonds Rubies and Emeralds. And don't you know... :hysterical:

In some of my own analysis, I use the categories of Platinum, Gold, and Lead. Many "lead" season resort weeks (summer in the desert, mud season in ski country) can be rented for less than the mandatory, repeating, and increasing maintenance fee. Owning these units in these seasons just weights you down, thus "lead".

DanCali · Nov 7, 2009

samthepoodle said:
We really need help! We are staying at the Kaanapali ORV (renting from a friend) and did the sales pitch and signed up for an EOY 2 BR at the Kauai property. It's $36k with 1,300 per year maintenance. We have 6 more days to rescind and are re-thinking our purchase.

We would like to own one of these but are thinking maybe we should buy re-sale. What are the downsides to that? I realize you can't get the hotel points and we don't care too much about that. Do they make it harder to reserve your week or trade the studio for another resort when you're a re-sale owner? The salesperson made it sound like there are all kinds of drawbacks but we need unbiased information...

Thanks!

You should rescind ASAP.

I was in your shoes a few months ago, found TUG and am grateful to this day.

First off, don't worry - the incentives valid "only today" will be fully available to you even if you decide to go with the exacyt same purchase in a few weeks. They have a direct sales department (800-601-8699) that is very current on incentives and will give you the exact same StarOptions, StarPoints etc when you buy from them. Your salesperson in Hawaii won't get his commission so he won't tell you this...

Second, as pointed out by others, you can buy the same unit on the resale market (my guess is that you can get a WPORV 2BR EOY for much less than current asking prices - I woudn't even pay $5K for one - in fact I wouldn't take one for free...) and then buy a $20K unit from the developer in Orlando or Scottsdale and in the process "requalify" your Princeville unit to restore the original benefits available to developer purchasers. You will still be at least $10,000 ahead and where you are now, own two units and have more options to vacation. Also, as a multiple week owner, doing this can also get you "Elite" status, which gives you some additional priviliges you don't have now. Moreover, if and when you sell your WPORV you at least won't feel like you lost 95% of your investment.

It's hard to add much more to what other people have said... Rescind, take your time to learn the things your salespeople didn't tell you, and then you can choose to become an owner on your own terms.

sjuhawk_jd · Nov 7, 2009

*WoodMFs2Hi said:
You should rescind ASAP.

I was in your shoes a few months ago, found TUG and am grateful to this day.

First off, don't worry - the incentives valid "only today" will be fully available to you even if you decide to go with the exacyt same purchase in a few weeks. They have a direct sales department (800-601-8699) that is very current on incentives and will give you the exact same StarOptions, StarPoints etc when you buy from them. Your salesperson in Hawaii won't get his commission so he won't tell you this...

Second, as pointed out by others, you can buy the same unit on the resale market (my guess is that you can get a WPORV 2BR EOY for much less than current asking prices - I woudn't even pay $5K for one - in fact I wouldn't take one for free...) and then buy a $20K unit from the developer in Orlando or Scottsdale and in the process "requalify" your Princeville unit to restore the original benefits available to developer purchasers. You will still be at least $10,000 ahead and where you are now, own two units and have more options to vacation. Also, as a multiple week owner, doing this can also get you "Elite" status, which gives you some additional priviliges you don't have now. Moreover, if and when you sell your WPORV you at least won't feel like you lost 95% of your investment.

It's hard to add much more to what other people have said... Rescind, take your time to learn the things your salespeople didn't tell you, and then you can choose to become an owner on your own terms.

Based on the advise here, when people rescind, should we ask them to tell the salesperson that they are canceling based on extremely helpful hands at the TUG. Just to show them the power of "Groundswell". Or maybe it is a bad idea!

samthepoodle · Nov 7, 2009

LisaRex said:
Sam, I'm glad you found this place while you're still in the recission period. Do yourself a huge favor and rescind immediately, using the instructions included in your packet. Then I'd enjoy the rest of my vacation, stress free, and re-visit Tug when you return home.

In the meantime, here's food for thought:

a) The Kauai property is very different from the Kaanapali property. For instance, it sits on a bluff overlooking the ocean. It's not directly on the beach like Kaanapali.

b) Have you even been to Kauai? It has a completely different vibe to it than Maui -- way more low key, with fewer restaurants and activities. For sure, ome people love Kauai, but make sure that you visit, and love, the island before committing to a TS purchase.

c) Starwood controls their HomeOwner's Associations. Our maintenance fees (MF) in Kaanapali have nearly doubled in five years. This is making it increasingly difficult to own there and even more difficult to try and recoup your purchase price when selling. Currently there are THOUSANDS of Westin Hawaii resales on the market.

d) You can't use your unit but every other year, so $1300/year translates to $2600 in MFs. That is $350 a night over and above what are paying out of pocket to own it -- you can rent hotel rooms in this economy for $200/night. And we have no say in these rising MFs.

e) With Timesharing, you have to reserve your unit 12 months in advance in you want the best room. That means that you have to reserve your unit well before you can price out good airfare deals. If you use frequent flyer miles, this present problems as well.

f) If November works for you, that is the lowest season on Maui and it would be silly to own at a location that soaks you for $2600 in MFs that you could rent for less than, or close to, the MFs. It would be far more economical to buy one of the cheaper mandatory locations (such as Westin Kierland, Sheraton Vistana Villages) and simply trade into a Hawaii property. Hawaii is very easy to get into, especially in November. Data: A platinum 2 bdrm at Westin Kierland (Phoenix) goes for about $20k, and gives you sufficient Star Options to trade into any 2 bdrm in the system for less than HALF of Kauai's annual MFs.

g) Westin Princeville is a voluntary resort. That means that when you go to sell it, the new owner does not inherit the ability to trade within the Starwood network. Translation: Your unit loses most of its value on the resale market. So if you pay $36k today, you'd be lucky to fetch $12k on the resale market. (Data point: Currently there is one EOY 2 bdrm on Redweek for $15.8k; There are 7 EY units, with the lowest asking price of $24k. And note that there haven't been any recent sales.)

h) If the salesman said that you could trade easily to Westin St. John or Atlantis with your StarOptions, he lied. You may get into Atlantis during hurricane season. Don't count on trading into St. John ever, though some have gotten lucky. Certainly don't expect it during the summer. And those are the only two resorts where it would make sense for you to trade because the MFs are equivalent to what Hawaii owners pay. (Why pay $2600 in MFs to trade into a location where the MFs are $1300?)

i) If you love Kaanapali, definitely check out resales on these in a few months. Owners are getting their staggeringly high MF invoices now, and resale prices should drop like a stone. I paid $50k for my OF unit in 2007; I'd be lucky to fetch $30k now.

j) See my related thread about the rumor re Westin Princeville.

Good luck!

Lisa Rex, thank you so much! Here are some replies to your questions:

We have been to Kauai and like it but probably like Maui better. The salesperson made it sound like it would be a piece of cake to trade into Maui if we wanted to visit Maui instead.

The salesperson did not tell us Kauai was not right on the beach. We love the beach access at Maui.

Will you please tell me more about the MF's? We were told 2600 (every other year but I guess we would still pay yearly). So 5 years ago they were 1300? My friend who owns at Marriot says hers are 1,000 for EY, maybe I should buy there?

Yes, the salesperson did make it sound like it would be very easy to go to Atlantis or St. John. My kids got very excited about Atlantis in particular and I had no idea we likely couldn't go there.

As to the November thing -- this is the last year it will work for us. Our kids have historically had a year round school schedule, but that is changing. Starting next summer, we will only be able to go summers, spring break and Christmas (which I know is hopeless).

With all that being said, does it make sense for me to buy one at all (even resale)? Is it hard to reserve your unit for the summer? Thank you very much!

DavidnRobin · Nov 7, 2009

jerseygirl said:
LisaRex --

Your post #6 is the best summary of the situation I've ever seen. Very well done !!!

-- Jerseygirl

Agree.

btw - SVN can go away - per CCRs - that is why there is a back-up resort association plan in the CCRs. At one point - I thought SVN would always be around - now I am not as confident.

also btw - I bought WPORV after I bought resale and found TUG. So whatever you do - do not listen to me - RESCIND!

Fredm · Nov 7, 2009

DavidnRobin said:
.

btw - SVN can go away - per CCRs - that is why there is a back-up resort association plan in the CCRs. At one point - I thought SVN would always be around - now I am not as confident.

Click to expand...

Right! SVN can disappear at any time.

If one wants to really be paranoid, the recent changes to the I.I. exchange methodology makes all owners subject to the same exchange rules. So, SVN can disappear and have zero affect on Starwood's control of inventory.

Sure, SVN dues will also disappear but they can be substituted with an I.I. kickback since I.I. dues are included in the SVN dues.

The more I think about it, the less far-fetched it sounds. I am having a hard time quantifying what is in it for Starwood to continue SVN. I was able to define it under old rules. But, not now. Hmmm..

DeniseM · Nov 7, 2009

samthepoodle said:
With all that being said, does it make sense for me to buy one at all (even resale)? Is it hard to reserve your unit for the summer? Thank you very much!

If you want to buy a timeshare - this is a good time for it - prices are at an all time low.

BUT - as you see from Lisa's post, there are multiple issues with Starwood.

It is easy for an owner to reserve their home resort any time as long as you call at exactly 12 mos. out at 8:59 a.m. ET. Owners have priority to reserve their home resort 8-12 mos. out, and after 8 mos., everyone else can get in, so you have to reserve early. I have been an owner since before WKORV was built, and I have always been able to get exactly the week I wanted, as long as I reserved early. However, at 8 mos. inventory gets snatched up by SW exchangers.

Right now you should focus 100% of your attention on rescinding, and then take your time and do your homework on the resale market. You might decide that you'd just rather rent. You should also investigate other timeshares in Hawaii. There are many nice options for a fraction of the cost of the Starwood resorts. We bought 2 ocean front units on Kauai at another resort for less for $2K and they are going for less than $1,000 now. The MF is only about $1,000, too.

There is absolutely no rush - prices are on their way down.

Good luck! :hi:

DanCali · Nov 7, 2009

Fredm said:
Right! SVN can disappear at any time.

If one wants to really be paranoid, the recent changes to the I.I. exchange methodology makes all owners subject to the same exchange rules. So, SVN can disappear and have zero affect on Starwood's control of inventory.

Sure, SVN dues will also disappear but they can be substituted with an I.I. kickback since I.I. dues are included in the SVN dues.

The more I think about it, the less far-fetched it sounds. I am having a hard time quantifying what is in it for Starwood to continue SVN. I was able to define it under old rules. But, not now. Hmmm..

I think they have a lot to lose from discontinuing SVN. If that happens, there is really no reason for owners to keep Starwood as a management company. You can have someone else run the reorts, have a large reduction in MFs, and trade through II without management controlling deposits. I am not sure what percentage of owners at SDO are developer buyers, but if most are resale buyers by now it really doesn't make sense to keep Starwood as the management company with no SVN access. In addition, is SVN goes away, it is also likely that owners at the most desireable resorts in the network (and the highest MFs) will opt to not join II at all - that can still end up in a large reduction in revenue.

In my view, I think the whole mandatory/voluntary is making them miss out on huge revenue opportunities, especially since they are not developing new resorts so they don't need to "convince people that buying resale is a bad idea". At most resorts (except mandatory), every developer buyer selling their unit to a resale buyer is a loss of SVN fees in perpetuity to Starwood. Stawood can do much better by expanding SVN and upsell non-svn owners to turn their unit into a mandatory one. By this I don't mean a one time fee of $600 valid until the next resale - but charge thousands of dollars and keep the unit in SVN forever. They can easily charge a SDO Platinum 2BR owner $5000 or more for the privilege - just compare resale prices of a platinum WKV to resale prices of a platinum SDO... and the main difference between the two is SVN access. Similarly, they can charge thousands of SVR owners $1000-$5000 for the privilege etc... Not only do they get the front end revenue, but also perpetual SVN fees. This, in my view, is the cure to the malady - obviously along with reducing MFs so their brand doesn't dilute to nothingness and people actually want to buy into SVN...

jerseygirl · Nov 7, 2009

DavidnRobin said:
Agree.

btw - SVN can go away - per CCRs - that is why there is a back-up resort association plan in the CCRs. At one point - I thought SVN would always be around - now I am not as confident.

also btw - I bought WPORV after I bought resale and found TUG. So whatever you do - do not listen to me - RESCIND!

Yes, I realize SVN can go away (or Starwood can disassociate resorts and leave owners out in the cold, like they did with St Augustine). And, I agree with you ... I'm also not so confident they'll always be around. Right now, they use membership solely as a marketing tool. If they stop building new resorts, they'll have no motivation to keep the network open.

But, what I was pointing to is a little bit different. Here is the exact wording:

8.4 Special Exchange Programs. SVN Operator reserves the right, from time to time, to enter into special exchange relationships with any entity other than an External Exchange Company pursuant to which SVN Members will have access to selected non-SVN resorts and non-SVN owners will have access to SVN accommodations after the Home Resort Preference Period. Any special exchange programs will be governed by reservation rules and regulations similar to those governing an External Exchange Program.

In re-reading it, I think they're saying:

SVN can enter into a special exchange relationship with any entity (e.g., Disney, Hyatt, Hilton) pursuant to which SVN members will have access to selected (Disney, Hyatt, Hilton) resorts and (Disney, Hyatt, Hilton) owners will have access to SVN accommodations after the Home Resort Preference Period ...

Hilton did this with Interwest ... we can book Interwest resorts with our HGVC points and vice versa.

There is another clause (often mentioned on TUG) that allows for Starwood to let resale owners into SVN, such as they did at Vistana Resort after the special assessments were announced. Here's that wording:

SVN Operator reserves the right to expand or reduce the list of eligible Owners who may may participate in SVN in its sole discretion.

There's lots of fun stuff in those documents if you're bored enough to read them! I need a new hobby!

DavidnRobin · Nov 7, 2009

per CCRs - these non-SVN resort territories (for lack of a better name that comes to me) - they are named for each specific resort areas. I can live w/o SVN - only WKV is of value to me thru SVN, but I am happy with going/renting.

Of course SVN has value to SVO - but if the house of cards falls... per CCRs there are back-up resort territories set-up.

LisaRex · Nov 7, 2009

samthepoodle said:
Will you please tell me more about the MF's? We were told 2600 (every other year but I guess we would still pay yearly). So 5 years ago they were 1300? My friend who owns at Marriot says hers are 1,000 for EY, maybe I should buy there?

Marriott Maui Ocean Club's MFs are hovering around $2k for a 2 bdrm.

When WKORV-N opened in 2006, its MFs were around $1400. They are now $2500. There have been double digit increases every year they've been around. As MFs increase, more people will walk away or be unable to pay their MFs and that will leave the remaining owners to hold the bag.

WKORV is a great resort and Maui is a great island. However, most owners are disgusted with Starwood, and Maui county, right now. We are being taken to the cleaners. I certainly wouldn't buy into the system right now, especially with so many rentals being offered for close to the cost of MFs. Save your money and rent. Then you can wait until you've secured airfare, etc., and then shop around for an owner who will give you the best price. There is honestly very, very little reason to buy there.

Re-thinking purchase!! HELP

samthepoodle

lprstn

TUG Review Crew: Veteran

LisaRex

TUG Review Crew

jarta

DeniseM

LisaRex

TUG Review Crew

pointsjunkie

optimist

LisaRex

TUG Review Crew

jerseygirl

LisaRex

TUG Review Crew

tinkerbell2

AwayWeGo

TUG Review Crew: Expert

Fredm

vacationtime1

TUG Review Crew: Veteran

DanCali

sjuhawk_jd

samthepoodle

DavidnRobin

Fredm

DeniseM

DanCali

jerseygirl

DavidnRobin

LisaRex

TUG Review Crew