New Marriott timeshares in the planning/thinking stages

When I last posted on this topic, here was the list that came from inside Marriott:

The only for-sure resorts that I know about that aren't already in sales are OP Sequel (on the site of the Crowne Plaza) and Marco Island (site of the old Radisson Hotel).

The other possible Marriott-branded properties that I'm aware of, as discussed in that other thread, are....

Grand Bahama - Marriott owns land, but the project is stalled.

Cancun - Has been discussed often by Marriott, but - so far - it hasn't worked out.

Kauai Lagoons - Likely, but nothing definite.

Puerto Vallarta - This rumor has been around for at least the last six years, with no substantiation.

Tuscany (Italy) - Probably - eventually; not imminent and not definite.

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Now, from a significant recent internal Marriott meeting comes an updated list, ranked by probability, not by when the project would start:

1. Marco Island (discussed in this forum here)
2. OP Sequel
3. Cancun (on hotel strip)
4. Waikiki, Oahu (adjacent to hotel)
5. Cancun Sequel (off hotel strip)
6. Grand Bahamas, but a Marriott hotel is the first priority
7. Grande Lakes Orlando (Grande Vista sequel) (discussed in post #2 here)

There are no additional ski resorts on the list.

There was apparently no significant discussion about planned resorts in the Asia Pacific region for the new Marriott points timeshare program discussed here

Dave M said:

There are no additional ski resorts on the list.

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Bummer...I want another Marriott ski resort.

Dave,

Any word on the Grand Res @ Keystone? Project seems to have stalled.

The only info I have is that the project still shows up on the Grand Residence website. Thus, I'm assuming it will be completed eventually.

I just visited the Wakiki Marriott and there is no property adjacent to the hotel so that will likely have to make an expensive acquisition and either renovate or demolish to get in that location.

Hmmmm, maybe the salesman at OP had it partially correct then.

When I asked about OP Sequel, he said it wasn't going to happen and had never even been planned. He said that the property to be built on the old Ocean Mall lot was a hotel. He also mentioned that the Hilton and the Crowne Plaza hotels had been sold and were slated to come out soon. What he failed to mention was that OP Sequel was to be built on the old Crowne Plaza site.

It is interesting the OP Sequel will be built on a lot that is some distance away from Ocean Pointe. That also appears to be a small lot of land and will require a high rise like Beach Place Towers to make it work.

I do know from watching the news that Marriott has plans for a high rise Condo/hotel to go on the site of the old Ocean Mall. Those plans are stalled over local opposition. The residents are worried about traffic congestion, access to the public beach and parking issues. According to the news report, the city council had not given final approval to the project when we were there.

Where do Asians like to vacation? IMO, that's the market Marriott needs to be looking at. Our market in the west (US/Europe) is mature and I daresay stale.

Hope they made the right choice...

Pat

camachinist said:

Where do Asians like to vacation? IMO, that's the market Marriott needs to be looking at. Our market in the west (US/Europe) is mature and I daresay stale.

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Well I've only been to Jamaica in the Caribbean, but I could say that I could count the number of Asians I've seen there on one hand!!

Now Florida seems to get busloads of them....

And Hawaii, well I think Japanese is the main langauge! Well it was when I visited 14 years ago. I remember the McDonalds having their menu in two languages.

I remember the last Asian invasion into California; they bought up everything in sight.

The next one will make the last one look like a futile exercise.

IMO, the region will be the next world economic power.

Pat

Adding to my initial post....

Kauai Lagoon is virtually certain.

As earlier announced by Marriott, there will be a number of additions in Asia in the points program within the next three years.

Sequel, sequel, sequel....

There must be good business reasons that make sequels so attractive to Marriott.

As an owner, however, I think that variety is the spice of life. I'd much prefer to see new properties developed in new and different locationst.. That would increase my options in vacation planning, and increase the value I get from being an owner in MVCI.

camachinist said:

Where do Asians like to vacation? IMO, that's the market Marriott needs to be looking at. Our market in the west (US/Europe) is mature and I daresay stale.

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camachinist said:

Not that asians shouldnt be reckoned with as a huge up and coming market, but as long as americans have plenty of money, the market will never grow stale as there will always be a market for newer/bigger/better resorts, not to mention new generations coming to apoint of ability to puchase timeshares.

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camachinist said:

Where do Asians like to vacation?

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I can only speak for Japan. It seems to me that Japanese people love going to the States, Australia and to a lesser extent Europe (more expensive). They also travel within Asia to Korea, Malaysia, Thiland etc. when they have shorter vacations.

I would like to see more Marriott resorts in Europe, Australia and Asia. Especially near Paris, Rome, London, Sydney, Melbourne, etc. I really like resorts near or in the city.

I think a lot of Americans also would enjoy city-based resorts in major European cities and, for that matter, a few major US cities (NYC, Washington DC, etc.). I'm guessing that it is the high cost of land that has stopped Marriott from entering these areas. It is a shame, though, because not only would it be an asset to current owners, I think it would attract a broader interest base.

Although I don't think our western market is stale, as suggested above, the so-called baby-boomers' babies are now in their twenties and thirties and they have been raised in a globalized world with a much greater exposure to travel, amongst other things. International destinations would be more enticing, especially to this entering customer base.

DaveM: Where would Kauai Lagoon be located on the island?

I may be able to find out, but I don't have that info now. I'll ask....

I agree. Marriott needs to devlop one in NYC.

Real estate values are topping, the US economy is slowing, the war in Iraq is taking its toll on the country's psyche. Easy money has gone on too long in relation to other economic factors IMO. I'm starting to see upticks in bankruptcies and loan defaults (in my capacity as a loan committee member) for people with stable, well-paying jobs.

The rich will likely always be rich, but my take is timeshares are marketed overwhelmingly to the middle classes, which are shrinking as a percentage of the total population. It may not seem so to those who don't socialize outside their socio-economic group, but I interview a wide variety of classes in my "job", as well as see same in my business. I consider us lower middle class, if that, and very few of our contemporaries have knowledge of timesharing, beyond the generalization that it's "bad", and only two of my wife's clients/co-workers own timeshares and none of my clients (mostly business owners) own one. More importantly, amongst those queried, none plan to own one.

Perhaps a more appropriate descriptor of the domestic timeshare market is "mature", with regards to the current cycle. I thought stale might get a few reactions

NYC, Australia, more in Asia all sound like good possibilities. More importantly, Marriott needs to maintain their brand quality, something I've been less confident of lately. PR is one thing, but delivering is quite another. I'm hopeful but vigilent...

Pat

Cathyb said:

Where would Kauai Lagoon be located on the island?

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It will be adjacent to the current Marriott properties. The project will include million-dollar home lots, multi-million dollar condos and some private islands. Also included will be a Ritz fractional resort, selling for upwards of $300,000 for 21 days of use per year. Ritz-Carlton Residences (a branded name) are expected to sell for $4.5 million and up.

Of the timeshare units, 72 will be the Ritz fractionals and 224 will be traditional but V-E-R-Y N-I-C-E MVCI units.

In addition to the Marriott timeshares and Ritz fractionals, some of the condos will be under the Marriott Grande Residences brand, thus being available (?) for exchanges through II.

Sales for some portions of the project - not including Marriott timeshares - have commenced.

Ground-breaking for the first phase of the ten-year development project, which will include an MVCI Sales office, is scheduled for early 2007.

Needless to say, this project is huge!

Thanks much for your continued posts Dave, regarding upcoming Marriott MVCI resorts. I don't know where you get your info, but as an owner, I'm always interested in what new projects are coming along. The Kauai Lagoons project sounds real interesting; nothing I could probably afford, but interesting just the same.

Thanks again.

camachinist said:

Perhaps a more appropriate descriptor of the domestic timeshare market is "mature", with regards to the current cycle. I thought stale might get a few reactions

Pat

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Interesting anyalysis, but perhaps those buying timeshares differs in different areas. After we decided to buy my husband was talking to many people he encounters at work and was shocked to hear how many owned and loved their timeshares- and most of them are anywhere from their mid twenties to late forties/early fifties. I assume this is a younger age group than you are referring to.

Cancun

I heard that MVCI has purchased a Cancun hotel that was ruined in the hurricane and will be building a Marriott Vacation Club from scratch. No other details are available at this time but sales should start in about a year.

This is the first confirmation regarding Cancun that I have had since my message in post #1.

Dave M said:

I heard that MVCI has purchased a Cancun hotel that was ruined in the hurricane and will be building a Marriott Vacation Club from scratch. No other details are available at this time but sales should start in about a year.

This is the first confirmation regarding Cancun that I have had since my message in post #1.

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I heard the same from salesperson a few weeks ago.....I was really hoping it was going to be next to the JW.

Dave- do you know where the property is in relation to the other resorts there?

As I stated, I have no other details yet.