[2008] Purchase question....opinions please

We just came back from our second trip in two years from Harborside. We really loved both of our trips and have decided that we want to own a week there now. We want to buy gold season, we want phase 2 and we want a three bedroom unit. We had a two bedroom l/o the last two years and really would like to have the extra bedroom and bathroom.

My choices are to buy developer, 55k and get exactly what I want. They will retro my WKV (148k so) and will take me right to 4* elite.

Or

Buy resale for around 35k and and remain Elite less. But own two 2 bedrooms l/o at WKV, 2 studios WSJ and one 3 bedroom l/o at HRA.


We really are activily pursuing the Elite status tiers. But if why buy at Harborside, it does jump us to that 4* level. We are going to purchase a Harborside week regardless.

Unless you going for 5* I don't see any of the elite benifits as being worth the developer purchase.The plat level spg is the greatest elite value. Harborside is a great resort and if you really like then it pays to buy the uniit/season you like.RESALE

We are really leaning that way, but I figured I dot my i's and cross my t's first, and maybe get some other perspectives that i might be missing.

When I read the list of 4* and 5* perks, the only one that really jumps out is the platinum for life....(or until they discontinue the program). But that really only seems to come in play at the Hotel level, not the timeshare level.

Agreed. Either go to 5* with the intention of using the PFL benefit for everything it's worth OR buy resale and forego the elite thing altogether.

Seemingly people pay a lot more than the $20,000 difference to get to 5*. Having had SPG Platinum and almost not requalifying, I know how much it has been worth to me.

My big and persistent question remains - PFL is only valuable in hotels. How many people with enough weeks in timeshares (and often in lockouts so they can get additional weeks) can take enough additional time off for hotel travel, at least enough to make it that worthwhile?

I've made Platinum the last few years with local mileage runs so it has cost me from $600 - 750 to retain my benefits. Then comes an suite upgrade in a European hotel and I feel I'm way ahead. But for me personally, four to eight weeks a year in timeshares would not leave much time for additional major travel.

Check out SDkath's post...she is very helpful in this...

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71543&highlight=starwood+elite

I'd send her an email...she knows the ins and outs....and is very helpful

Couldn't you buy HRA resale and then buy a cheaper unit from the developer with your $20K savings? You could then retro all of them and possibly be that much closer to 5*.

Just a thought.

thinze3 said:

Couldn't you buy HRA resale and then buy a cheaper unit from the developer with your $20K savings? You could then retro all of them and possibly be that much closer to 5*.

Just a thought.

Click to expand...

No and here is why. If I buy HRA resale, I need another $40k min to requalify it. So if I spend $35k HRA resale, then spend $20k to requalify WKV, I still will spend $55k and have about the same amount of SO.

The 3 bedroom gold is worth 125,000 staroptions

stevens397 said:

I've made Platinum the last few years with local mileage runs so it has cost me from $600 - 750 to retain my benefits. Then comes an suite upgrade in a European hotel and I feel I'm way ahead. But for me personally, four to eight weeks a year in timeshares would not leave much time for additional major travel.

Click to expand...

You're not kidding. It seems some people have far more free time than I do, both to vacation and to PLAN those vacations.

However, I'm not sure everyone who buys all those weeks plan to use them all themselves. I think a lot of folks use the StarPoint conversion option and/or rent out some of their timeshares.

... or take along friends and family.

Currently we take at least 2 or 3 week long trips and 3 or 4 half week trips a year. We rent our unsed points/weeks to cover maintenance fees. At least one of the trips we will take another family.

Hi tomandrobin,

I'm glad you and your family had fun at Harborside last week. I'm sorry we couldn't go, but glad you were able to use our villa (and FYI, despite my best efforts here on TUG, I understand that our assigned villa DID NOT have a dumpster view). I'm also glad that WE are not the ones to get bitten by the "buy another timeshare" bug . . . ..

Regarding that, I would try this argument with your salesperson:

Given the current state of the economy and the current upgrade & retro/requal rules (and assuming these are still the current prices) let your Harborside salesperson know that you are well aware that instead of buying from him/her, if you stair-step buy your way into a 2 BR L/O Event week in Cancun (WLOR) for $49,950 (all in), you can requalify 3 of your current resales. This is how you would do it:

Step 1: Buy a developer annual Gold 2 BR L/O in Cancun (WLOR) for $28,950.00 (and requalify your first WKV with it);

Step 2: Upgrade that Gold WLOR to a Platinum WLOR 2 BR L/O by paying the difference in price ($10,000, the minimum required to upgrade) (and requalify your second WKV with it)

Step 3. Upgrade that Platinum WLOR to an Event week WLOR 2 BR L/O by paying the difference in price ( $10,000, the minimum required to upgrade) (and requalify the WSJ property with the highest StarOption value)

So for $49,950 (new money) you’ve got 149,100 StarOptions from your developer purchased WLOR and (hopefully depending on whether any of your WSJ properties are valued at at least 114,700 StarOptions when requaled) at least 410,900 StarOptions from your requaled resales to bring you above the 559,000 StarOptions needed for 5 Star Elite.

If your salesperson is still following you here, then tell them you are willing to spend $5000 more money than actually needed to make 5 Star by buying a 3 BR Gold at Harborside from him/her instead of that 2 BR Event Week in Cancun (from someone else), so long as you can requal the same 3 (mandatory already for heaven’s sake) resales you already have.

If your salesperson balks, find another salesperson, and keep trying. Someone in SVO's salesforce will at least be willing to take this issue up the food chain for you.

Regarding the value of being an elite member, I can say that as a lowly 3 star elite, the benefits are few and far between, if any. SPG Platinum status is, at least in my mind, the only true value of being a 5 Star Elite. From my limited testing of SPG Platinum status, however, based on my particular usage patterns, it isn’t worth the price of admission . . . . especially when that price is $20,000!.

If you elect to go with a developer purchase, I’d definitely work the system to get more than just one of your resales requaled. I’d even make that request a show-stopper. (I bet if you walk away, they’ll blink.)

Please let us know what you decide to do, and update us regularly on the process.

Good Luck,
-nodge

My first WKV was a developer purchase, pre-tug, like most of us here. My second is resale. The WSJ units are studios, also resale, but are worth(less) only 44,000 SO. Not really worth the effort or cost to requalify.

I am 99% sure we are going to buy resale. I really wanted to hear other opinions. I do see the value of PFL, if you stay at hotels, but we mostly don't. I already feel that we get a lot of value from our units without being any level of Elite.

We don't mind travelling in shoulder season, but we want to have the flexibility of booking in late June or July too. Plus we want a three bedroom. The only way to achieve that goal is by owning at the resort.

Once again...Thanks! We owe you, and appreciate your generous offer. The view really was great. The kids (15,16,17,20,21,22 not really kids) were like "How come we don't get to see the Harbor and Atlantis from our balcony". We sat our there and watched the sunset! Very nice!

Why not buy a EOY 3 bedroom HRA with STarwood and retro WKV? You need $20K to retr'd a unit... Buy the other half and retr'd another resale. This will get you to 5 *

148100 (original) + 148100 (retr'd) + 148100 (retr'd) + 125000 (HRA) = 569000

tomandrobin said:

No and here is why. If I buy HRA resale, I need another $40k min to requalify it. So if I spend $35k HRA resale, then spend $20k to requalify WKV, I still will spend $55k and have about the same amount of SO.

The 3 bedroom gold is worth 125,000 staroptions

Click to expand...

I don't think that's right. Here is a scenario for you. Buy HRA resale for $20,000. Let's say original purchase price of said resale was $35,000 (guess only). Then go to Starwood, tell them you want to upgrade your HRA resale to the exact unit you want and pay the difference ($20,000 in this case: $55k-$35k). Retro WKV at the same time.

Savings is $15,000 at least and you get WKV retro'd. AND you get the unit you want in the end. That's what I would do.

You don't need $40,000 difference in price. As a matter of fact, to upgrade you only need $10,000 difference. And to retro WKV, you only need $20,000 total cost (including the resale credit you get). The $40,000 is only if you are retroing a HI unit or a Carrib unit. But WKV is ok at $20k.

Hope that makes sense. PM me if not. K

myip said:

Why not buy a EOY 3 bedroom HRA with STarwood and retro WKV? You need $20K to retr'd a unit... Buy the other half and retr'd another resale. This will get you to 5 *

148100 (original) + 148100 (retr'd) + 148100 (retr'd) + 125000 (HRA) = 569000

Click to expand...

Even better plan!! And simpler. K

SDKath said:

Even better plan!! And simpler. K

Click to expand...

If only I had found tug first, before the first WKV purchase.

tomandrobin said:

The view really was great. The kids (15,16,17,20,21,22 not really kids) were like "How come we don't get to see the Harbor and Atlantis from our balcony". We sat our there and watched the sunset! Very nice!

Click to expand...

Hey, maybe that view room was one of those vague, super secret "surprise and delight" benefits imposed by SVO's legal department.

Would THAT be worth $20,000?

-nodge

SDKath said:

Here is a scenario for you. Buy HRA resale for $20,000. Let's say original purchase price of said resale was $35,000 (guess only). Then go to Starwood, tell them you want to upgrade your HRA resale to the exact unit you want and pay the difference ($20,000 in this case: $55k-$35k). Retro WKV at the same time.

Click to expand...

So I spend $40k, plus two closing costs instead of $55k and one closing cost. Net savings of about $13,000.

SDKath said:

You don't need $40,000 difference in price. As a matter of fact, to upgrade you only need $10,000 difference. And to retro WKV, you only need $20,000 total cost (including the resale credit you get). The $40,000 is only if you are retroing a HI unit or a Carrib unit. But WKV is ok at $20k.

Click to expand...

Ok, I think what I misunderstood here was since HRA was a Caribbean purchase, it had to be a 40k transaction. That only applies if the requal unit is Caribbean.

So I can still buy resale, upgrade and retro for a three bedroom resale cost.

nodge said:

Would THAT be worth $20,000?

-nodge

Click to expand...

Last time I checked, the pool deck chairs were still free at sunset!

tomandrobin said:

So I spend $40k, plus two closing costs instead of $55k and one closing cost. Net savings of about $13,000.



Ok, I think what I misunderstood here was since HRA was a Caribbean purchase, it had to be a 40k transaction. That only applies if the requal unit is Caribbean.

So I can still buy resale, upgrade and retro for a three bedroom resale cost.

Click to expand...

Yes. Someone else just confirmed a similar scenario. The $40k is for RETROING a unit that is in HI or Carib., not for the one you are purchasing from them. But your purchase at $55,000 total price would meet requirements for both scenarios. So quick, go buy a resale WKORV and retro it.
K

The other Elite benefits that I use in Maui are early check-in and late check-out. I'm usually arriving in the morning from another island so I time it to go by Costco and get in just before 2 for early check-in, before the major airlines start arriving in the afternoon. My flight back to Dallas leaves around 5:00 pm so its nice to be able to check out at noon or a little later. I've also waitlisted while holding a reservation but in that case I ended up not needing the waitlist. Still, nice to have.

The other thing to think about is the ability to combine Staroptions once you retro (independent of status). That might come in handy if you want to rent more than one of the 3BR at HRA or WSJ in high season. It also makes the Staroptions of your WSJ studios more useful.

None of these (or even Platinum for Life) should be the main goal of a purchase. They are just nice and useful enhancements to ownership. Purchases should be because you want to use the timeshare (I know this is what tomandrobin are really after).

Is it worth the money? Is a BMW really that much better than a Lexus or Acura or a Toyota or a Honda? Do you buy other expensive stuff when a cheaper alternative would do almost as much? Only you can decide what the worth is.

SDKath said:

Yes. Someone else just confirmed a similar scenario. The $40k is for RETROING a unit that is in HI or Carib., not for the one you are purchasing from them. But your purchase at $55,000 total price would meet requirements for both scenarios. So quick, go buy a resale WKORV and retro it.
K

Click to expand...

But I am already sitting on a WKV platinum unit that was bought resale. I have to work with what I have.

emuyshondt said:

The other Elite benefits that I use in Maui are early check-in and late check-out. I'm usually arriving in the morning from another island so I time it to go by Costco and get in just before 2 for early check-in, before the major airlines start arriving in the afternoon.

Click to expand...

We checked in early the last two years at Harborside. Last year we had our rooms at noon.

I know. I was just kidding. But if you ever do want to own in HI, now is the time to buy one resale (for 1/4 the sales price) and retro it with your HRA purchase. Unless of course you are planning on spending >$40,000 AGAIN with Starwood someday.

You can sell your WKV and since it was resale, you'd probably come out even. Lots of work but substantial savings in the end...

Katherine