Can Northwest change the dates?

[sml2181]

We booked Northwest tickets AMS - ATL; which is a KLM operated direct flight. Flights were booked on the Northwest USA website.
Yesterday, I received notice that this flight has been cancelled due to Northwest/Delta going together.
They changed our flights - 2 days later departure and 2 days later return, again on a KLM operated direct flight.

We can't travel on these new dates and I immediately requested to be on the direct Delta flights AMS-ATL, which in my view shouldn't be a problem at all - NW and Delta...I checked if Delta had seats available which they still have.

According to NW, it can't be done. If I really need to travel on the dates which I purchased in the first place, we have to go to Paris first, with a 10 hours wait in Paris.
Delta still has the seats available and according to them, it shouldn't be a problem at all.

Then I called NW/KLM in Holland. They said it shouldn't be a problem at all and they changed it in their system but, since the tickets were booked on the USA website, NW in the US should make it final.
They (NW USA) refused to do it and changed it again - now to my original flight dates but with the 10 hours stop in Paris. They said that the best they could do was the direct KLM flight 2 days later - which is out of the question for us as we will be too late for the competition which brings us to ATL in the first place. They even said that it is normal to have a change of dates and no, they couldn't or wouldn't refund my money.

Called NW/KLM in Holland again and they changed it back to the Delta direct flights, but again, they said that NW in the US should make it final.

I will call NW USA later today.

What can I tell them to make this change happen in the way I want it (the Delta direct flight)? How should I handle this? I already spoke with a supervisor and to his supervisor, but that hasn't helped.

Any suggestions are more than welcome!

[Jimster]

This is not NORMAL or at least not normal on most airlines. My guess is you got a very cheap flight and they are trying to find another way to squeeze a few more dollars out of you. Welcome to that special world of Delta. I just love Carolinian's signature- DELTA- Driving Every Loyal Traveler Away. In my mind, this is ridiculous! Maybe it is why I have sworn never to fly Delta again. My only suggestion is to call Delta back again and plead your case. Just because one CSR and even the supervisor said it, doesn't make it true. At the VERY LEAST they should refund your money.

[sml2181]

Hi Jimster,

Thanks for your reply .

In this case, is it really Delta, where they told me that there should not be a problem and where they tell me that it should be easy to get on the Delta direct flight, or, is the problem with NW - who tells me that it can't be done..?
Or, because of the NW/Delta thing, is it indeed Delta in the end?

[Carolinian]

Delta owns NW now. They are playing a sleight of hand trick with you. In fact if you search flights on the NW website, it is often that the first flight or two that pop up are DL flights.

Before the DL takeover, if a NW flight was cancelled, they would go overboard to accomodate you. Not anymore.

With a flight originating in Europe, the EU rules may apply and may force them to give you a refund.

[hibbeln]

I almost fell off my chair when I read your post. It sounds very familiar to me just opposite on the Delta/NWA part.

We booked tickets on Delta in June 2008 for an Easter trip to Greece. 5 tickets total for our family. Prices at that time were at $1,431 per ticket. With the price of oil going up, I just grabbed them. Do the math, well over $7,000. Ouch!

Delta since February has changed the flights a few times. Changing a non-stop first leg from Detroit to JFK to become a Detroit-Cincinnati-JFK leg. Then would change it back. Then would change it again. I wasn't thrilled, but figured there was nothing I could do about it.

THEN this weekend my MIL (who is going with us) realized that the latest round of changes had our return flight moved up from Sunday to Saturday. WHAT?! No way we're cutting out a whole day of a trip to Greece. Now they had finally gone too far for even a non-confrontational person like me.

So I started calling. Our flight had been cancelled (Athens - JFK- Detroit). The only way out on Sunday like we'd planned was to fly Athens - Paris -Cincinnatti-Detroit. Ugh. If you've ever made a connection (or missed a connection!) in Paris, you'll know why we weren't thrilled. And we only had 2 hours in Paris to make the connection, and then 1 hour in Cincinnatti to land, get off the plane, get our luggage, clear customs and immigration, recheck our luggage, and get back on the plane. Uh uh. Making the Paris connection was dicey. Making the Cincinnatti connection was impossible.

So anyway, I talked myself blue in the face with Delta, and they said "that's the best flight you can get".

I went to sleep Sunday night, and woke up more annoyed. That just didn't work for us and I didn't fancy ending a trip with being stranded in Paris or Ohio with my kids and MIL in tow. So I looked up on the computer and saw LOTS of good flights on Delta air partners (Northwest, KLM and Air France) as well as Delta, including a non-stop from Paris to Detroit that would give us a blessed 3 hours to make the connection.

Called up Delta AGAIN and they said "Nope, you can't have it because if we're switching you on carriers then the fare code has to be EXACTLY the same and there were none of the EXACT same fare code seats left on that flight." Or on any of the other better flights I found.

So then I hung up and stumped around the house feeling discontented and then thought SOMEONE MUST BE ABLE TO OVERRIDE THAT. So I called back. And got into an argument with a Customer Relations Supervisor. Delta owns Northwest, so why can't they have more leniency with the fare codes? Went around and around and around. Got nowhere. We both got angry. She finally said "The only other thing I can do is give you a full refund!" and I said I didn't want one because we are only about 3 weeks to travel date! How the heck was I supposed to get a decent airfare?
So we hung up (OK, I slammed the phone down).
Then I looked at my computer and thought "Could I get a better fare?"I checked Orbitz and the websites of AirFrance, NWA, Delta, and KLM.
I discovered that the flight they wanted to stick me on was actually cheaper than what I had originally paid.
And I also discovered that the non-stop flight out of Paris that I wanted to switch to (found on the Delta website, and that they swore they couldn't stick me on) was ALSO $150/ticket cheaper than my original flight.
And I ALSO found a special web-only fare on Northwest with great stops and flights and times for HALF OF THE DELTA FARE I HAD ORIGINALLY PAID. I freaked out! So I scurried back to the phone, called Delta, said "OK, give me my refund." And they did (of course, this involved over an hour on hold, but...)
Get this.....

I saved $3,515 by having Delta refund my tickets and buying the new super-cheap airfare on Northwest!

The fare I got still floors me, because it's to Greece over Easter and I've never seen airfares to Greece that low at any time of year.

So now we have an extra $3,515 to spend in Greece.
This kind of thing never happens to me.

Moral of the Story: Check fares on other airlines and see if you want them to refund your money and go elsewhere to rebook!

[hibbeln]

Oh, and Carolinian, I kept thinking about your little DELTA acronym at the end of your posts......I know what you mean, now!

And sorry to everyone because I know I spelled Cincinnatti several ways and never got it right. At least I don't have to fly through there now!

[sml2181]

Wow.

I feel (yes, still am in the middle of things-) exactly what you must have felt.

Great though that you saves so much - it is unbelievable how much prices went down! Today I saw prices rt AMS-NYC for 434$...still looking if I can fit it in.

And yes, I did do the 1-hour thing in Cinci....and we made it, but obviously, if I had a choice I wouldn't book it myself.

Isn't it strange that I have the complete opposite with Delta/NW?

I have never had any problems with Delta (the Cinci...was because our flight from AMS had a delay due to customers not showing up while their luggague was on board already).
Just once I booked NW - and only because we are traveling with other people who prefer to have the "Dutch service" (our NW flight was operated by KLM) otherwise we would have booked the cheaper Delta flights. (Paid 1300$ but Delta was 900$ - these were group rates, not the lowest available rates.)


I have booked my flights on the Delta website now as we just have to be there at that specific day and I am still waiting for Northwest to do something. They (Northwest) still don't think I should get a refund because they were able to switch flights for me!!!! They still think it is absolutely normal to re-book flights with a 2 day difference.
Northwest Holland is still trying to fix it now for me.

Unbelievable.

I think I am going to request the United elite status match...as I booked my Hawaii flights with them for July. Never flown United before, so we'll see. United came out almost 4,000 EURO cheaper than the others. Hope they still fly in July.

[hibbeln]

4,000 EUROS cheaper?! Holy smoke!

[hibbeln]

When you get on the phone, ask immediately for Customer Relations (International Reservations section?). Then ask for a supervisor. Don't waste your breath with anyone less. It took me 4 phone calls and I kept saying "I'm not satisfied with this. I won't accept this." If you can find other tickets that will work, tell them you want a full and complete refund. My tickets were non-refundable, but they gave me a 100% refund to my credit card (and without a fuss once we got to that point).

[hibbeln]

Look at this other post if you're thinking about Continental. 25% off European airfares.
http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=93611

[LisaRex]

It's "Cincinnati" folks.

I'm aghast that they won't offer you a better routing. A few years ago, I booked a flight from Cincinnati to Honolulu that started off with a nice 2 hour layover in Atlanta and ended with a 6 hour layover in LAX. I called and said it was unacceptable and they booked me on the direct flight from Cincinnati to Honolulu. I would have booked it originally but there were no saver seats available.

I'd advise posting this story on FlyerTalk and asking them for advice. People there know the rules far better than I do. I think the airlines can move you around, but within reason. Certainly 2 days is not reasonable.

[djs]

Originally Posted by LisaRex

I called and said it was unacceptable and they booked me on the direct flight from Cincinnati to Honolulu. I would have booked it originally but there were no saver seats available.

I think the key word here is "unacceptable" no need to beat around the bush and say it's inconvenient or ask if there is something else they can do. Bottom line is you had a flight that was acceptable, and it was changed so drastically as to become unacceptable. No wiggle room when you say their "offer" is unacceptable; no gray area there either.

[hibbeln]

Cincinnati is one of those words that just never looks like it's spelled right.

[sml2181]

The money has been refunded.

Before they decided to refund, they told me I could use the tickets for another trip. The terms of the tickets I originally purchased stated I could change but not cancel.
They agreed that it would not matter when/where, as long as the ticket price woul be 1300$ or less (price of original ticket)

So I had them make a reservation for another trip in October.
I received the e-tickets PLUS a letter in which the explained that they charged my credit card for 250 Euro per ticket for the changes!

This got me SO mad that I called NW again, now demanding a full refund. I was placed on hold. After 20 minutes I hung up as I had to call American Express for another trip they (Amex) were booking for me. While speaking to the Amex girl, I explained the situation with NW. (They were offering NW tickets for this other trip and I explained that I would rather use another airline-).

Amex Holland and KLM/NW have a special relationship and the girl asked me if it would be ok if she would take over and try to have things corrected.

American Express now arranged for the full refund and yesterday they wrote a complaint letter to KLM regarding the situation. Of course, they haven't replied but it saved me the time to send such a letter myself.
The refund for the tickets and for the changes are showing in my account.

So -
Happy end after all, thanks to Amex.

Thanks for listening and for the help .

[LisaRex]

Good for you! It'll be a long time before you book with NWA again, I bet.

[sml2181]

Originally Posted by hibbeln

4,000 EUROS cheaper?! Holy smoke!

Yes, but we are a family of 6...

[sml2181]

Originally Posted by LisaRex

Good for you! It'll be a long time before you book with NWA again, I bet.

Thanks.
Indeed, I will try to avoid NWA for a loooong time....