Hawaiian: SFO - OGG

[hudshut]

I won a "trip for 2 to Maui" from a radio station. In actuality, the prize is 80,000 Hawaiian Airlines miles deposited into a (newly created) account, and a certificate for 4 nights at Sheraton Maui. The value of this prize is $3,866.

I am a miles program newbie. I checked Hawaiian Airlines website to see their mileage requirements for flights from San Francisco to Maui for this summer, and there are no days (while our son is out of school) which require only 40K round trip.

My questions are:
1. At 330 days out, might there be some summer days on which we could fly for 40K round trip? In other words, are there a few cheap flights, and when those disappear, the mileage requirements are increased?

2. When there is a fare sale, are mileage requirements also lowered (i.e. on sale?)

3. How much does it cost to buy additional miles?

I'm trying to decide how to make the most out of this prize, or whether to decline it.

[DeniseM]

Originally Posted by hudshut

I won a "trip for 2 to Maui" from a radio station. In actuality, the prize is 80,000 Hawaiian Airlines miles deposited into a (newly created) account, and a certificate for 4 nights at Sheraton Maui. The value of this prize is $3,866.

I am a miles program newbie. I checked Hawaiian Airlines website to see their mileage requirements for flights from San Francisco to Maui for this summer, and there are no days (while our son is out of school) which require only 40K round trip.

My questions are:
1. At 330 days out, might there be some summer days on which we could fly for 40K round trip? In other words, are there a few cheap flights, and when those disappear, the mileage requirements are increased?

The summer is high season, and Hawaiian Air has actually raised their mileage requirements in the last year. I got my tickets for this June at 330 days out, and each segment was 25K. 80K is just not enough miles for 3, or even 2 round-trip tickets during the high season. I don't know your dates, but the tickets are most likely 25K each way.

2. When there is a fare sale, are mileage requirements also lowered (i.e. on sale?)

No, the miles do not fluxuate with the sales. They are lower during the off-season - like Sept. - Oct.

3. How much does it cost to buy additional miles?

Buying miles is not usually a good deal. You would be better off to buy as many segments as you can with the miles, and pay cash for the rest. With 80K you can probably buy 3 segments @ 25K miles each (3 one-way tickets) during high season.

I'm trying to decide how to make the most out of this prize, or whether to decline it.

I wouldn't decline it, but I'd make it a full week at the very minimum. Lots of hotel bargains in Hawaii right now. You will probably have to pay for 3 segments, if 3 of you are going. If you do decide not to go, you could perhaps sell the pkg. to someone else, or get the cash equivalent from the radio station.

[VictorB]

Originally Posted by hudshut

I won a "trip for 2 to Maui" from a radio station. In actuality, the prize is 80,000 Hawaiian Airlines miles. The value of this prize is $3,866.

Don't forget the radio station will send you a W-2 for the $3,866 and you will have to pay taxes on it. Sorry for the buzz-kill

[HatTrick]

Originally Posted by hudshut

At 330 days out, might there be some summer days on which we could fly for 40K round trip?

If you can go this summer after August 24th, you can fly for 35K miles per person round trip. Can't say for sure right now what will be available next summer.

[hudshut]

When the prize is a "promo package" such as this one, there is no cash alternative. Hawaiian and Sheraton are getting advertising in exchange for providing the prize. They know that many of the prizes will go unredeemed. This prize would work out well for people who are not tied to school schedules.

I agree, if we go, we'll definitely make it a week or more. Ideally we'll add a timeshare stay to the hotel stay.

Thanks for the idea of using the miles for 3 one-way segments. I had not thought of that.

I'm aware that if I accept the prize, I will receive a 1099 for the full retail value of the prize, as determined by the sponsors. However, if I can prove a lower fair market value for the prize, I can reduce my tax liability.

I'm estimating that they're valuing the hotel portion of the prize at about
$300/night, or $1,200. That leaves $2,666 for the 80,000 miles. Yikes!

To get a high estimate of the value of the prize, I decided to check for flight & hotel packages on Hawaiian's website. I checked for 4 nights, 7/4/09 - 7/8/09, staying at the Sheraton Maui. It came to $3200.

What other methods could be used to quantify the fair market value of the 80K Hawaiian Air Miles?

[Icarus]

However, if I can prove a lower fair market value for the prize, I can reduce my tax liability.

You are definitely on the right track with that ...


You know, the HA web site has a very easy way to look at fares and mileage requirements.

You will need a Hawaii Airlines FF account to do this, so sign up for one on the website, and you will get instant access. Then sign in to your account, using the sign-in link on the front page.

When you fill in the form to view fares, select a date in any month, and then select a date in the same month for the return flight, then click on "monthly view of fares". On the next page, there's a tab for viewing the price in each direction in cash or miles. Click on miles for both directions. There's tabs on top of each calendar for changing the month.

Looking at SFO-OGG, there are really several available dates at the 17.5k level, and lots at the 25k level in both directions (not so much in June, but lots in July and Aug). When you get into June, the 17.5k awards disappear and then reappear on Aug 25, but there's still tons of availability at the 25k level throughout the summer. Want to travel on the weekend in the peak summer months? That will be 30k miles in each direction, per person.

So, for the most flexibility, you may want an additional 20k miles so you have enough for 2 25k (each way) r/t tickets.

We can help you get an additional easy 30k miles x 2.

Go to hawaiianair.com and apply for the B of A Hawaiian Miles Visa. 20k miles will be deposited into your account. You can get another 10k for applying for the B of A Hawaiian miles business card. That's 30k miles for just getting 2 credit cards, which you can cancel before the renewal period to save on the annual fees. Your wife can also apply for both cards and get another 30k miles if you need/want them. Hawaiian lets you share miles with no service charges if both account holders have the Hawaiian Air Visa card, so you can read about that on the web site also.

You should also look at the prices, because, at least IMHO, it's a waste of miles if the cash price for one direction is $160, like it is on many days in the fare calendar between SFO and HNL.

Like Denise pointed out, the unique thing about Hawaii Air is that all the prices (both cash and miles) are for one-way, so you can mix and match whatever you want to. One direction can be miles, the other cash.

The value of the prize package can easily be disputed with the IRS when they send you this 1099. You will need documentation showing a more reasonable price for the identical trips and accomodations at the same hotel. Even better is to dispute the value of the miles, since they aren't actually giving you a trip. The people that are giving you the prize want to value it at the highest possible value. A reasonable value for the miles is probably 1 cent each, and even that overvalues them on Hawaiian Airlines. You would have to check the Starwood website to see what you can find for the value of the hotel, using equivalent room class, and add in the value of any ammenities that package might include.

It would be easy to show that the prize package is probably worth something closer to or less than $1500, just off the top of my head.

For more detailed analysis of the prize value of Hawaiian Air miles, you should probably ask the question on flyertalk, in the Hawaiian airlines (includes all hawaiian airlines, no just HA) forum.

At any rate, if we put a conservative value on the miles of 1 cent per mile, the miles are worth about $800, though you can make a very good case for a lower valuation of Hawaiian Miles, especially if you use your miles for coach tickets on Hawaiian. It's difficult to get 1 cent per mile out them on Hawaiian Airlines.

I didn't look very hard, but the cheapest rate I could find for June 11 - 15 at the Sheraton Maui is $270 per night, so using that valuation, the hotel part is worth around $1100. You can search around and try to find discounted rates, and use that valuation if you find them.

So based on that simple research, the prize is worth less than $1900, less if you can get better supporting documentation.

This doesn't mean that prize is not worth claiming, it is, but you will have to record the value of the income part of the prize as $1900 instead of the value on the 1099 they send you and provide supporting documentation as to how you arrived at that valuation with your tax return. This topic comes up from time to time on Flyertalk, so you should research this part of it there.

whew

-David

[DeniseM]

That's 30k miles for just getting 2 credit cards, which you can cancel before the renewal period to save on the annual fees.

Hi Icky - When we got our last 2 HA cards, they charged the $50 immediately. So I believe they will have to pay the $50 for at least the first year, but not the 2nd year, if they cancel before their renewal date.

Also, you really have to watch that they credit you with the correct incentive of 20K miles - they are infamous for giving people a lesser award, because it changes all the time. When you apply online, print out a hard copy of the offer that shows the 20K award, in case you need proof.

[Icarus]

Originally Posted by DeniseM

Hi Icky - When we got our last 2 HA cards, they charged the $50 immediately. So I believe they will have to pay the $50 for at least the first year, but not the 2nd year, if they cancel before their renewal date.

Also, you really have to watch that they credit you with the correct incentive of 20K miles - they are infamous for giving people a lesser award, because it changes all the time. When you apply online, print out a hard copy of the offer that shows the 20K award, in case you need proof.

Was it $50 or $40? But, yeah, the initial miles aren't "free". You have to pay the first year fee. You can cancel them prior to the renewal to save the next years fee. That's what I meant. Thanks.

I got 40k. 20k for the B of A card and 20k for the B of H card. I don't know if that will work for anybody else, but you can try it. Both posted automatically. The current 20k offers have been there for a while now. The 10k offer for the B of A business visa card is the new one.

There's a United MP (Chase) visa offer for 30k miles now, plus 5k EQMs, plus the ability to earn up to 10k additional EQMs out there too. I may have to get that one.

-David

[Bee]

I reserved July Kauai tickets on HA at 330 days out for 17,500 points each way. This was for SJC to LIH. HA increased the amount of points for these tickets in September, so this flight would be 20,000 points each was now.

Bee

[DeniseM]

Originally Posted by Bee

I reserved July Kauai tickets on HA at 330 days out for 17,500 points each way. This was for SJC to LIH. HA increased the amount of points for these tickets in September, so this flight would be 20,000 points each was now.

Bee

Bee - Some are 20K - mostly midweek - the high season summer weekend flights are 25K miles. SFO may be more than SJC, as well...interesting...

[hudshut]

Thank you for all the helpful replies.

Icarus: Thank you for all the information. I'll sign up for the credit cards right away.

Bee: I'm glad to learn that there is the possibility of lower mileage requirements for summer at 330 days out. I'm willing to fly from any of the 3 SF Bay Area airports.

I appreciate all of your help.