Does Starwood have 'pre-construction' pricing?

[GrayFal]

I visited the recently acquired (used to be Wyndhan) Westin Aruba Hotel this week. At the concirege desk they told me that the plans were already drawn and heading for approval for the TS units planned for the property. She pointed out where on the property the units would go!

Does Starwood do pre-construction pricing/sales as Marriott does?
How do they advertise their new properties?
Where do you get this information?

 

[DavidnRobin]

They have for the TSs built in Hawaii. But the resale prices have been lower.

 

[DeniseM]

Does Starwood do pre-construction pricing/sales as Marriott does?
How do they advertise their new properties?
Where do you get this information?

Yes, but don't expect any bargains.

Info. about new properties here:
http://www.starwoodvacationownership.com/index.jsp

Any owner can refer you for a preview pkg.

 

[GrayFal]

They have for the TSs built in Hawaii. But the resale prices have been lower.

Thanks, has the resale price 'caught up with' what people paid on first day of sale?

Yes, but don't expect any bargains.

I am not sure how you meant this?

I purchased my Marriott Aruba Surf Club pre-construction for 16.4K in 2002 the first week of sales - that week is now selling thru Marriott for over 29K - If I decide to sell, I would still make back my purchase price. At the time I purchased, there were no resales.

My question was does Starwood do the same? Do they have incremental pricing for their new properties?
Does it pay to get in on the ground floor?

Another example is Marriott Grand Chateau - 3BR Platinum went for pre-construction, first day of sale - $19,990....now, over 30K.

What business model does Starwood follow.

 

[Denise L]

Thanks, has the resale price 'caught up with' what people paid on first day of sale?

I purchased my Marriott Aruba Surf Club pre-construction for 16.4K in 2002 the first week of sales - that week is now selling thru Marriott for over 29K - If I decide to sell, I would still make back my purchase price. At the time I purchased, there were no resales.

My question was does Starwood do the same? Do they have incremental pricing for their new properties?
Does it pay to get in on the ground floor?

Another example is Marriott Grand Chateau - 3BR Platinum went for pre-construction, first day of sale - $19,990....now, over 30K.

What business model does Starwood follow.

Starwood rarely exercises its ROFR on resales, so the resale prices are lower than they should be (in my opinion). I have not heard about anyone who has made ANY money on Starwood by buying pre-construction, but I have read about the Marriotts. An example of Starwood pre-construction is that they sold Westin Ka'anapali for about $36,500 OV. We bought for $45,000 before they opened, but not before they broke ground. The highest price I can recall after our purchase was maybe $48,000 for the same OV interval. Resales are currently $32,000 (estimate, don't really know exact numbers).

So you may save over developer prices but it is not likely you will save over resale prices unless Starwood begins to aggressively exercise its ROFR, which it does not appear to want to do.

I did hear that whoever bought OF at Westin Ka'anapali got a really nice price (maybe in the low 40Ks?), so I think those owners who got in on the ground floor did well. Developer prices are close to $70K and when we bought OV, OF was $65K. I think resales are in the low 50Ks, so those owners could probably make some money. Wish I were one of them!

 

[DavidnRobin]

Thanks, has the resale price 'caught up with' what people paid on first day of sale?

QUOTE]

What I meant by this - the resale prices at WKORV are now cheaper than pre-construction.

 

[DeniseM]

I am not sure how you meant this?
.

We paid $44k at the Westin Maui (WKORV) for a 2bdm. during construction and the week is now going for $31K resale.

The preconstruction price at Princeville was $47,500 (in Nov.) for an ocean view 2 bdm. http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showpost.php?p=251814&postcount=1

Someone else just posted that they purchased 1 1/2 weeks preconstruction for $71,000 at Princeville. http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showpost.php?p=264263&postcount=1

Even worse - Princeville isn't a mandatory resort, so it's resale value probably won't hold up well, because resales won't be exchangable in the Starwood system.

So...that's why I said, don't expect a bargain...

 

[GrayFal]

Thanks for all the information....I knew it wouldn't be a bargain, but I was expecting a little better value if purchased early. My purpose would be yearly use and possible rental of '1/2' the unit.

I do not have personal experience with Marriott Hawaii properties but from info I have seen on the TUG Marriott board - the resale is definitely higher then first day of sale. But historically it appears that Hawai is also WAY overpriced - wil be interesting to see what happens with the Starwood Cancun property as more of a comparison to Aruba. They are already selling that - correct?

 

[stevens397]

I think the answer to your question is simply "yes."

The lowest prices, by far, will be pre-construction - especially if it is a desireable location and a successful project in a place you want to travel to. You will also get some incentives from the developer.

Yes resale prices will be lower but those buyers will lose the chance to trade internally - a major loss within the system. Some would say, just buy a mandatory resort resale and trade into Aruba - but it's hard to be certain you'll ever get a trade to a popular property at a time you want it.

So as I read your question, if you want to own in Aruba and want a Starwood to go with your Marriott, buy from the developer as early as possible - you will pay the least and probably a whole lot less than the later purchasers. The bad news is that resale prices will be depressed due to the loss of internal trades so plan on holding onto it.

 

[GrayFal]

I think the answer to your question is simply "yes."

The lowest prices, by far, will be pre-construction - especially if it is a desireable location and a successful project in a place you want to travel to. You will also get some incentives from the developer.

Yes resale prices will be lower but those buyers will lose the chance to trade internally - a major loss within the system. Some would say, just buy a mandatory resort resale and trade into Aruba - but it's hard to be certain you'll ever get a trade to a popular property at a time you want it.

So as I read your question, if you want to own in Aruba and want a Starwood to go with your Marriott, buy from the developer as early as possible - you will pay the least and probably a whole lot less than the later purchasers. The bad news is that resale prices will be depressed due to the loss of internal trades so plan on holding onto it.

Thanks Steve....that is what I am thinking - looking toward retirement in approximately 8 years and would love to do Aruba yearly for a month without any trading hassles. But then we have recently met people in Aruba who have been purchasing condos....:whoopie: - I must resist

It definitely would keep resales higher if you got all the 'perks' with resale - but I don't think the developer is too concerned with that. Only time will tell.

My palapa calls......

 

[johnmfaeth]

Hi Pat,

Keep in mind that if the Westin Aruba is the specific place you want, it will take several years for those units to begin showing up and perhaps 5 years before a true resale market exists for the resort.

My only concern with Aruba is that it is getting somewhat "overbuilt" with timeshares and I have found it is difficult to rent out units there versus other islands such as Grand Cayman or St. John.

Surprisingly, a good number of folks in the US are still "down" on Aruba because of the Natalie Holliway thing. That's just horrible, as I have found the locals to be perhaps the friendliest and nicest in the Caribbean. They are the ones who really suffered during the "boycott". That hurts the rental market too.

Enjoy the rest of your soiree!!!

John

 

[GrayFal]

Hi Pat,

Keep in mind that if the Westin Aruba is the specific place you want, it will take several years for those units to begin showing up and perhaps 5 years before a true resale market exists for the resort.

My only concern with Aruba is that it is getting somewhat "overbuilt" with timeshares and I have found it is difficult to rent out units there versus other islands such as Grand Cayman or St. John.

Enjoy the rest of your soiree!!!

John

Hey John, are u following me :whoopie: !

That is why I am considering a developer week. No significant resale market for 4-5 years.

I somewhat agree with many new TS in Aruba but what may be affecting your rentals is the 'quality issue'.
I have been in or stayed at La Cabanna, Playa Linda, Casa Del Mar, Marriott - and there is NO comparison among these units...La Cabanna has a 5* thru II - and not to be unkind, but it is NOT a very 'nice' place - it is clean and servicable. The other 2 properties are also clean and I would saty there BUT the only upscale property is Marriott - and now the Westin will fit that bill as well.

There are a lot of Marriott units available for rent....and I think that has hurt the other properties as for a few hundred more, you can get the Marriott.
JMHO

 

[DavidnRobin]

Hey John, are u following me :whoopie: !

That is why I am considering a developer week. No significant resale market for 4-5 years.

I somewhat agree with many new TS in Aruba but what may be affecting your rentals is the 'quality issue'.
I have been in or stayed at La Cabanna, Playa Linda, Casa Del Mar, Marriott - and there is NO comparison among these units...La Cabanna has a 5* thru II - and not to be unkind, but it is NOT a very 'nice' place - it is clean and servicable. The other 2 properties are also clean and I would saty there BUT the only upscale property is Marriott - and now the Westin will fit that bill as well.

There are a lot of Marriott units available for rent....and I think that has hurt the other properties as for a few hundred more, you can get the Marriott.
JMHO

Regarding buying a resale week to get into new resorts (vs from SVO) - you can buy resale at a Mandatory resort and exchange into these resorts (ALOT cheaper). This will be possible to do if you are okay with going during low seasons (perhaps not during the opening year - and you must go during that year? and is it still worth the extra money?) - it will be easier to exchange into as time goes by.

MO

 

[tomandrobin]

Sometimes, time is of the essence. Even though resale will be cheaper then developer costs, there may not be any resale units at a newer resort for awhile. Also, if you want a particular view and can or want to go at a very specific time, buying from the developer may be the best wat to go.

Is it cost effective, probably not. I think sometimes you have to look beyond economics of a sale or resale of a resort, but look at the value to yourself and your needs. It can't always be about "how little I paid for my week". If I am 60 years old (which I am not), I may not have time to wait 5 to 7 years to score a good deal at a resort I want to use now.

 

[duke]

Regarding buying a resale week to get into new resorts (vs from SVO) - you can buy resale at a Mandatory resort and exchange into these resorts (ALOT cheaper). This will be possible to do if you are okay with going during low seasons (perhaps not during the opening year - and you must go during that year? and is it still worth the extra money?) - it will be easier to exchange into as time goes by.

MO

I think is a good point that is not mentioned much here. Buying Mandatory allows you to trade but be advised you most likely are going to have to trade in lower demanded times.

I like to go to Maui in May or September. These are the lowest demand times. If you want to go in the summer or during holidays forget it. You will need to buy at the resort you want to go to most of the time either resale or developer.