...This Is What No One Tells You About Starting a New Life Abroad

[MULTIZ321]

We Followed Our Dreams and Retired to Mexico. This Is What No One Tells You About Starting a New Life Abroad
By Suzanne McGee/ Retirement/ End Investor/ Money/ Time/ time.com

"In the summer of 2012, Brad Johnson and his wife joined the thousands of Americans who each year decide to spend their retirement years living overseas.

They rented out their house in Phoenix, Ariz., got a six-month tourist visa that they anticipated renewing indefinitely, packed up their two cars, and set off southward, to the first of a series of rental homes in and around Puerto Vallarta, Mexico. “It was absolutely wonderful,” says Johnson, now 70 years old.

The Johnsons had travelled in Mexico before and welcomed the chance to put down roots in a place they enjoyed, with a lower cost of living that would help them stretch their savings. They had plenty of company: as of August, some 680,000 beneficiaries received Social Security payments at foreign addresses, the best way to gauge the trend of retiring overseas...."

Brad and Yvonne Johnson in Puerto Vallarta
Courtesy of Brad Johnson


Richard

 

[WinniWoman]

Really? She had a 90 year old mother and it never crossed her mind that she might need her help? SMH...

I don't get people. I think a lot of them get this wild idea that retirement one big travel vacation when it is so much more than that and- let's face it- at that point we are all going in the other direction- towards death.

Sure- if you are healthy- travel if that is what you like and enjoy your life. But- you have to factor in that you are ageing- not getting younger- and when you move - out of the country or even just within your own country- it is not one big vacation every single day! What the? How do people not think about this stuff is beyond me.

 

[klpca]

I think that it's the dreamers who move abroad in retirement. Maybe if your parents have already passed away and you don't have any kids it would work, but otherwise it seems that real life will catch up with you eventually. I'm slowly coming to the realization that we can't even move away from our city because at some point I will need to be here for my mom. So we will just travel as much as we can.

 

[isisdave]

I don't see why people think it's some kind of big deal or failing when someone goes overseas to live, and then returns home. You could do the same to Florida, or Phoenix, or ... Fresno, and no one would think it odd if you found out you preferred Des Moines, or your mother needed help.

Lots of folks feel they need to expatriate for financial reasons, and I think that's fine, but I wouldn't buy real estate in Mexico. Just sayin'. If you maintain your mobility, you can try out several destinations for a year or two at a time, and have a blast. The couple in this story is smart -- they kept their house, and its appreciation, while enjoying lower living costs. When Mom no longer needs them, they can continue the journey.

--Dave, currently in Stratford-upon-Avon and leaving for Milan tomorrow

 

[petermccarty]

I think it's just another way to live your life happily and sufficiently, the way you want. Travelling after retirement is not obligatory, and definitely is up to you. If a person wanted to travel the world but didn't have any chance in the young age, I don't think they forget about their aim with time. Why people of older age have to feel guilty for fulfilling their dreams? This couple is a great example of a balanced and healthy relationship and they do not deserve negativity.

 

[WinniWoman]

I think it's just another way to live your life happily and sufficiently, the way you want. Travelling after retirement is not obligatory, and definitely is up to you. If a person wanted to travel the world but didn't have any chance in the young age, I don't think they forget about their aim with time. Why people of older age have to feel guilty for fulfilling their dreams? This couple is a great example of a balanced and healthy relationship and they do not deserve negativity.

I get the dream. I have tons of them. Traveling and actually living somewhere else abroad are two different things. If you plan it as temporary with the intent to come back- ok. If you are absolutely sure you are leaving for good- great; or even just "hoping" it will be permanent- great. But-

Maybe it is the way the article is written, but all the considerations stated should be evaluated by people before they make a move to live abroad. In the article it makes it sound as if the movers were surprised at having to come back- with this couple the husband states they never expected to have to come back and take care of his wife's 90 year old mother. Really? Come on!

 

[bogey21]

My best friend in life and his girl friend moved to San Miguel, Mexico about 10 years ago. They reached the point that having to touch back in the US every year to get Visas renewed was such a pain that they went through the process to get permanent Visas. They like living in Mexico so much they haven't been back in years...

George

 

[Passepartout]

Good article. It does emphasize that one needs to keep their options open all their life. You may plan, but if situations change, you have to be able to change plans. When you are a young, happy couple, you may plan that your son will be a major league pitcher and make millions, and your daughter will marry the next breakthrough brain surgeon, but when they get through high school- barely- and your own parents whom you had thought would check out early and leave you a tidy inheritance, end up in a nursing home or with Alzheimer's for decades.

The ONE common denominator that allows you to be flexible with your plans is to save all you can and start saving early. If one only has one plan, and is encumbered with debt and the necessity to come up with money to satisfy current needs, one's ability to make changes as life deals out different cards is seriously limited.

Jim

 

[puppymommo]

What Jim wrote is definitely true:
The ONE common denominator that allows you to be flexible with your plans is to save all you can and start saving early. If one only has one plan, and is encumbered with debt and the necessity to come up with money to satisfy current needs, one's ability to make changes as life deals out different cards is seriously limited.

With retirement about 3 years out for me, I am currently planning to live abroad for several years. Partly to save money, mostly for the fun of it while I am still "young" and healthy and pre-grandchildren. I may end up living abroad for more than a few years but I have no intention of doing so permanently. I can't imagine being 90 years old and half the world away from my only child!

My parents are both deceased so that isn't a factor for me. But I agree that it is hard to believe this couple didn't anticipate needing to help care for an elderly parent!

 

[Panina]

I think that it's the dreamers who move abroad in retirement. Maybe if your parents have already passed away and you don't have any kids it would work, but otherwise it seems that real life will catch up with you eventually. I'm slowly coming to the realization that we can't even move away from our city because at some point I will need to be here for my mom. So we will just travel as much as we can.

I live in a different state then my mom and go every month, on the phone multiple times every day, handle everything. It is challenging, can’t even imagine being out of the country.

 

[Passepartout]

I live in a different state then my mom and go every month, on the phone multiple times every day, handle everything. It is challenging, can’t even imagine being out of the country.

What would be the difference if you were, as in the referenced article, in Mexico, or Western Europe? The phones still work, and the airplanes fly every day. I suspect the 'boundaries' between you and your mom are more mental than physical.

 

[Panina]

What would be the difference if you were, as in the referenced article, in Mexico, or Western Europe? The phones still work, and the airplanes fly every day. I suspect the 'boundaries' between you and your mom are more mental than physical.

Definitely not mental. The amount of hours to get there each month would be more. That gets tiring as well as more expensive.

 

[Passepartout]

Definitely not mental. The amount of hours to get there each month would be more. That gets tiring as well as more expensive.

It's hard having aging parents. As I managed my life while being my mom's primary caregiver, we got closer, but that doesn't mean it was easier. Lots of unplanned trips 'home'.

 

[silentg]

We enjoy traveling. Moved to Florida 30 years ago, love living here. Our kids have grown and on their own, no grandkids, my parents passed away, mother in law is living, we visit when we can.
Usually plan one big trip a year. Timeshares make it easy to travel for us. Looking forward to retirement with DH. I’m already there. As long as we are healthy and can afford to travel we will.
Love my TUG friends too!
Silentg

 

[moonstone]

We haven't moved away but we do spend 3 months each winter in Belize and several 10-21 day trips away aside from that. I always have some anxiety about going away but I am in nearly daily contact via the internet to other family members or VOIP calls to the folks. My parents & MiL are all 87 years old and in declining health. My Mom had to go into a long term care facility 5 years ago due to worsening dementia but my dad is still living in their house and driving himself around with not too much problem (3 minor accidents in the last year). MiL is also still living in her house since FiL passed away nearly 4 years ago, but her DD lives 4 doors away. When both sets of parents retired they also had parents in long term care homes but said they were being well taken care of so they would still travel, and they did. My parents wintered (3-4 mos) in Florida and my grandparents didn't have a problem with them leaving for so long and told them they needed to enjoy their retirement.

As it turned out both my grandparents passed away while my parents were at home. My FiL also passed away very suddenly while we were at home so we haven't had to deal with that while we are away. My dad and MiL have made it very clear to DH & I that they do not expect either one of us to fly home if they (or my Mom) should pass while we are away. My dad said "I'll be dead anyways so I wont know if you are there or not"! MiL was rushed to the hospital last winter while we were away and made all the family swear not to tell DH & I. Our daughter lasted about 2 days and then messaged me to call her for all the details. She said she just couldn't keep a secret like that from us in case Mum had passed away. Thankfully it wasn't anything too serious and Mum was back home within a couple of weeks.

A very good, nearly life long friend of my parents, & work mate of my dad's, qualified for an early retirement (with full pension & benefits) at the same time as my dad many years ago when they were 63 yrs old. This guy never travelled much saying he & his wife would take lots of long trips after he retired. Well he finished work at the end of May, seemed to have a bad cold/cough in the June, was diagnosed with stage 4 lung cancer in July, and was dead before the end of November. He and his wife never got to take a single trip! My parents said they didn't want to end up like that and didn't expect us to either, so we should enjoy our retirement and not worry about them. And we are enjoying being out of the snow for the winter (but it's hard)!


~Diane

 

[TravelTime]

I do not see moving back as a big deal. I rarely spend more than 2-3 weeks in one place right now and I am not yet retired. I have moved across the country and back 3 times. I have made decisions about where to live that did not work out and I changed it. I am surprised that Tuggers find this couple’s situation to be a problem. I thought Tuggers travel a lot. To me, living in Mexico would be easier and closer than living across the country. Many people move within the USA at retirement time, regret it and want to go back to where they came from too. My father built a house a couple hours from where he lived and now he wants to move back. So it is not really an “international” issue.

 

[bogey21]

It's hard having aging parents. As I managed my life while being my mom's primary caregiver, we got closer, but that doesn't mean it was easier. Lots of unplanned trips 'home'.

I'm an aging parent (age 83). To make sure I am not a burden to my kids I moved into a CCRC when I turned 65. In addition I have told my kids that they have no responsibility to take care of me as I continue to age. We keep in touch almost daily via email and/or phone but I haven't seen them in months. I have also told them that if/when I am in my final stages I don't want them to visit because I want them to remember me as my vibrant self, not while I am a shadow of my old self. One big negative with this is not having much of a relationship with my Grand Kids...

George

 

[WinniWoman]

Definitely not mental. The amount of hours to get there each month would be more. That gets tiring as well as more expensive.

It's very hard. Heck- I was just a bit over an hour and a half from my mom and working full time and it was tough. Thank goodness my husband worked in the same county as where she lived and could also help out before and after work sometimes, but it was still very hard.

 

[WinniWoman]

I'm an aging parent (age 83). To make sure I am not a burden to my kids I moved into a CCRC when I turned 65. In addition I have told my kids that they have no responsibility to take care of me as I continue to age. We keep in touch almost daily via email and/or phone but I haven't seen them in months. I have also told them that if/when I am in my final stages I don't want them to visit because I want them to remember me as my vibrant self, not while I am a shadow of my old self. One big negative with this is not having much of a relationship with my Grand Kids...

George

I think this is great except the part about your grandchildren. Very sad. Grand parents should be involved in their grand childrens' lives as they have so much to offer (both ways). We don't have grandchildren but I know I hate it that we only see our son just a couple of times per year, mostly with a big long stretch of 8 months from January to August before we see him.

 

[klpca]

I do not see moving back as a big deal. I rarely spend more than 2-3 weeks in one place right now and I am not yet retired. I have moved across the country and back 3 times. I have made decisions about where to live that did not work out and I changed it. I am surprised that Tuggers find this couple’s situation to be a problem. I thought Tuggers travel a lot. To me, living in Mexico would be easier and closer than living across the country. Many people move within the USA at retirement time, regret it and want to go back to where they came from too. My father built a house a couple hours from where he lived and now he wants to move back. So it is not really an “international” issue.

To me this is definitely a "different strokes" thing. I appreciate people sharing the ways that they are dealing with their elderly parents. We aren't there yet but we can see it on the horizon. Our parents are all in their early 80's and still active for the most part. My FIL is in the worst shape of the four - he's legally blind now and can't hear well (refuses to wear a hearing aid). He's very overweight and has poor mobility. He sleeps most of the day. It's very tough to see - he was an athlete in his younger years and a quiet but vibrant person. He and my MIL still live at home though, so good for them. Everyone's situation is different. We are the only family that lives close to my mother, and she lives alone. She moved here about 10 years ago and has a few acquaintances but no close friends (she doesn't make friends easily). If something were to happen we are the only ones close by. I won't leave her alone. So we will stay here.

One other thing to take into consideration is the cost of moving. Real estate commissions alone would set us back at least +$50k if we sold the house. I can take a lot of trips for $50k! Then we would have to move, lol. We've lived in the same house for over 30 years. Even though we are regular purgers, I cannot imagine the work required to move. That keeps me here as well. Travel is so much easier!

 

[WinniWoman]

To me this is definitely a "different strokes" thing. I appreciate people sharing the ways that they are dealing with their elderly parents. We aren't there yet but we can see it on the horizon. Our parents are all in their early 80's and still active for the most part. My FIL is in the worst shape of the four - he's legally blind now and can't hear well (refuses to wear a hearing aid). He's very overweight and has poor mobility. He sleeps most of the day. It's very tough to see - he was an athlete in his younger years and a quiet but vibrant person. He and my MIL still live at home though, so good for them. Everyone's situation is different. We are the only family that lives close to my mother, and she lives alone. She moved here about 10 years ago and has a few acquaintances but no close friends (she doesn't make friends easily). If something were to happen we are the only ones close by. I won't leave her alone. So we will stay here.

One other thing to take into consideration is the cost of moving. Real estate commissions alone would set us back at least +$50k if we sold the house. I can take a lot of trips for $50k! Then we would have to move, lol. We've lived in the same house for over 30 years. Even though we are regular purgers, I cannot imagine the work required to move. That keeps me here as well. Travel is so much easier!

I can so relate to what you are saying about moving expenses. Never mind the logistics and the energy required as we will be in our upper 60's. We will be facing this in a couple of years and though I really want to move to NH (or VT), and also know it will be hard to age on our property (more so than the house itself) and pay the outrageous school and property taxes here, I am not seeing how we will be able to do it. Hence my other posts on TUG about how to buy another house if you need the proceeds from the sale of your current house to buy it.

I am trying not to kill our dream, but it is hard to figure it out. After all, we are not super rich and we cannot afford to make any big mistakes once we are retired. Actually, if we were super rich we might have been able to keep our home and buy a second one and that would be that. We could take our time with selling or not sell at all.

Meanwhile, hubby is delusional and thinks it can be worked out. But then again, he is not into the finances. He is kind of like a little kid that wants what he wants- until reality hits him in the face. We will see how he feels when the time comes. I am hoping he is right somehow and I am missing something.

One thought we had is to try to sell the house on our own, saving on real estate commissions. Another Tugger suggested using PODS for storage and moving. We would try to purge of most stuff, though we are not hoarders- just hubby with his garage stuff, which most will have to go.

Someone else mentioned a bridge loan- I shake when I think of those. We have no big pension (just a small one of which we will take lump sum), so our income will be a bit tight. Our home has been paid off for years- though we still have those high property and school taxes. I cannot fathom having to put our home at risk and cutting into our limited monthly income until the whole thing worked itself out- IF it even did. Houses are not selling like hotcakes over here.

We could rent something maybe in NH once our home sells. I do see affordable rentals today as I look on line. So I am thinking that is our best option.

Sell the house, Put everything in POD storage until we can move it and rent in NH. Maybe even rent permanently. I even see some rentals in 55+ communities. ]

Hey- maybe this should be our revised plan!

I don't know. The whole thing is overwhelming. If we didn't need to actually sell our current home first things would be easier for sure.

I actually thought about your travel point myself- just keep using our timeshares and be happy with just that. But alas- husband doesn't care about travel- except when I drag him along and then he enjoys it. He even wants to get rid of our Smuggs timeshare, but I refuse right now. Sigh.....

 

[heathpack]

Good article. It does emphasize that one needs to keep their options open all their life. You may plan, but if situations change, you have to be able to change plans. When you are a young, happy couple, you may plan that your son will be a major league pitcher and make millions, and your daughter will marry the next breakthrough brain surgeon, but when they get through high school- barely- and your own parents whom you had thought would check out early and leave you a tidy inheritance, end up in a nursing home or with Alzheimer's for decades.

The ONE common denominator that allows you to be flexible with your plans is to save all you can and start saving early. If one only has one plan, and is encumbered with debt and the necessity to come up with money to satisfy current needs, one's ability to make changes as life deals out different cards is seriously limited.

Jim

Or you could dream that your daughter will BE the next breakthrough brain surgeon.

 

[Passepartout]

Or you could dream that your daughter will BE the next breakthrough brain surgeon.

That's right!

 

[heathpack]

I have no idea what will happen with my Mom. She is 78 years old, mentally sharp, getting around and doing fine just now. But lots of medical problems, her health seems like a house of cards.

She lives in her home in NY. I live in California. My brother and father have passed away, so it’s just me. Mom is a difficult person. She has a sister but that relationship is shaky. I have to set pretty rigid boundaries but when I do that, we can get along for short periods of time. She treats my husband like a waiter but he’s easy going and doesn’t like it but deals with it fine for short periods of time.

Despite her being very difficult (manipulative, tantrum-prone, emotional) with family, she behaves much more normally with friends and she has a surprisingly solid circle of friends in NY. She owns her home, is financially secure, and has long term care insurance which covers her in NY and reciprocal states but not California.

I try to get her to move here, because I don’t have the kind of job where I can drop everything if she’s ill and be gone for extended periods of time. For me, being gone much more than 10 days in a row is pretty hard on the business. She doesn’t want to move here and I get that. She likes to go to the diner and kvetch, people in California don’t really do that. She has friends at home and would have more trouble making friends here, because she’s not as mobile as she used to be. Housing is as expensive here as it is there. Her LTC insurance won’t work here.

I’ve considered trying to move to Nevada and getting her to move too. Cheaper for both of us, her LTC insurance is effective there. But does it really make sense for me to uproot both of us, leave a good paying job for maybe as much as a 40% paycut? I don’t know that makes sense really.

So it feels to me like we should have more of a plan, something that will be workable as she ages and in place before there’s a crisis. But there really is no easy answer, which results in us having no plan. It will inevitably become a crisis of some sort within the next 5 years. And I guess we’ll just have to deal with it then, and assess our options at that point in time.

I think it’s easy to say someone should have seen something coming. But sometimes they do and have just made a rational decision to deal with the problem when it becomes a problem. Because it’s hard to predict exactly how it will all play out anyway.

 

[WinniWoman]

I have no idea what will happen with my Mom. She is 78 years old, mentally sharp, getting around and doing fine just now. But lots of medical problems, her health seems like a house of cards.

She lives in her home in NY. I live in California. My brother and father have passed away, so it’s just me. Mom is a difficult person. She has a sister but that relationship is shaky. I have to set pretty rigid boundaries but when I do that, we can get along for short periods of time. She treats my husband like a waiter but he’s easy going and doesn’t like it but deals with it fine for short periods of time.

Despite her being very difficult (manipulative, tantrum-prone, emotional) with family, she behaves much more normally with friends and she has a surprisingly solid circle of friends in NY. She owns her home, is financially secure, and has long term care insurance which covers her in NY and reciprocal states but not California.

I try to get her to move here, because I don’t have the kind of job where I can drop everything if she’s ill and be gone for extended periods of time. For me, being gone much more than 10 days in a row is pretty hard on the business. She doesn’t want to move here and I get that. She likes to go to the diner and kvetch, people in California don’t really do that. She has friends at home and would have more trouble making friends here, because she’s not as mobile as she used to be. Housing is as expensive here as it is there. Her LTC insurance won’t work here.

I’ve considered trying to move to Nevada and getting her to move too. Cheaper for both of us, her LTC insurance is effective there. But does it really make sense for me to uproot both of us, leave a good paying job for maybe as much as a 40% paycut? I don’t know that makes sense really.

So it feels to me like we should have more of a plan, something that will be workable as she ages and in place before there’s a crisis. But there really is no easy answer, which results in us having no plan. It will inevitably become a crisis of some sort within the next 5 years. And I guess we’ll just have to deal with it then, and assess our options at that point in time.

I think it’s easy to say someone should have seen something coming. But sometimes they do and have just made a rational decision to deal with the problem when it becomes a problem. Because it’s hard to predict exactly how it will all play out anyway.

Sometimes there are no answers. I think your mom is in a good situation actually- better than a lot of people. She is financially secure and she has Long Term Insurance. She has friends, so she is not lonely.

If she were to move it would be hard for her to make friends. As you age, it is difficult. Even at my age- in my 60's- it is hard. Mine- my long time ones- all live far from me. People have their own lives- when they are older they are settled in with their own families and grandchildren and so on. You don't have that past history with them as you do with your long time friends. Then your old friends start to die off. Need a lot of courage to get old!

Anyway- yes- it is hard that you are so far away. But I would not uproot your life for your mom. Giving up your job and moving to another state just for her sake is not a good plan for you long term.

It will be hard for you when the time comes that she needs care- but you will deal with it. It will be stressful, but remember, there is a Family Leave Act in place. Your employer will have to be flexible and if not- well- you know where to tell them to go....