Manhattan Club Maintenance Fee Problems

[chefcristo]

Fortunately, I am not. I am staying there with my family Memorial Day weekend through an RCI exchange. After I checked out the maintenance fees for owners, I will not complain about the daily fee. I sure hope it gets better Under Bluegreen for unfortunate souls that have been put through the wringer with ownership.

If I run into any owners while there, I will tell them about TUG.

.........a friend in need!!!!!!!!!!!!!! thanks. tell as many as you can. seeing this on TUG might be an avenue to get further suggestions on combatting owners' issues with TMC. there is an attorney that is preparing a case, but TMC will not give a list of owners with email addresses. without that, we're somewhat at a stalemate. thanks again.

happy new year.

chefcristo

ps: hope you got the 1 bedroom/2 bath suite. with all the unfortunate issues we have with TMC, i would be remiss not to tell you that it's a physically wonderful place to stay. you're so close to so many desirable nyc places to visit, most, practically within walking distance. have fun!!!

 

[Tamaradarann]

.........a friend in need!!!!!!!!!!!!!! thanks. tell as many as you can. seeing this on TUG might be an avenue to get further suggestions on combatting owners' issues with TMC. there is an attorney that is preparing a case, but TMC will not give a list of owners with email addresses. without that, we're somewhat at a stalemate. thanks again.

happy new year.

chefcristo

ps: hope got the 1 bedroom/2 bath suite. with all the unfortunate issues we have with TMC, i would be remiss not to tell you that it's a physically wonderful place to stay. you're so close to so many desirable nyc places to visit, most practically within walking distance. have fun!!!

I brought up the high maintenance fee issue since it seemed like one which was a far out example of how high maintenance fees can get. While I think that it is great that an attorney is preparing a case, I still would like to learn more about how TMC got into this situation. Where was the Board of Directors? Is the Board of Directors incompetent or corrupt? Do you get a breakdown of the costs that make up the maintenance fees with the operations costs, taxes, and reserve fee broken down? I own HGVC at South Beach which is a very small city property with is relatively high maintenance for a 1 BR in the HGVC system. For 2019 my operating Fee is $768.62, taxes are $89.47, reserve fee $201.69 totaling $1059.78. Perhaps someone who owns at the West 57 St. HGVC property which would be a comparable location to TMC could provide their numbers.

 

[chefcristo]

I brought up the high maintenance fee issue since it seemed like one which was a far out example of how high maintenance fees can get. While I think that it is great that an attorney is preparing a case, I still would like to learn more about how TMC got into this situation. Where was the Board of Directors? Is the Board of Directors incompetent or corrupt? Do you get a breakdown of the costs that make up the maintenance fees with the operations costs, taxes, and reserve fee broken down? I own HGVC at South Beach which is a very small city property with is relatively high maintenance for a 1 BR in the HGVC system. For 2019 my operating Fee is $768.62, taxes are $89.47, reserve fee $201.69 totaling $1059.78. Perhaps someone who owns at the West 57 St. HGVC property which would be a comparable location to TMC could provide their numbers.

 

[escanoe]

ps: hope you got the 1 bedroom/2 bath suite. with all the unfortunate issues we have with TMC, i would be remiss not to tell you that it's a physically wonderful place to stay. you're so close to so many desirable nyc places to visit, most, practically within walking distance. have fun!!!

My RCI portal lists two types of 1 bedrooms. Ones that sleep two people and ones that sleep four people. I have one for four people. Thanks for sharing info about the property.

 

[chefcristo]

TMC maintenance fee per week for a 1 bedroom suite owned is approaching $3,500, representing nearly a 500% raise since my purchase 7 years ago. the salesperson told me that there would be "slight raises" in maintenance fees "from time-to-time." needless to say, the sales staff was well-trained in deception and scamming by ian bruce eichner, developer and owner of TMC. you mention the BOARD OF DIRECTORS: this fraudulent body was made up of (not positive of the actual count) three non-voting shareowners (us), and, i believe 4-5 from the TMC management team (them). the non-voting members were contacted by owners via email several times. their collective responses were something like .......our hands our tied since we have no active voice on the board.....

the two issues described above, plus other of TMC's criminally fraudulent activities against us owners were addressed in litigation brought against TMC by the former new york state attorney general, eric schneiderman (after his undercover agents sat in on and recorded three separate sales presentations containing fraud)

schneiderman won the case. it's important to say here, that there are more than 14,000 shareowners in TMC. now for the "kicker": schneiderman's "win" was a fine of $6.5M, including prohibiting ian bruce eichner from further activities in new york timeshare operations. do the math: $6.5m divided by more than 14,000+ owners, distributed over 3 years: in a word, owners still remain totally screwed. eichner still has his dirty hands in TMC's operation until bluegreen takes over. maintenance fees are not likely to be reduced and many owners are still not able to get desirable reservation time due to eichner's fraudulent overselling of shares and renting to non-TMC owners at substantially reduced rates in comparison to other similar nyc accommodations.

forgive the long-windedness but that's the PARTIAL story.

it is essential that state and national timeshare regulation and legislation be established quickly. this will most likely not happen. i suspect pockets are being lined. and yes, i did contact my ny senators, schumer and gillibrand twice about the TMC issue, and to date, no response from either one.

although there are some satisfied timeshare owners in other geographical areas, many are similarly dissatisfied as i am. the fraud in the timeshare industry is universal and rampant. takeovers of timeshare companies happen regularly. any timeshare owner can fall victim to fraud. regarding the regulation/legislation of the timeshare industry, it will benefit all timeshare owners universally.

happy new year!!

chefcristo

 

[Tamaradarann]

TMC maintenance fee per week for a 1 bedroom suite owned is approaching $3,500, representing nearly a 500% raise since my purchase 7 years ago. the salesperson told me that there would be "slight raises" in maintenance fees "from time-to-time." needless to say, the sales staff was well-trained in deception and scamming by ian bruce eichner, developer and owner of TMC. you mention the BOARD OF DIRECTORS: this fraudulent body was made up of (not positive of the actual count) three non-voting shareowners (us), and, i believe 4-5 from the TMC management team (them). the non-voting members were contacted by owners via email several times. their collective responses were something like .......our hands our tied since we have no active voice on the board.....

the two issues described above, plus other of TMC's criminally fraudulent activities against us owners were addressed in litigation brought against TMC by the former new york state attorney general, eric schneiderman (after his undercover agents sat in on and recorded three separate sales presentations containing fraud)

schneiderman won the case. it's important to say here, that there are more than 14,000 shareowners in TMC. now for the "kicker": schneiderman's "win" was a fine of $6.5M, including prohibiting ian bruce eichner from further activities in new york timeshare operations. do the math: $6.5m divided by more than 14,000+ owners, distributed over 3 years: in a word, owners still remain totally screwed. eichner still has his dirty hands in TMC's operation until bluegreen takes over. maintenance fees are not likely to be reduced and many owners are still not able to get desirable reservation time due to eichner's fraudulent overselling of shares and renting to non-TMC owners at substantially reduced rates in comparison to other similar nyc accommodations.

forgive the long-windedness but that's the PARTIAL story.

it is essential that state and national timeshare regulation and legislation be established quickly. this will most likely not happen. i suspect pockets are being lined. and yes, i did contact my ny senators, schumer and gillibrand twice about the TMC issue, and to date, no response from either one.

although there are some satisfied timeshare owners in other geographical areas, many are similarly dissatisfied as i am. the fraud in the timeshare industry is universal and rampant. takeovers of timeshare companies happen regularly. any timeshare owner can fall victim to fraud. regarding the regulation/legislation of the timeshare industry, it will benefit all timeshare owners universally.

happy new year!!

chefcristo

I am not trying to defend the timeshare sales people, but most if not all usually give either false or misleading information to make their product look better to make a sale. This is not unique to TMC. Also, the timeshare sales people most probably had no inkling that the maintenance fees we're going to go up 500%.

However, the Composition of the Board of Directors is unusual and having the owners on the Board as non-voting members was ridiculous. If there were 4-5 Corporate members on the Board and 3 voting owner members on the board the results probably would have been the same. The Composition of the Board of Directors was certainly criminal not civil in nature. I know that some HGVC resorts have 1 Corporate Member on the Board with 5 or 6 voting owner members.

As I suspected the problems with TMC is the Board of Directors. Until and Unless that problem gets solved with people on the Board who are interested in doing the best it can for Owners, not the Developer, the problems will continue. Hopefully, the fraudulent decisions that the Board of Directors made resulted in instantaneous one time expenditures and not bond or contactually related decisions that could result in expenditures for 30 years or more.

 

[Tamaradarann]

TMC maintenance fee per week for a 1 bedroom suite owned is approaching $3,500, representing nearly a 500% raise since my purchase 7 years ago. the salesperson told me that there would be "slight raises" in maintenance fees "from time-to-time." needless to say, the sales staff was well-trained in deception and scamming by ian bruce eichner, developer and owner of TMC. you mention the BOARD OF DIRECTORS: this fraudulent body was made up of (not positive of the actual count) three non-voting shareowners (us), and, i believe 4-5 from the TMC management team (them). the non-voting members were contacted by owners via email several times. their collective responses were something like .......our hands our tied since we have no active voice on the board.....

the two issues described above, plus other of TMC's criminally fraudulent activities against us owners were addressed in litigation brought against TMC by the former new york state attorney general, eric schneiderman (after his undercover agents sat in on and recorded three separate sales presentations containing fraud)

schneiderman won the case. it's important to say here, that there are more than 14,000 shareowners in TMC. now for the "kicker": schneiderman's "win" was a fine of $6.5M, including prohibiting ian bruce eichner from further activities in new york timeshare operations. do the math: $6.5m divided by more than 14,000+ owners, distributed over 3 years: in a word, owners still remain totally screwed. eichner still has his dirty hands in TMC's operation until bluegreen takes over. maintenance fees are not likely to be reduced and many owners are still not able to get desirable reservation time due to eichner's fraudulent overselling of shares and renting to non-TMC owners at substantially reduced rates in comparison to other similar nyc accommodations.

forgive the long-windedness but that's the PARTIAL story.

it is essential that state and national timeshare regulation and legislation be established quickly. this will most likely not happen. i suspect pockets are being lined. and yes, i did contact my ny senators, schumer and gillibrand twice about the TMC issue, and to date, no response from either one.

although there are some satisfied timeshare owners in other geographical areas, many are similarly dissatisfied as i am. the fraud in the timeshare industry is universal and rampant. takeovers of timeshare companies happen regularly. any timeshare owner can fall victim to fraud. regarding the regulation/legislation of the timeshare industry, it will benefit all timeshare owners universally.

happy new year!!

chefcristo

 

[Tamaradarann]

I was so overwhelmed by the Composition of the Board of Directors that I forgot to ask if you have any inkling on what items in the Operating or Reserve budget made the maintenance fee go up so much. If you have the details of the operating and reserve fees for the first year you paid them to compare with the current year that would be edifying to all of us as well as perhaps useful to the attorney that is preparing the case.

 

[chefcristo]

I was so overwhelmed by the Composition of the Board of Directors that I forgot to ask if you have any inkling on what items in the Operating or Reserve budget made the maintenance fee go up so much. If you have the details of the operating and reserve fees for the first year you paid them to compare with the current year that would be edifying to all of us as well as perhaps useful to the attorney that is preparing the case.

comprehending a financial report is not one of my fortes; however, there are many other owners who know how to scrutinize these numerical documents, and we had the former nysag, schneiderman, delve into these issues and came up with the "SETTLEMENT" that i previously wrote about. NOTHING was done (or apparently checked) concerning the TMC financial reports. my thoughtful opinion is that they were falsely prepared in favor of TMC, which doesn't surprise me. there is currently an attorney preparing a case vs TMC in behalf of owners (who paid an upfront fee) but how and when he'll bring formal charges is still a mystery. one of the issues holding up the legal process is the number of owners who are not aware of this criminal situation. they're from all over the developed world and are not aware of other forums like yahoo and redweek containing TMC'S criminal activities, e.g., defrauding over 14,000 people.

at a december 12, 2018 legal hearing, the attorney in question, along with a former TMC non-voting board member, was told by the presiding judge to confer with the current TMC board of directors, to get access to all owners' names with their contact information in order to notify them of the possible case to be brought against TMC, and the reasons for such pending action. to date, there has been no news put forth regarding this meeting. i doubt that TMC will cooperate in this request for owners' contact information since this will (in my opinion) lead to their ultimate legal demise.

it's next to impossible to predict how we owners proceed from here.

thanks so much. your comments and helpful and appreciated. please stay in touch.

happy new year!

chefcristo

 

[Tamaradarann]

comprehending a financial report is not one of my fortes; however, there are many other owners who know how to scrutinize these numerical documents, and we had the former nysag, schneiderman, delve into these issues and came up with the "SETTLEMENT" that i previously wrote about. NOTHING was done (or apparently checked) concerning the TMC financial reports. my thoughtful opinion is that they were falsely prepared in favor of TMC, which doesn't surprise me. there is currently an attorney preparing a case vs TMC in behalf of owners (who paid an upfront fee) but how and when he'll bring formal charges is still a mystery. one of the issues holding up the legal process is the number of owners who are not aware of this criminal situation. they're from all over the developed world and are not aware of other forums like yahoo and redweek containing TMC'S criminal activities, e.g., defrauding over 14,000 people.

at a december 12, 2018 legal hearing, the attorney in question, along with a former TMC non-voting board member, was told by the presiding judge to confer with the current TMC board of directors, to get access to all owners' names with their contact information in order to notify them of the possible case to be brought against TMC, and the reasons for such pending action. to date, there has been no news put forth regarding this meeting. i doubt that TMC will cooperate in this request for owners' contact information since this will (in my opinion) lead to their ultimate legal demise.

it's next to impossible to predict how we owners proceed from here.

thanks so much. your comments and helpful and appreciated. please stay in touch.

happy new year!

chefcristo

Keep in mind that the attorney working on this for the owners certainly can bring another law suit which may bring additional compensation to the owners; the attorney can't bring charges. I don't know if another law suit would deal with the issue of lowering the maintenance fee for the future. I believe that a new board that truly represents the owners would be the ones that could do that.

Furthermore, while I don't know if any laws were broken by having a Board that represents the interest of the developer and not the owners or that passing budgets that benefits the developer and not the owner. However, that is where the Attorney General's office needs to be gotten involved, not to get a monetary settlement like they did, but to bring chargers of fraud or illegal business practices if they find that appropriate for the developer's actions.

 

[chefcristo]

Keep in mind that the attorney working on this for the owners certainly can bring another law suit which may bring additional compensation to the owners; the attorney can't bring charges. I don't know if another law suit would deal with the issue of lowering the maintenance fee for the future. I believe that a new board that truly represents the owners would be the ones that could do that.

Furthermore, while I don't know if any laws were broken by having a Board that represents the interest of the developer and not the owners or that passing budgets that benefits the developer and not the owner. However, that is where the Attorney General's office needs to be gotten involved, not to get a monetary settlement like they did, but to bring chargers of fraud or illegal business practices if they find that appropriate for the developer's actions.

tamaradarann.

you are SO right:....."that is where the Attorney General's office needs to be gotten involved, not to get a monetary settlement like they did, but to bring chargers of fraud or illegal business practices if they find that appropriate for the developer's actions."

the former nysag, eric schneiderman had direct evidence and proof of criminal fraud from the investigations of his undercover agents. under cover. they attended and recorded sales presentations where it was determined that the sales dept lied, misled, shammed and lured purchasers to buy knowing very well what financial misery the future would bring for many of the buyers. the end result was the sham and nonsensical SETTLEMENT that schneiderman accepted. the bottom line seemed to be "i won my case for new york state, and screw the TMC shareowners.".....not schneiderman's quote, but his apparent bottom line.

as i said previously, another private suit is pending awaiting the possible release of TMC's owners' contact information, very unlikely, since that list would help the attorney getting support of many other domestic and foreign TMC purchasers. this would almost surely result in
the attorney's winning his case possibly offering shareowners retribution and punishing the fraudulent and illegal actions of TMC PRINCIPALS with jail time similar to ponzi schemers

 

[Pathways]

The association must bring in enough cash to run the resort. That cash must come from the 'paying' owners. When a huge % of owners have packed it in, the others must pay, therefore the huge increases.

Bluegreen ownership will eventually bring the fees down, but only as they sell the units to new owners. And that will be a slow process, with any reduction in maintenance fees occurring in arrears. In fact, the high fees will be a detriment to Bluegreen sales. One has to wonder if they will try to form a new association for the weeks they own and thereby be able to charge less, or whether they will throw some cash into the association and subsidize it until their sales get going.

Settlement money is only a dream. Getting control of the Club has to be the real goal.

 

[Tamaradarann]

The association must bring in enough cash to run the resort. That cash must come from the 'paying' owners. When a huge % of owners have packed it in, the others must pay, therefore the huge increases.

Bluegreen ownership will eventually bring the fees down, but only as they sell the units to new owners. And that will be a slow process, with any reduction in maintenance fees occurring in arrears. In fact, the high fees will be a detriment to Bluegreen sales. One has to wonder if they will try to form a new association for the weeks they own and thereby be able to charge less, or whether they will throw some cash into the association and subsidize it until their sales get going.

Settlement money is only a dream. Getting control of the Club has to be the real goal.

I totally agree that getting control of the Club, the Association is the key. However, the issue that you brought up about owners packing it in is another factor. Why would so many owners pack it in, it is certainly a desirable location in NYC? High Maintenance! The Developer has been renting units for a considerable amount of cash, where is that money going? If the developer has units that are NOT owned by owners or owners are NOT paying their maintenance, then the money they receive in rent should be going to help pay the operation of the timeshare. If it is not then and the developer is keeping that money then that's where the fraud comes in and why the maintenance double what it should be. In simple numbers if the operation of the timeshare with full ownership would result in $1500/year maintenance but only 1/2 the units are owned by maintenance paying owners, then the maintenance needs to be $3000/year to operate the timeshare. However, if they are renting the units at $300/night, which is a bargain in NYC, there is plenty of money to make up for the maintenance deficit.

 

[Pathways]

Why would so many owners pack it in, it is certainly a desirable location in NYC? High Maintenance!

While I have no insider knowledge, I did seriously consider a resale purchase here a few years ago. My concern at the time was not the high fees, but the ability to reserve. I believe that is the reason most people walked. When you pay your fees you expect to be able to use your unit, and it just wasn't happening.

While the fees were on the high end, they were not totally unreasonable. Then, as the fraud issues became public, and owners realized Eichner was renting prime rooms by the night and taking the money, more and more owners just quit paying. Then it all just snowballed with the fees escalating and then more people just throwing their annual invoice into the trash.

In simple numbers if the operation of the timeshare with full ownership would result in $1500/year maintenance but only 1/2 the units are owned by maintenance paying owners, then the maintenance needs to be $3000/year to operate the timeshare. However, if they are renting the units at $300/night, which is a bargain in NYC, there is plenty of money to make up for the maintenance deficit.

I will not argue the actual numbers, but the issue remains the association is so far upside down that without a huge infusion of cash, it will be a long, hard road to a balance sheet that allows for 'normal' fees. I assume Bluegreen has a plan for the units they are inheriting with the purchase, but I won't hold my breath for any quick relief for current owners.

 

[Panina]

While I have no insider knowledge, I did seriously consider a resale purchase here a few years ago. My concern at the time was not the high fees, but the ability to reserve. I believe that is the reason most people walked. When you pay your fees you expect to be able to use your unit, and it just wasn't happening.

While the fees were on the high end, they were not totally unreasonable. Then, as the fraud issues became public, and owners realized Eichner was renting prime rooms by the night and taking the money, more and more owners just quit paying. Then it all just snowballed with the fees escalating and then more people just throwing their annual invoice into the trash.



I will not argue the actual numbers, but the issue remains the association is so far upside down that without a huge infusion of cash, it will be a long, long road to a balance sheet that allows for 'normal' fees. I assume Bluegreen has a plan for the units they are inheriting with the purchase, but I won't hold my breath for any quick relief for current owners.

Bluegreen took over management/ownership of units of Blue Ridge Village and within the year increased the mfs as they were too low for managing the property. Hopefully with correct management they will get Manhattan Club running correctly.

 

[chefcristo]

i agree with the following stated on TUG regarding THE MANHATTAN CLUB:
basically, most of the problems shareowners face with TMC emanate with the management (board of directors,BOD) made up of the majority of members having voting privileges, and the 3 others, who are also shareowners like the other 14,000+ of us, are there merely for "decoration" having no say whatsoever regarding any facets of running OUR timeshare. this includes the establishment of the maintenance fee amounts per week owned. TMC's management still remains with the original developer (eicnher) and his fraudulent crew as the majority voting members. the BOD was never turned over to the shareowners. WE have absolutely NOTHING to say about fees, governance or reservation policies. eichner's ability to rent our space to non-owners via travel websites, e.g., booking.com, hotels.com, et al, makes up for any financial deficits from some shareowners not paying maintenance fees.

since there is a shareowners' attorney currently in the scenario, he rightfully is keeping his legal strategies within the scope of those who have joined his possible suit. he is not divulging his ways and means of proceeding. he has said that it is important for him to have a list of shareowners' contacts to make them aware of the possible suit. i agree with that requirement, but someone on TUG commented that it's the board that needs to be court-directed to turn over the MANAGEMENT of TMC to the shareowners, which seems like a very reasonable demand to be a major part of any private lawsuit. i pause here to add a comment/question/query: doesn't the current nysag, barbara underwood, have the power to make this demand in court. (i state here that i have little or no legal expertise, only common sense as do the people commenting here on TUG.)

i thank TUG and its contributors for all of the insights offered so far. i hope others will add helpful suggestions and input to help TMC with possible fair and enforceable strategies to combat the fraud heaped upon us. there are so many shareowners who are now in a distressful financial bind with a worthless entity that, in many cases, they can't use due to non-availability of reservation time primarily due to overselling of shares and renting to non-shareowners.

fraud (in any form) can happen to any of us. i hope people who are not yet timeshare owners read some of the horror stories about that part of the timeshare industry that is heavily tainted with criminally fraudulent activities. the name of the game is "caveat emptor"............LET THE BUYER BEWARE! again the keywords are"enforceable state and national timeshare regulation and legislation."

 

[jehb2]

Just to add. I've exchanged into TMC 3 times. Each time I've had absolutely no problem getting an exchange. I also have been offered prime weeks such as Fleet Week. Sadly owner's have a really difficult time getting a reservation. Last time we did a sales presentation, one of the requirements for attending the tour was that "we did not know any current or former Manhattan Club owners."

 

[chefcristo]

Just to add. I've exchanged into TMC 3 times. Each time I've had absolutely no problem getting an exchange. I also have been offered prime weeks such as Fleet Week. Sadly owner's have a really difficult time getting a reservation. Last time we did a sales presentation, one of the requirements for attending the tour was that "we did not know any current or former Manhattan Club owners."

hi jehb2,
your response is typical: give non-owners (prime) accommodations for the $$$, and screw the owners; they pay the maintenance fees anyway. isn't that called double-dipping or, dare i say, criminal fraud? your experience speaks for itself.

 

[DRIless]

The association must bring in enough cash to run the resort. That cash must come from the 'paying' owners. When a huge % of owners have packed it in, the others must pay, therefore the huge increases.

Bluegreen ownership will eventually bring the fees down, but only as they sell the units to new owners. And that will be a slow process, with any reduction in maintenance fees occurring in arrears. In fact, the high fees will be a detriment to Bluegreen sales. One has to wonder if they will try to form a new association for the weeks they own and thereby be able to charge less, or whether they will throw some cash into the association and subsidize it until their sales get going.

Settlement money is only a dream. Getting control of the Club has to be the real goal.

My family members were Charter Members of TMC when the week could be split into three weekends F/S + F/S + F/S/Su. Bought for about $20,000 with original MFs around $400. The combination of hard to get reservations because TMC was renting out time (maybe, probably more than they owned in unsold inventory) and the meteoric rise in MFs for the 1BR/2Ba unit caused us to sell more than 10 years ago. Got almost .60 on the dollar and consider ourselves fortunate. Family name is still on the bronze Charter Member plaque on the 26th floor.

I was at TMC over New Years through Royal Holiday Club. The 26th floor lounge hallway was plastered with Bluegreen resort pictures. Bluegreen sells points. Yes, they're based on a deeded property. If Bluegreen is actually selling TMC you could be buying at a BG sales center in Las Vegas, Williamsburg, or Orlando and end up with a Manhattan Club deed if you bought a big enough points package. With Bluegreen your maintenance fee is based upon the number of points assigned to the deed and every modern Bluegreen points owner pays the same MF/point no matter where they own.

If I wanted to go to TMC again this year for New Years, there are 9 Studios and 11 1BR/2Ba units still available. The cost of the Studio MF and extra fee/taxes for a week would be about $1800 and the 1BR about $2100 (and of course you got your RHC points for nothing on eBay. There's no availability for 2021 at this point which either means the contract hasn't been negotiated yet or it's not going to be renewed?

 

[Carol C]

Unfortunately, buying from the developer is usually overpriced. Most timeshare are given away for free in the resale market. Most of us on TUG bought our first timeshare from the developer. My first purchase from the developer 20+ years ago is now worth $0. One day when I want to get rid of the MF obligation, I hope the developer is willing to take back from me and resell at a huge profit.

I think owners are pissed at the horribly inflated maintenance fee...not their purchase price. I'm sure MC owners know that buying from the resort on retail market is higher than resale. Don't add insult to injury. My heart goes out to all MC owners...and at $3000 maint fee I would let it foreclose, let Bluegreen or whoever ding my credit too. If enough people do it they could write a joint letter, try to get it published on a paid ad page in NY Times, and then give that letter to the three credit agencies for their files, to show why they stopped paying the extortion fee of $3k annually.

 

[Tamaradarann]

hi jehb2,
your response is typical: give non-owners (prime) accommodations for the $$$, and screw the owners; they pay the maintenance fees anyway. isn't that called double-dipping or, dare i say, criminal fraud? your experience speaks for itself.

As I said before, setting up the Board Control with Developer Representatives instead of Owner Representative was the criminal fraud! Anything that happened after that whether it was making it harder for owners to book their weeks or book prime weeks, renting units out for cash to non owners or perspective buyers, or raising the maintenance fees to ridiculous amounts were the result of the initial fraud that the developer set up. I don't know how the Attorney General or anyone else can solve this problem to make the owners whole but that is what should happen. It would be great to know that as part of their purchase Bluegreen has a financial plan to make the maintenance fees next year in line what they should be for current owners as well as for the timeshare units that they will be marketing.

 

[chefcristo]

tamaradarann,

there were very few owners who dwelled on your well-noted fact..." setting up the Board Control with Developer Representatives instead of Owner Representative was the criminal fraud!" many other fraudulent actions could probably have been avoided if your issue was tackled by the former nysag, eric schneiderman. instead, he pursued only the other issues as you noted, NOT TO OWNERS' BENEFIT. i have questions about his legal methods tacticts expertise.

there was literally NO ONE ON THE BOARD WHO (EVEN THOUGH 3 NON-VOTING BOARD MEMBERS WERE OWNERS.......JUST LIKE US......) HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO REPRESENT US DEFRAUDED OWNERS. THEY WERE PUPPETS MANIPULATED BY IAN BRUCE EICHNER, THE DEVELOPER. THE FOREGOING ALL-CAPS COMMENT GIVES ONE PAUSE: those non-voting members might have been...................

for the moment, my silence prevails.

please keep in touch. i've gotten empathy, sympathy but most of all, much food for thought concerning TMC from this TUG FORUM. responders have been very helpful with their comments. that's very much appreciated.

thanks again,
chefcristo (chris)

As I said before, setting up the Board Control with Developer Representatives instead of Owner Representative was the criminal fraud! Anything that happened after that whether it was making it harder for owners to book their weeks or book prime weeks, renting units out for cash to non owners or perspective buyers, or raising the maintenance fees to ridiculous amounts were the result of the initial fraud that the developer set up. I don't know how the Attorney General or anyone else can solve this problem to make the owners whole but that is what should happen. It would be great to know that as part of their purchase Bluegreen has a financial plan to make the maintenance fees next year in line what they should be for current owners as well as for the timeshare units that they will be marketing.

 

[chefcristo]

whoever knows a definitive answer to this question, please respond:
is it against demands/issues of privacy for a timeshare not to release contact information (only email addresses) of all of its shareowners?

 

[VacationForever]

whoever knows a definitive answer to this question, please respond:
is it against demands/issues of privacy for a timeshare not to release contact information (only email addresses) of all of its shareowners?

It is against privacy laws, otherwise anyone could spam others directly. However, in a class action lawsuit, where approved by the court, the attorney has access to all contact information.

 

[chefcristo]

It is against privacy laws, otherwise anyone could spam others directly. However, in a class action lawsuit, where approved by the court, the attorney has access to all contact information.

thanks very much for your response. that's a workable, concrete and reasonable answer. i will relay your comment to those working on a possible lawsuit.

thanks again,
chris