Canceled reservation = refund of many types of points (long-ish post)

[GMan82]

Hi everyone,
So I was perusing TUG to see if I could find an answer to an issue I just encountered regarding types of points. The question was about refunds that lead a return of current year points, saved points, and borrowed points.

Some background, I joined last September and so had to save 2018 points into 2019. I've been enjoying my use of points, and earlier this year had utilized my saved points, all my current year points, and even borrowed a few points from 2020. Most of this (5760 points) was in a Hilton Head reservation, that happened to coincide with Dorian, and so I had to "cancel" / move that reservation elsewhere (to Orlando below) and a slew of points were refunded to me across the saved, current, and borrowed hierarchies.

The borrowed points went back to 2020. However, I had a bunch of saved and current points all of a sudden. I called the Club, and they were able to redistribute saved points over both completed stays and upcoming reservations so that I could consolidate and have ONLY current year points remaining, and all the saved points in use. So I thought, well, this is great! The Club helped me and that's awesome.

I have an upcoming reservation in Orlando for a conference and decided to go early and enjoy Orlando and the resorts some. Well, an opening at Tuscany Villages came, and so I moved my Las Palmeras reservation there, resulting in 240 SAVED points being returned. I didn't even realize there were still saved points. But this reservation was the changed Hilton Head one, so I guess the saved points were used first. So I called the Club. The first agent said that because saved points were used, saved points were then returned and could not be swapped with current year points, even in a future reservation. I have a MarBrisa reservation in December of this year utilizing current year points. So I HUCA'ed. Next agent said the same thing but got a supervisor to approve the swap.

However, they were then VERY clear to me that it was an EXCEPTION to the rules, and that this exception WOULD NOT be made again. I have no idea why that's the case, especially if points are points when used to make reservations. He said my only options should be make a hotel reservation (with 240 points? um yeah), Club Partner Perks, or RCI deposit.

I've been reading the rules. Page 8 of the Club Reference says:
"ClubPoint Expiration. In the event a Member fails to use any or all of their ClubPoints before expiration, the ClubPoints will expire and will not be available for use in succeeding years . The Member shall have no reservation, exchange, reinstatement or other point stretching options for any or all expired ClubPoints . ClubPoints are not transferable . Members should monitor their ClubPoint balances …"

While I scanned the rest of the rules, and didn't outright fully peruse, I don't recall seeing anywhere that I couldn't consolidate points across my reservations so that saved points are burned first.

1. Is their response a reference to the bolded line above?
2. Am I just misinformed and the initial consolidation / redistribution was a courtesy due to Dorian?
3. If what I asked about is legal per the rules, how should I phrase the question to the next agent? Should I just ask to speak to a supervisor directly?
4. Is there a loophole I could utilize with my current reservations -- for instance downgrade MarBrisa to a studio to return some current year points and then re-upgrade to a 1 BR so that the saved points would then be used?

Thanks for your help! It's been a steep learning curve to learn the ins/outs. But I've learned a lot regarding the ins/outs of this system including walking my first reservation.

 

[escanoe]

Glad you asked this. It is a pain that due to various booking circumstances and changing plans that your points that will expire first are not always used first. I look forward to seeing the responses.

 

[seagila]

Is there a loophole I could utilize with my current reservations -- for instance downgrade MarBrisa to a studio to return some current year points and then re-upgrade to a 1 BR so that the saved points would then be used?

I've done this several times to shuffle points taken from different buckets. I don't necessarily think it's a loophole. Unless they've changed how the reservation system works, I suggest doing the following to your Marbrisa reservation:

1. Extend your current reservation to however many days you need to use up all your 240 saved points. If the modified reservation ends up using additional current year or borrowed points, that's okay.
2. Now that your modified reservation includes your 240 saved points, change it back to your original dates to release the additional points you took when you first modified it. It should keep the 240 saved points and release borrowed points then current year points next, in that order.

I would keep track of your points when doing these changes to make sure your total number of points available are accounted for. Hope it still works the way I remember it. Good luck.

 

[GT75]

I am "managing" my points all of the time. In fact, just yesterday I called HGVC CS to adjust my points to get them into the correct buckets. I agree with what @Seagila has already stated. If you have 2018 saved points into 2019, then you can adjust your 2019 reservation to use all of your saved points. I am assuming that your 2019 reservation(s) {you can look at the reservation to see where the points are coming from) is using some 2019 points (and or 2020 points). I would call HGVC CS and have them change your 2019 reservation, reduce it by one day and then add the day back. This should pull you remaining saved points.

btw, this only works for a changeable reservation.

Btw, log your point totals before you start to ensure that the transaction is accurate. I had an issued a couple of years ago but none lately thankfully.

 

[GMan82]

I've done this several times to shuffle points taken from different buckets. I don't necessarily think it's a loophole. Unless they've changed how the reservation system works, I suggest doing the following to your Marbrisa reservation:

1. Extend your current reservation to however many days you need to use up all your 240 saved points. If the modified reservation ends up using additional current year or borrowed points, that's okay.
2. Now that your modified reservation includes your 240 saved points, change it back to your original dates to release the additional points you took when you first modified it. It should keep the 240 saved points and release borrowed points then current year points next, in that order.

I would keep track of your points when doing these changes to make sure your total number of points available are accounted for. Hope it still works the way I remember it. Good luck.

Thanks, that's a good way of doing things, which would have allowed me to keep my current reservation and not endanger it. I was just put off by the Club reps. They made it seem like it was a HUGE favor they were doing me, and the warning that this exception wouldn't be made again irritating.

Yes, prior to HHI, I had no other reservations because I was already on 2020 year points. I even did an open season Las Vegas stay (way cheaper than Hilton.com on July 4th weekend) at the Boulevard. Then HHI occurred and I used the trick of moving the reservation > 30 days and then converted that to my Orlando reservation. So my upcoming Orlando reservation was ALL saved points. I hadn't even thought to check. So by switching resorts and reducing points, only saved points were returned. In hindsight, I probably should have just waited a bit and thought about it (or searched / posted here), and the idea of modifying my existing future reservation to shuffle the buckets would have surfaced.

Thanks everyone. I wish the Club would assist us with these things, rather than claim they're going out of their way by executing some exception. But, I'm learning that expert assistance is what TUG is for!

 

[frank808]

Sorry to OP but I have a question.

I have a current reservation for ocean front lagoon tower using borrowed 2020 points. Due to dropping a few days from an August reservation I now have 3500 2019 points. I called to have the lagoon reservation swap out the 3500 borrowed 2020 points for current 2019 points. Rep told me they could not do that unless I wanted to cancell my reservation and rebook. Was further told that I could lose the reservation I have if I did his.

Just wondering if there is a way I can swap points without losing the reservation? Thanks

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[GMan82]

Can you tack on a few days to either end of the reservation to use 3500 points, and then remove those days, so that the 3500 points returned are the borrowed future points?

Or try upgrading your reservation and then downgrading back to desired room type.

If those aren’t options, then maybe a quick move of the reservation to a Vegas or Orlando resort using the needed number of points, and then an immediate move back. I guess it carries a risk of losing the reservation if someone is looking at that exact moment, but it seems like a low risk. Maybe call and have the club do it? Or do it yourself online?

 

[GT75]

I have a current reservation for ocean front lagoon tower using borrowed 2020 points.

How many days are in your reservation? If 4 or more then call the club and have them reduce the reservation by 1 day and then add back the day (repeat if necessary). It would be better to add a day or two if available (but usually this isn't available) and then reduce back to original. I always have HGVC CS do this because they should be able to perform this action very quickly w/o someone picking off a day.

Edited to add: I am assuming you have a changeable reservation which is > 30 days out.

 

[pianodinosaur]

Unfortunately, the only points that do not have an expiration date are HONORS points. The conversion rate from HGVC to HHONORS is not that great and there have been multiple point devaluations in the 19 years I have been with the program. However, I did make such a conversion due to an illness in the family that changed our travel plans. These points have been used for a 5 day trip to The Buffalo Thunder Resort in Santa Fe and to book a 5 day stay at Hilton Cavalieri in Rome for next year.

It seems to be an inherent problem within the system that timesharing requires planning in advance and that personal circumstances may change after plans have been made. I have found the HGVC app to be helpful in managing my points as well as The HHONORS app.

 

[goaliedave]

'exceptions' happen all the time when you phone in. I've benefitted from several rule breaking calls, as have many others who post on Facebook groups I frequent.

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[SmithOp]

How many days are in your reservation? If 4 or more then call the club and have them reduce the reservation by 1 day and then add back the day (repeat if necessary). It would be better to add a day or two if available (but usually this isn't available) and then reduce back to original. I always have HGVC CS do this because they should be able to perform this action very quickly w/o someone picking off a day.

Edited to add: I am assuming you have a changeable reservation which is > 30 days out.

I’ve done this myself in order to swap use year points around, but it was last year when the web site was stable. Given the way its been acting up lately I would advise calling in as GT75 suggests.


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