Anyone Else Put a Deposit Down on a Tesla Model 3 ?

[VacationForever]

Any your current ICE car does 700 miles non stop? And your bladder!

I won't hang around at a place for more than 10 minutes to refuel or for bathroom breaks. One meal stop for lunch for about 45 minutes maximum.

 

[SMHarman]

I won't hang around at a place for more than 10 minutes to refuel or for bathroom breaks. One meal stop for lunch for about 45 minutes maximum.

So when the more extensive supercharger network exists. Just like an extensive gas station network now eexists that did not when the Model T was launched.

Full charge 200 miles. 10 minute. Rest/pee stop add 60 miles. 45 min lunch, add 200. 10 min rest add 60.

That's not 700 but 520. The delta is minimal and a larger battery pack can address the difference.

 

[Elan]

I don't see the problem. EV isn't yet in a best case scenario for those who need to drive long distance routinely. For those of us - the majority, I suspect - in a city, even 100 mile range is sufficient. In fact, one of my team has a Fiat electric that goes about 100 miles and he doesn't have any problems. I think the Model 3 ~215 miles (or 193, at the suggested 90% capacity) would be much more than I need on a regular basis.

There's no "problem". It is what it is. If you live near multiple superchargers and/or only use your car for short jaunts to the mini mart you're fine. To suggest that those of us that don't meet that criteria "don't understand" the charging network is insulting and, quite simply, ignorant. I think the subsequent comments by many in the thread has shown where the true lack of understanding lies.

I put money on a 3. Would love to own one. But not unless they offer a range upgrade for a reasonable price. It's not a practical option for me, because I don't need or want a Tesla simply to drive back and forth to work. I won't realize enough in savings to justify $35K. Your point regarding the 100mi range Fiat only strengthens my case. Most people live within 20mi of their work, so one could argue that 50mi range should be sufficient. Why isn't it? Because people want to use their cars for more than their work commute, and rightfully so.

 

[Passepartout]

I think we can all agree that EVs are the future of cars. It might be Tesla, or it might be some other inventive provider. Or maybe one of the old 'standard' automakers will step in. Surely there are enough viable ideas to make a vibrant marketplace.

A 3-wheel electric 'commuter cycle' might serve the needs of some. A Fiat e-car with 80 miles range may suit others, while nothing short of a super luxurious Tesla that can eat up 0-60mph in 3 seconds will do for still others. Someone wants an electric pickup truck- and surely there's a market for commercial electric delivery vehicles to bring us our Amazon Prime purchases.

We are at the dawn- no longer the crack of dawn in electric vehicles. They will improve, evolve, and there will probably be a place in the mix for longer-range hybrids for the long hauls.

It will be fun to observe and partake in the evolution.

Jim

 

[Elan]

The 3 with a 200 mile range is about 4 h of in seat time.

Further, you need to paradigm shift and realize your gas station is now your home. Slightly short of range? 10 minutes at the supercharger gets you a 60 mile top up. Enough to get you home. About the same length of time a gas and go takes.

Also. All day at the destination. Even a wall outlet will add 15 miles of range over 5 hours.

You switch from a fill up to a top up mentality.

I can't think of the last time I went only 200mi in 4 hours (50mph??). And you're assuming there's a supercharger at my destination. Let's say I travel a more reasonable 140 miles in my 2 hours. And there's no supercharger at my destination. Now what? I sit for 5 hours, without the use of my car, to get 15 miles of additional range....

Any way you slice it, a 200mi range is restrictive if you live in other than a major metropolitan area. Effectively, my original comment.

 

[SMHarman]

I live in the Binghamton area, and to travel to anywhere west is difficult.

I go to Buffalo several times a year, and there is one station at just about 200 miles from me.

There is no way to get to Pittsburgh, another frequent trip.

Nothing out Route 17/I-86, until it changes to I-90 in Cleveland.

For now, the investment for us is not worthwhile.

But 81/90 to Buffalo via Syacuse is the same timewise and a supercharger exists in Syracuse.

80 is a gap. Lewisburg / Milton and State College and DuBois need supercharger. Tesla indicate that is on their 2016 plan though.

 

[SMHarman]

I can't think of the last time I went only 200mi in 4 hours (50mph??). And you're assuming there's a supercharger at my destination. Let's say I travel a more reasonable 140 miles in my 2 hours. And there's no supercharger at my destination. Now what? I sit for 5 hours, without the use of my car, to get 15 miles of additional range....

Any way you slice it, a 200mi range is restrictive if you live in other than a major metropolitan area. Effectively, my original comment.

I guess you live by an interstate on ramp?

Door to door average speed drops quickly while getting out of the city / suburb and at the other end. Even the 10 min break pulls down the average speed quickly. As does slowing down and stopping for tolls / stop lights etc.

The only way to travel 140 miles in 2 hours is to pull out of your drive and immediately accelerate to 70 and stay there for 2 hours.

Or drive 10 mins to the interstate at 30 and now you need to drive in the interstate at 80. Stopping for the ticket will lop time off your average speed then.

Or do you live in Germany or Montana?

 

[Pens_Fan]

But 81/90 to Buffalo via Syacuse is the same timewise and a supercharger exists in Syracuse.

80 is a gap. Lewisburg / Milton and State College and DuBois need supercharger.

I actually live about 20 miles west of Binghamton, so it would be backtracking to go up I-81.

Distance would increase about 40 miles and time would increase about 30 minutes (plus charging time in Syracuse).

Is it horrible, no, but definitely inconvenient.

 

[PigsDad]

Or do you live in Germany or Montana?

Not sure if you have been "out West" lately, but the interstate speed limits are mostly 75 or 80 around here. That translates to 80 or 85 before you really have to worry about getting pulled over. For a road trip, an average or 70 is not that far off.

BTW, what does traveling at 80 mph do to the driving range of the typical EV? I'm guessing the estimated range is based on driving much slower.

Kurt

 

[SMHarman]

Not sure if you have been "out West" lately, but the interstate speed limits are mostly 75 or 80 around here. That translates to 80 or 85 before you really have to worry about getting pulled over. For a road trip, an average or 70 is not that far off.

BTW, what does traveling at 80 mph do to the driving range of the typical EV? I'm guessing the estimated range is based on driving much slower.

Kurt

I do not do much out west driving. That I do is usually in the winter.

Speed limits on the East coast are way to low on many parts of the I system imho. Huge swathes of 90 88 80 87 91 outside the city exits could easily and safely be 80mph limits

 

[VacationForever]

Yep, I cover 140 miles in 2 hours and I drive mainly on I-5 and 99 on the West. My commute goes from Northearn CA down to Palm Springs area and Las Vegas area regularly and sometimes a little further east .

 

[Elan]

Not sure if you have been "out West" lately, but the interstate speed limits are mostly 75 or 80 around here. That translates to 80 or 85 before you really have to worry about getting pulled over. For a road trip, an average or 70 is not that far off.

BTW, what does traveling at 80 mph do to the driving range of the typical EV? I'm guessing the estimated range is based on driving much slower.

Kurt

Exactly. I'm about to give up on trying to point out that not all of the world lives in overpopulated s**t-holes.

Pull out a map, people. There's a big world out there. We don't all live in Boston or LA. I can be on the interstate in 10 minutes, and that's taking 45-55mph roads to get there. We don't have toll roads out west (for the most part). I can't recall the last time I went on an interstate roadtrip where I didn't hit at least 90mph. Nor the last time I got a speeding ticket.

Maybe this will help.

Idaho (note the absence of superchargers):

 

[SMHarman]

Exactly. I'm about to give up on trying to point out that not all of the world lives in overpopulated s**t-holes.

Pull out a map, people. There's a big world out there. We don't all live in Boston or LA. I can be on the interstate in 10 minutes, and that's taking 45-55mph roads to get there. We don't have toll roads out west (for the most part). I can't recall the last time I went on an interstate roadtrip where I didn't hit at least 90mph. Nor the last time I got a speeding ticket.

Maybe this will help.

Idaho (note the absence of superchargers):

I get that but average driving speeds get pulled down quickly.

10 mins at 50 now needs 10 mins at 90 or 20 at 80 to get the average back to 70.

10 mins rest stop 0 requires 50 at 80 to get the average back.

On the east side of the country these averages are tough and likely to get you a ticket.

 

[Ken555]

There's no "problem". It is what it is. If you live near multiple superchargers and/or only use your car for short jaunts to the mini mart you're fine. To suggest that those of us that don't meet that criteria "don't understand" the charging network is insulting and, quite simply, ignorant. I think the subsequent comments by many in the thread has shown where the true lack of understanding lies.

Stop stating that I'm insulting you. I'm not as ignorant as you think. It's getting tiring, and you're not winning any points by doing so. Somehow you think I don't get the reality of where you live because I have a different opinion, but that doesn't make my opinion invalid nor, as seems likely, exactly what Tesla is actually doing.

I put money on a 3. Would love to own one. But not unless they offer a range upgrade for a reasonable price. It's not a practical option for me, because I don't need or want a Tesla simply to drive back and forth to work. I won't realize enough in savings to justify $35K. Your point regarding the 100mi range Fiat only strengthens my case. Most people live within 20mi of their work, so one could argue that 50mi range should be sufficient. Why isn't it? Because people want to use their cars for more than their work commute, and rightfully so.

No, I disagree (surprise!). The Fiats seem to be selling well (I see many of them in LA...of which you had an eloquent description and opinion). EVs are great commuter cars. Many early adopters kept an ICE for long distance purposes, but that is rapidly changing.

We get your issue. And yes, it's a problem because you're making it into one. I don't see the problem, and it's not a problem for me. If the capabilities of the car and the charging realities don't work for you, then don't buy one. I know you want one, and I appreciate that. But don't make the car seem inferior simply because you live in a region that doesn't support early investment into new technology etc etc. I really shouldn't have to explain this, as I'm sure you know it already.

 

[Ken555]

Until the superchargers are able to charge the car a within 15 minutes (instead of the 2 plus hours I think it takes to get to full charge )[...]

~30 minutes for 170 miles, which (depending on your route) is apparently likely to get you within range of another supercharger. Not ideal but not bad, either.

 

[Jason245]

~30 minutes for 170 miles, which (depending on your route) is apparently likely to get you within range of another supercharger. Not ideal but not bad, either.

30 minutes to partially full up (170 miles ) vs 5 minutes for 350 miles to 400 miles on my accord. .

Now imagine 5 people in line in front of you. .

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk

 

[Ken555]

30 minutes to partially full up (170 miles ) vs 5 minutes for 350 miles to 400 miles on my accord. .

Now imagine 5 people in line in front of you. .

Not sure why you think this is news. Must we qualify our posts with the obvious?

In any case, do you think Tesla hasn't thought through the impact of this very obvious issue? At this stage, either you trust that they will offer a product that works, or not. For me, that's the overriding question. All else will work out.

Obviously, some will need to wait for the car with a battery that can handle driving cross country without stopping, but that's not the product they have right now.

 

[Elan]

Stop stating that I'm insulting you. I'm not as ignorant as you think. It's getting tiring, and you're not winning any points by doing so. Somehow you think I don't get the reality of where you live because I have a different opinion, but that doesn't make my opinion invalid nor, as seems likely, exactly what Tesla is actually doing.






No, I disagree (surprise!). The Fiats seem to be selling well (I see many of them in LA...of which you had an eloquent description and opinion). EVs are great commuter cars. Many early adopters kept an ICE for long distance purposes, but that is rapidly changing.

We get your issue. And yes, it's a problem because you're making it into one. I don't see the problem, and it's not a problem for me. If the capabilities of the car and the charging realities don't work for you, then don't buy one. I know you want one, and I appreciate that. But don't make the car seem inferior simply because you live in a region that doesn't support early investment into new technology etc etc. I really shouldn't have to explain this, as I'm sure you know it already.

Ken, I wasn't directing my comments at you.

I find it insulting for someone to state that I "don't understand" something, simply because I don't fit their myopic view of the world. And then to further state that I have "abnormal" driving habits when numerous others here have agreed with my stance because they have similar driving habits. Maybe someone's view of normal is skewed..........

I've stated my position quite clearly. I am interested, but not with the current range restrictions. Hopefully Tesla offers an affordable range extension package. I wasn't making the car sound inferior by simply stating that it doesn't meet my needs. That's your inference. If I thought it was inferior, I wouldn't have put a deposit on one.

Yes, I get that a moderate range works for you and others. I'm not attempting to invalidate that. I'm simply pointing out that it doesn't work for me (or, quite obviously, many others here). Why isn't that a valid position without it being due to my lack of "understanding" or "abnormal" driving habits? Seriously. Why is it so difficult to simply agree that the range is restrictive for those of us in less populated areas until either the range is extended, or the supercharger network grows immensely?

 

[Ken555]

Ken, I wasn't directing my comments at you.



I find it insulting for someone to state that I "don't understand" something, simply because I don't fit their myopic view of the world. And then to further state that I have "abnormal" driving habits when numerous others here have agreed with my stance because they have similar driving habits. Maybe someone's view of normal is skewed..........



I've stated my position quite clearly. I am interested, but not with the current range restrictions. Hopefully Tesla offers an affordable range extension package. I wasn't making the car sound inferior by simply stating that it doesn't meet my needs. That's your inference. If I thought it was inferior, I wouldn't have put a deposit on one.



Yes, I get that a moderate range works for you and others. I'm not attempting to invalidate that. I'm simply pointing out that it doesn't work for me (or, quite obviously, many others here). Why isn't that a valid position without it being due to my lack of "understanding" or "abnormal" driving habits? Seriously. Why is it so difficult to simply agree that the range is restrictive for those of us in less populated areas until either the range is extended, or the supercharger network grows immensely?

This makes complete sense.

I suspect this is just an issue of posters using incorrect words to describe their intent. Abnormal instead of rare, etc.

 

[Blues]

BTW, what does traveling at 80 mph do to the driving range of the typical EV? I'm guessing the estimated range is based on driving much slower.

Kurt

https://www.teslamotors.com/blog/model-s-efficiency-and-range

 

[PigsDad]

https://www.teslamotors.com/blog/model-s-efficiency-and-range

Thanks for the pointer. Looking at the graph, the model S has a range of ~310 miles at 55 mph, and 220 miles at 80 mph. I would expect a similar performance curve on the newer models.

Kurt

 

[Ken555]

325,000 reservations so far

https://www.teslamotors.com/blog/the-week-electric-vehicles-went-mainstream


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[Jason245]

I think we can all agree that EVs are the future of cars. It might be Tesla, or it might be some other inventive provider. Or maybe one of the old 'standard' automakers will step in. Surely there are enough viable ideas to make a vibrant marketplace.

I disagree with this statement.

The EV concept for individual use has a number of deficiencies that have yet to be resolved.

Our countries infrastructure is not designed to be able to support EV becoming the primary form of auto used in this country, and I highly doubt it can get there in the next 10 years.

 

[Jason245]

Not sure why you think this is news. Must we qualify our posts with the obvious?

In any case, do you think Tesla hasn't thought through the impact of this very obvious issue? At this stage, either you trust that they will offer a product that works, or not. For me, that's the overriding question. All else will work out.

Obviously, some will need to wait for the car with a battery that can handle driving cross country without stopping, but that's not the product they have right now.

Believing they have a plan is one thing. . I would like to see the plan In action. . And to be honest, comitting to a purchase without even a test drive is something I just couldn't ever bring my self to do..

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[Ken555]

I disagree with this statement.



The EV concept for individual use has a number of deficiencies that have yet to be resolved.



Our countries infrastructure is not designed to be able to support EV becoming the primary form of auto used in this country, and I highly doubt it can get there in the next 10 years.

...look beyond 10 years into the future.