Being Gifted EOYE 210k Points from my parents

[Jason245]

Long story short:
My parents are transfering their "retail paid" Wyndham timeshare to me... Because it is a transfer to a family member, Wyndham is covering 100% of the transfer cost (nice).

Trying to make sure I plan for next year properly given that I doubt the full transfer will be complete (signing final paperwork this week with notary etc) for another few weeks.

I will admit I have been a little ignorant of the Wyndham program (I own HGVC), but from my reading it operates similar to HGVC (points seem to be points), but it doesn't have as many fees (I don't see a reservation fee, but I could be missing it). Also, it has a lot more destinations. I am guessing a similar 9 month reservation window for non home resort.

Can anyone point me to hidden fees if any (reservations etc), also are there any other things I should be cognizant of not to trip over or hidden tricks I can exploit?

e.g. HGVC lets me borrow next years points for free, walk reservations, and change my reservation fee free (as long as I don't cancel) up to the day before check in.

I am a big believe in living in the pocket of the timeshare company whenever possible and avoiding paying any extra fees and getting the max out of whatever it is I own.

Assuming it works out for me, I may pick up an odd year giveaway as an additional supplement (TBD).

 

[Grammarhero]

http://www.nxtbook.com/nxtbooks/wyndham/plus_membersdirectory1819/index.php#/19

 

[Jason245]

http://www.nxtbook.com/nxtbooks/wyndham/plus_membersdirectory1819/index.php#/19

Based on my read of this (correct me if I am wrong),

1. No reservation fees (assuming I don't go over the limit of reservations they give me)
2. I have up till 15 days before the reservation to cancel with no penalty.

Open question:
Express reservations (3 months out only) - looks like I can rent points ($12/1000) or borrow points from a future use year for express reservations.
Does that mean I can borrow 2022 points in 2020?
$12/1k points seems like a bad deal, or am I mistaken?
I didn't see anything written on borrowing outside of express window or am I wrong?

 

[Grammarhero]

Based on my read of this (correct me if I am wrong),

1. No reservation fees (assuming I don't go over the limit of reservations they give me)
2. I have up till 15 days before the reservation to cancel with no penalty.

Open question:
Express reservations (3 months out only) - looks like I can rent points ($12/1000) or borrow points from a future use year for express reservations.
Does that mean I can borrow 2022 points in 2020?
$12/1k points seems like a bad deal, or am I mistaken?
I didn't see anything written on borrowing outside of express window or am I wrong?

1. I believe you can only borrow pts from the following year. So unless you have 2021 pts, you can’t borrow.
2. $12/1k is awful and about twice what folks pay for Mf.

 

[cbyrne1174]

You can borrow 2 years out. Where is the contract deeded? It might not be worth it to keep since it's not a VIP account.

 

[dgalati]

You can borrow 2 years out. Where is the contract deeded? It might not be worth it to keep since it's not a VIP account.

Please consider this option before not taking ownership if it is a high maintenance fee deed. As a developer bought deed you may also give back through Ovations and receive 3 years free use with no maintenance fees. Please make note the owner of record can only make reservations and no guest reservations allowed when using for the three years. Not sure how it works on a family transfer but you also need to own for one year before Ovations will take back.

 

[paxsarah]

As a developer bought deed you may also give back through Ovations and receive 3 years free use with no maintenance fees.

The Limited Edition (three years' usage) is not available for biennial contracts.

 

[Jason245]

You can borrow 2 years out. Where is the contract deeded? It might not be worth it to keep since it's not a VIP account.

Ocean walk.. 203k points now that I re read.. running 66.05 per month..(roughly 7.8/ 1k point).

May not be the cheapest.. but I can still get more value from it than its cost (e.g. bonnet creek stays).

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[cbyrne1174]

Ocean walk is a high MF resort. I pay 5.45 per thousand and only had a $1000 buy in cost. I live in Tampa and dont have any issues booking ocean walk or bonnet creek when I want to go there using my Las Vegas points. It's like keeping a silver season HGVC deed to a resort you dont need the ARP for. You're paying extra more than what you need to.

 

[Jason245]

I understand what you are saying. I own bayclub 1br plat in hgvc. I do my math different than others, but respect how you do your math.

I simply look at this as a discounted vacation or vacations each year on a cash flow basis.

Am I saving as much as you...no.. but am I saving? Yes.. by my math about 25% or more off what a similar resort would cost me cash wise.



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[Grammarhero]

I understand what you are saying. I own bayclub 1br plat in hgvc. I do my math different than others, but respect how you do your math.

I simply look at this as a discounted vacation or vacations each year on a cash flow basis.

Am I saving as much as you...no.. but am I saving? Yes.. by my math about 25% or more off what a similar resort would cost me cash wise.



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Ocean Walk is actually $6.7/1k. Program fee is $135 no matter your pts up to 231k, which you appear to be pay twice. If you could get a 210 EOYO (maybe grand Desert), that would be great. Grand Desert is 5.3/1k. That would reduce your MF/1k for Ocean Walk.

 

[T-Dot-Traveller]

Long story short:
My parents are transfering their "retail paid" Wyndham timeshare to me... Because it is a transfer to a family member, Wyndham is covering 100% of the transfer cost (nice).

Ocean walk is a high MF resort. I pay 5.45 per thousand and only had a $1000 buy in cost. I live in Tampa and dont have any issues booking ocean walk or bonnet creek when I want to go there using my Las Vegas points. It's like keeping a silver season HGVC deed to a resort you dont need the ARP for. You're paying extra more than what you need to.

Ocean Walk is actually $6.7/1k. Program fee is $135 no matter your pts up to 231k, which you appear to be pay twice. If you could get a 210 EOYO (maybe grand Desert), that would be great. Grand Desert is 5.3/1k. That would reduce your MF/1k for Ocean Walk.

If I am doing my math correctly :
on a 200K point contract the date where Ocean Walk at 6.7 per thousand (from parents 0$ upfront cost & no transfer cost)
vs Las Vegas at 5.45 per thousand ($1000 upfront cost ) becomes "more expensive" is 4 years from now .

1) I would take it over - to make Mom & Dad happy now .
2) Therefore : you have 4 years + to decide how you like Wyndham
3) cost average down MF per thousand on any future contract acquisitions

Making Mom & Dad happy about: "how it all worked out " is key in my view .

 

[Grammarhero]

If I am doing my math correctly :
on a 200K point contract the date where Ocean Walk at 6.7 per thousand (0$ upfront cost ) vs Las Vegas at 5.45 per thousand ($1000 upfront cost ) becomes
"more expensive" is 4 years from now .

1) I would take it over - to make Mom & Dad happy now .
2) Therefore : you have 4 years + to decide how you like Wyndham
3) cost average down on any future contract acquisitions

Making Mom & Dad happy about: "how it all worked out " is key in my view .

You can get Grand Desert for free. I got 158k Grand Desert for free. Just have to hustle.

 

[Grammarhero]

If I am doing my math correctly :
on a 200K point contract the date where Ocean Walk at 6.7 per thousand (0$ upfront cost ) vs Las Vegas at 5.45 per thousand ($1000 upfront cost ) becomes
"more expensive" is 4 years from now .

1) I would take it over - to make Mom & Dad happy now .
2) Therefore : you have 4 years + to decide how you like Wyndham
3) cost average down on any future contract acquisitions

Making Mom & Dad happy about: "how it all worked out " is key in my view .

I should clarify. The OP should supplement his 205k EOYE, with a EOYO. Ocean Walk should only be $6.7/1k, but the difference is that OP is paying the PF twice for an EOYE TS, as opposed to once for an EY TS.

 

[Jason245]

If I am doing my math correctly :
on a 200K point contract the date where Ocean Walk at 6.7 per thousand (from parents 0$ upfront cost & no transfer cost)
vs Las Vegas at 5.45 per thousand ($1000 upfront cost ) becomes "more expensive" is 4 years from now .

1) I would take it over - to make Mom & Dad happy now .
2) Therefore : you have 4 years + to decide how you like Wyndham
3) cost average down MF per thousand on any future contract acquisitions

Making Mom & Dad happy about: "how it all worked out " is key in my view .

Again, my math is different but I agree in essence. Have same conversation occasionally in hgvc forum where people tell me bay club is a bad deal cause of higher mf (snagged 2 eoy (even and odd) for nothing).

I am viewing this as a supplement to vacations so may never add another Wyndham. Goal is to use all points every year and save money over cash cost because chasing the best deal possible is a constant losing battle. At the end of the day, even a $1/k pts savings is only around $200... as long as I use it and I get good accommodations for less than rental costs (savings of around 25%or more) I am getting my mf monies worth.

If I was looking here for a giveaway i would be a little more picky and hustle for it.. but this Is falling on my lap.. and since it is an eoy, I am pretty sure that 1k cash out the door for better mf would take at least 8 years to recover..

All that being said I am looking for a maximized use strategy.. am I on the right track there or missing some other tip/trick?

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[T-Dot-Traveller]

Wyndham has the advantage of less than 7 day stays .

Tug member - (post in this thread) - cbyrne1174 has mentioned shorter stay “ Florida local usage “ for their ownership . In that instance it is like owning a second home for weekend use - with none of the headaches ( clean up / washing linen / lawn maintenance etc. )

 

[drepublic]

Ocean walk.. 203k points now that I re read.. running 66.05 per month..(roughly 7.8/ 1k point). Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

What you have is very expensive.

I have some of the lower maintenance fee contracts here in the image below. Understand there are different HOA's even at the same resort for example I have one of the lower maintenance fee Ocean Blvd at Myrtle Beach listed but there are higher maintenance fee deeded contracts there.

The only reason I'd pay higher maintenance fees for a deeded contract is if I needed ARP at a resort that had high maintenance fees. I am doing this now on some resale contracts at Bonnet Creek to book large Presidential Rooms at Peak Times, but my other contracts are at Clearwater and Ocean Blvd. Even though what you have is free...you might consider looking at Ebay, Redweek, Tug Marketplace and watching what these contracts in the table below are selling for. Some are willing to pay more for lower maintnance fee contracts. We use the hell out of our points and I have no interest in the rental game at this time. Points are points 10 months out and large resorts like Bonnet Creek with a lot of inventory are very bookable 10 months out at peak times. Some Beach Resorts (especially Clearwater) are difficult to book at peak times if you don't have ARP.

Also you may consider the Club Wyndham Access (CWA) contracts if you care about ARP at many resorts and learn about what that program is. The maintenance fees are on the high side but open up hi demand peak time booking ARP for you but your mileage may very. I prefer to own where I want to go for ARP am fortunate that where I want to go is in driving distance and on the lower side of Wyndham Maintenance Fees.

If I wasn't a Presidential Room snob and insisted on Clearwater at Spring Break, and Bonnet Creek at Thanksgiving/Christmas I'd pony up (like maybe up to $2000) for a 500,000 point'ish Canterbury or Bali Hai resale contract.

I made the chart below to figure out how many points I would get per $1000 spend in maintenance fees.

If I put your $7.8/1000 deed in the chart above...you would be at the bottom of this list and only get 128,060 points per $1000 spent in maintenance fees: $1000/($66.05x24) x 203,000 points. Now compare that to the 234,742 points you could get per thousand owning a Bali Hai Contract?

Your $1582.20 yearly maintenance fees applied to a Bali Hai Contract would be 371,362 points...and additional 168,362 over your 203,000 contract which you could use(rent) 6 nights in a 2 BR presidential room at Bonnet Creek Thanksgiving Week for example. (assuming a 2 BR Presidential were available).

Bonnet Creek Point charts below.

If it were me I wouldn't accept this gift and I'd find the cheapest resale points I could if where I wanted to go was bookable 10 months out in the room sizes I prefer.

Just my 2 cents...

 

[paxsarah]

If I put your $7.8/1000 deed in the chart above

$7.80/k isn't comparing apples to apples, because the OP's monthly fee includes the minimum program fee annually. If you were to back out the program fee, the HOA fee comes out to something in the neighborhood of $6.28/k - which is no Bali Hai or Canterbury, but it's more on the level with Bonnet Creek. It's the minimum program fee that's killing his overall rate, but that's going to be true of any smaller account. He's not paying $.60/k, he's effectively paying $1.52/k in program fees.

 

[drepublic]

$7.80/k isn't comparing apples to apples, because the OP's monthly fee includes the minimum program fee annually. If you were to back out the program fee, the HOA fee comes out to something in the neighborhood of $6.28/k - which is no Bali Hai or Canterbury, but it's more on the level with Bonnet Creek. It's the minimum program fee that's killing his overall rate, but that's going to be true of any smaller account. He's not paying $.60/k, he's effectively paying $1.52/k in program fees.

I see yes I'd have to have 1.52/k instead of 0.6/k in the chart for is program fee if I put it in the chart...it's still an expensive overall rate.

 

[Jason245]

Let me simplify the math so that you understand where I am comming from so there is no confusion. and I will use bonnett Creek as the example.

A "Value" weekend night in a 1BR costs ~$152. The same 1BR at prime would be $257.

A cash rental for a resort of that quality and distance from the parks (only ownside is lack of "disney shuttle") would run me at least $300/Night with limited change in that price no matter the season (after taxes fees etc).

That equates to a savings of between ~$50 and $150 /Night which means I am in effect getting the room for between 17% and 50% "discount" on money I would have spent otherwise. All that being said, Orlando isn't my primary focus (I can rent the DRI resorts for between $100 and 120 a night usually), my focus is on the other resorts (e.g. great smokey mountains, or Washington DC), and from my simple math, I still end up ahead, especially if I book my stay for during week days.

That being said, Bonnett Creek seems like a great place for me to dump any excess unused points I have rather than lose em, especially since I live a few hours away and have annual passes.

I get that I could save even more money, but honestly, an extra $100 a year makes zero difference to me financially. and If I end up deciding to pick up the Odd years, I believe my average cost will drop because of the whole program fee thing as well as me being slightly more selective about what I pick up. Also, if/when the time comes that I want to dump it, i am pretty sure I can get rid of it for what I paid out of pocket in the bargain basement or through ovation.

My goal is not second guessing the deal (but i do appreciate everyones insight), my goal is maximizing and exploiting the program to use my points to maximum effect. I confirmed that like HGVC I do not have to book whole weeks, I also see that this is a much more fee friendly program (e.g. there are not as many hidden fees). There is a housekeeping component, but I am pretty sure If I limit myself to two trips with points a use year I won't get into trouble, and it seems I can borrow from future years (live in their pocket) which I like. Anything else I am missing?

 

[drepublic]

A cash rental for a resort of that quality and distance from the parks (only ownside is lack of "disney shuttle") would run me at least $300/Night with limited change in that price no matter the season (after taxes fees etc).

You can rent Bonnet Creek for much less than that directly from Wyndham from extra holidays after googling for an Extra Holidays Discount Code, and even cheaper if you rent from a VIP (cue Delgati ha ha!!). Just check Red Week listings and VRBO and Ebay.

Here I just went to Wyndham's website and looked at the Weekend before Christmas this year. You can rent a 2 Bedroom Deluxe for $250/night including taxes and even less if you shop around. Using your rate of 7.8 at a point cost of 89,000 it would cost you $694.20, and, and using Bonnet Creeks maintenance fees brings that cost of maintenance to 601.64 (still more expensive than renting from Wyndham directly).

This is why maintenance fees are worth considering, when the cost of maintenance is more than what you can rent from Wyndham directly, and especially from other owners who have a much lower cost of maintenance along with steep VIP point discounts. As I believe you are new to or considering Wyndham...I want to make you aware of this.

https://www.extraholidays.com/lake-buena-vista-florida/wyndham-bonnet-creek-resort

 

[Grammarhero]

You can rent Bonnet Creek for much less than that directly from Wyndham from extra holidays after googling for an Extra Holidays Discount Code, and even cheaper if you rent from a VIP (cue Delgati ha ha!!). Just check Red Week listings and VRBO and Ebay.

Here I just went to Wyndham's website and looked at the Weekend before Christmas this year. You can rent a 2 Bedroom Deluxe for $250/night including taxes and even less if you shop around. Using your rate of 7.8 at a point cost of 89,000 it would cost you $694.20, and, and using Bonnet Creeks maintenance fees brings that cost of maintenance to 601.64 (still more expensive than renting from Wyndham directly).

This is why maintenance fees are worth considering, when the cost of maintenance is more than what you can rent from Wyndham directly, and especially from other owners who have a much lower cost of maintenance along with steep VIP point discounts. As I believe you are new to or considering Wyndham...I want to make you aware of this.

https://www.extraholidays.com/lake-buena-vista-florida/wyndham-bonnet-creek-resort

View attachment 15435

@dgalati ’s “rent from a VIP within 60 days for less than the MF” is legendary.

 

[Jason245]

I understand that. Bonnet creek is not my preferred destination or use. I was just using it as an example since someone posted the points chart. My only use of that resort would be if I had unused points that needed to be used (dumping ground).

And I wouldnt stay near or go to Disney during the last 2 weeks of year if someone paid me.

Do you have any other strategies I can use to maximize the use of the program?

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[paxsarah]

Do you have any other strategies I can use to maximize the use of the program?

I've found that I pretty easily burn through my free reservation transactions since the program update in 2017. $19 isn't a big deal to pay for each when you run out, but it can add up.

Short stays can eat through your housekeeping credits, but if you average around 4-5 night stays in general, you'll probably be fine.

We stretch our points by taking 5-6 night trips instead of a full week, and eliminating 1-2 of the weekend nights.

If you have very specific places you want to go at very specific times, it's quite beneficial to book at 10 months out or as close as possible. As you've noted above, there's no points penalty to canceling up to 15 days out if your plans need to change. If you're more flexible, you can wait but it may require playing the game of repeated searching to put together something that you want. There are also some non-VIP last-minute discounts, but they're most often in oversold areas and not usually in prime season.

 

[drepublic]

I understand that. Bonnet creek is not my preferred destination or use. I was just using it as an example since someone posted the points chart.

Gotcha. I just used Bonnet Creek as an example where renting from Wyndham directly can be cheaper than paying the cost of maintenance on that resort. I ran out of points a year ago when I first started with my 326,000 Clearwater UDI contract and wanted to go to Panama city Beach. I knew I could rent from Wyndham Extra Holidays and use discount codes and was shocked to see that I could rent cheaper from Wyndham than to pay cost of Maintenance at Clearwater (which is less than $6/1000k).

The idea never occurred to me before that you are better off renting from Wyndham directly than owning financially at certain resorts. I knew VIP's with steep discounts could rent for less than maintenance costs and still make a profit given room upgrades or just their discount alone. But when I saw when Wyndham itself rented for less than owning...I really had to consider whether I was better off buying more points or just renting from Wyndham or VIP's.

I have to plan my trips around kids school schedule so I'm traveling at peak times. I also like Presidential Rooms or at least 2BR Deluxes at peak times so ARP is important to me to get what I want when I want it. I book Clearwater 13 months out for spring break and Myrtle Beach 13 months out for July 4th Ocean Front Rooms or Labor day Weekend, and soon Presidential Rooms at Bonnet Creek for Thanksgiving/Christmas, and acquired contracts for these locations after realizing I needed ARP for what I wanted. I originally had a 200,000 CWA contract before Clearwater was in CWA.

If were more flexible in my travels I'm sure I'd be better off renting than owning financially, or could better Justify being VIP. I know at some point I will be more flexible in my travels, but now isn't the time as my kids are pre-teens, but everyone is different.

Do you have any other strategies I can use to maximize the use of the program?

I recommend spending a good bit of time learning Wyndham's system and figuring out where you want to go and check availability 10 months out and at various months. Also ask the members here whether some resort you are interested in is typically bookable for when you want to go. This would give you a good idea of what is bookable with what you have, and....should you decide to acquire more points what contracts best fit your needs (low maintenance fees versus ARP or some combo of both).

Also sometimes things open up within 14 days as renters who booked rooms release them before the deadline. For example I saw 2BR Deluxe pop up the week before Thanksgiving last year and snagged it for 7 nights last minute. This may be why Extra Holidays has that 2 BR unit available the weekend before Christmas just around the corner but no 1BR available. Being flexible in your travels opens up more options.