Confused by Pueblo Bonito - Wyndham Equity Value Agreement

[ann4n6]

Last summer we traveled to Cabo and stayed at Pueblo Bonito Sunset Beach (PBSB). We used RCI points that we transferred from our Wyndham time share. We were unsuccessful in avoiding the free breakfast and all of the extras that were offered for the presentation. We ended up purchasing 4 weeks with Pueblo Bonito. They credited us the value of our Wyndham timeshare to the the total purchase price. The "office" looked this up and put the Wyndham $ amount in the contract. Combining the two time shares it's approx. $50,000 which we have paid off completely. All we got from PB was a letter that said we were paid in full, not a "title" like we have from Wyndham.
Through this we believed:

1) Any unused weeks at PBSB would be sold on our request, and effectively pay for our investment through the years.
2) If we chose to sell our membership, PB would pay us the full amount of ~$50,000 plus any increase in market value. They said they would not pay us less than $50,000 in any circumstance. This sold us.
3) The monthly fees we were paying to Wyndham would cease.
4) We could still use RCI as we had before

We transferred our Wyndham points to RCI as instructed, and waited for the fees to stop, thinking the timeshares had been combined. When the fees continued, we contacted our sales person at PBSB who told us he was surprised, and someone dropped the ball. Eventually he sent us an "Equity Value Agreement" form, (with no instructions) and said we had not asked to complete the transfer before. We were directed toward Timeshare Equity Services (TES) who contacted us a gave us very confusing options.

Option A - Transfer to PB and turn all of our Wyndham documents over - $2000+
Option B - (Highlighted and emphasized) Stay with Wyndham and the PB contract still stays intact ? - $3000+

We're confused.
Are we out a lot of money, and need to save what we can now?
Has anyone sold their PB weeks and/or the entire membership successfully?
Will we be able to sell our membership for the $50,000, or would Wyndham stop that because we are still somehow affiliated with them ?
What do we own in this situation = Both Wyndham and PB ?

We can't get a straight answer from anyone.

Any help or insights will be much appreciated.

 

[Passepartout]

What does your contract say? Whatever you 'heard' means nothing. Mexican TS salesweasels will say ANYTHING to make a sale. I've NEVER heard of ANYONE turning their Mexican timeshare back in for full purchase price. There is no DEED with Mexican timeshares, they are 'Right to Use'. You 'own' nothing. It is unlikely that they will 'sell' your unused weeks for anything close to what you pay for them. Otherwise, they would just rent weeks to the general public and not have to hassle with owners like you.

I suspect you own BOTH PB and Wyndham.

If you have in writing that PB will pay you your purchase price, you better be taking them up on that. But I suspect that was something you heard and it doesn't exist in your contract.

Good Luck. We sincerely wish you'd found TUG before your Cabo vacation. We'd have very happily saved you $50,000. For free. Sorry.

As to what to do now. . . Use them. That's the only value in TSs. They have little to no resale value. Many people actually have to pay someone to take paid off and current TSs.

Jim

 

[taterhed]

Here's a straight answer.

Pull out all your paperwork.
Review anything written down on a signed contract, summarize what is there...and come back for some advice.

PB is likely worthless....and unless you have a real, genuine, documented legal case (highly unlikely) you probably have no recourse in the matter.
A common timeshare trick (at least with some south of the border salespersons (SOB's) is to 'claim' you're trading your existing timeshare for a new one. In reality, they're getting you to sign a contract for an RTU (right to use) and not taking any real action with your supposed trade-in. In fact, they'll try and bilk you out of more money to make that 'disappear.'
PAY THEM NO MORE MONEY UNTIL YOU KNOW WHAT IS LEGALLY BINDING AND FACTUAL.

There are always options, but you may not like some of them.
Sorry, but that's the straight and unvarnished answer...without any real facts to go on.

Come back and report with facts, numbers, signed document information etc... (keep it generic to protect your privacy of course)
Then, maybe someone can help.

 

[Iggyearl]

Your current situation might be addressed in the following article from "insidethegate.com." The name of your transfer company is mentioned in the article. The "Mexican trade-in" sales pitch is used to trick American owners into buying a "new" timeshare when they normally wouldn't think of it.....

https://www.insidethegate.com/gatehouse/2015/03/mexico-timeshare-fraud-march-14-2015/

The owner of another equity trade-in company named Equity Acquisition Services posted in another Tug thread recently. He feels that his company performs a legal and useful service. Form your own opinion.

 

[taterhed]

Your current situation might be addressed in the following article from "insidethegate.com." The name of your transfer company is mentioned in the article. The "Mexican trade-in" sales pitch is used to trick American owners into buying a "new" timeshare when they normally wouldn't think of it.....

https://www.insidethegate.com/gatehouse/2015/03/mexico-timeshare-fraud-march-14-2015/

The owner of another equity trade-in company named Equity Acquisition Services posted in another Tug thread recently. He feels that his company performs a legal and useful service. Form your own opinion.

This is what I was referring to and hoping I was wrong.
If you could show real, documented evidence of collusion between PB and the scammers.....you might have a shot at voiding the purchase.....but good luck getting money back.

I hope this has a good ending....

 

[ann4n6]

This is what I was referring to and hoping I was wrong.
If you could show real, documented evidence of collusion between PB and the scammers.....you might have a shot at voiding the purchase.....but good luck getting money back.

I hope this has a good ending....

Thanks for your reply and advice. We’re disappointed in ourselves for falling prey to this, but will try to make the best possible recovery.

 

[ann4n6]

Your current situation might be addressed in the following article from "insidethegate.com." The name of your transfer company is mentioned in the article. The "Mexican trade-in" sales pitch is used to trick American owners into buying a "new" timeshare when they normally wouldn't think of it.....

https://www.insidethegate.com/gatehouse/2015/03/mexico-timeshare-fraud-march-14-2015/

The owner of another equity trade-in company named Equity Acquisition Services posted in another Tug thread recently. He feels that his company performs a legal and useful service. Form your own opinion.

Thanks, much appreciated and helpful

 

[taterhed]

First, let me say this: you are not the only one, nor is this uncommon.

These folks--and many others--have learned how to prey on the inner desires of good folks.
This isn't a scam to 'get rich quick,' this is a scam that preys on your desires to spend time with family and friends.
It's despicable, but you are not a common rube that got suckered.

In the end, regardless of the cost of this event, remember that your real desire is to spend quality time with family and/or friends and enjoy your life.
If you end up paying a higher price, don't forget the real goal and let this ruin your vacations.

I wish you luck....if you post some additional details later, it may be that someone here can assist you in finding some satisfaction.

cheers.

 

[bizaro86]

The other thing I'll mention is that you shouldn't pay them to get rid of your Wyndham. You can almost certainly get rid of it for no cost on by posting it here in the bargain deals forum.

 

[ann4n6]

Will do - and thanks for your kind encouragement. It was indeed our family we did this for.

 

[Braindead]

Will do - and thanks for your kind encouragement. It was indeed our family we did this for.

If you don’t mind sharing what you have it might have some value or you might be better off using Wyndham Ovations to stop paying MFs quicker.

 

[ann4n6]

The other thing I'll mention is that you shouldn't pay them to get rid of your Wyndham. You can almost certainly get rid of it for no cost on by posting it here in the bargain deals forum.

We are most disappointed in our decision to buy Pueblo Bonito. We hope to salvage something

 

[Braindead]

The other thing I'll mention is that you shouldn't pay them to get rid of your Wyndham. You can almost certainly get rid of it for no cost on by posting it here in the bargain deals forum.

I see the advice to just give your timeshare on TUG all the time without even knowing what the OP has.
Not all timeshares are worthless even Wyndham in this instance when we don’t even know how many points or the home resort. If the OP has a worthless Wyndham timeshare they are better off contacting Wyndham Ovations than giving it away. Wyndham transfers are taking atleast 5 months from start to finish. Ovations are being done in less time saving the owner MFs

 

[bizaro86]

I see the advice to just give your timeshare on TUG all the time without even knowing what the OP has.
Not all timeshares are worthless even Wyndham in this instance when we don’t even know how many points or the home resort. If the OP has a worthless Wyndham timeshare they are better off contacting Wyndham Ovations than giving it away. Wyndham transfers are taking atleast 5 months from start to finish. Ovations are being done in less time saving the owner MFs

Giving it away is better than paying someone thousands of dollars to be rid of it, which was one of the choices mentioned. You're certainly correct that if the OP has a low MF contract it will be worth something, and ovation is another option if it isn't.

 

[ann4n6]

I see the advice to just give your timeshare on TUG all the time without even knowing what the OP has.
Not all timeshares are worthless even Wyndham in this instance when we don’t even know how many points or the home resort. If the OP has a worthless Wyndham timeshare they are better off contacting Wyndham Ovations than giving it away. Wyndham transfers are taking atleast 5 months from start to finish. Ovations are being done in less time saving the owner MFs

I’m learning each reply, but new to this all. What is OP ?

 

[Braindead]

Giving it away is better than paying someone thousands of dollars to be rid of it, which was one of the choices mentioned. You're certainly correct that if the OP has a low MF contract it will be worth something, and ovation is another option if it isn't.

I wouldn’t ever recommend someone paying thousands either. It just seems to me that the advice here is to always just give it away.
There are Wyndham contracts worth thousands some even over $10,000.00.

 

[Braindead]

I’m learning each reply, but new to this all. What is OP ?

OP-Original Poster. You in this case

 

[taterhed]

First, re-read the OP's post: They believed they were 'trading-in' a Wyndham on a PBSB that would 'pay for itself'

I'd say it's unclear whether they wanted to sell/deed-back Wyndham or not.

Depending on the circumstances, I think PBSB may have some knowledge/culpability in this.
Thus, my recommendation that the OP collect the paperwork and facts and review the next step.....prior to spending another dime with PB or anyone.

IMO

I'm not a lawyer or professional in the industry...just my 2c

 

[Braindead]

First, re-read the OP's post: They believed they were 'trading-in' a Wyndham on a PBSB that would 'pay for itself'

I'd say it's unclear whether they wanted to sell/deed-back Wyndham or not.

Depending on the circumstances, I think PBSB may have some knowledge/culpability in this.
Thus, my recommendation that the OP collect the paperwork and facts and review the next step.....prior to spending another dime with PB or anyone.

IMO

I'm not a lawyer or professional in the industry...just my 2c

I’m saying as a general rule on TUG not just this thread. I see the advice to just give your timeshare away all the time without even knowing what the owner has.
I’m sure owners receive PMs all the time from lurkers here when they see the owner has been given advice their timeshare has no value when it actually does. I hate to see owners taken advantage here when they are here looking for help

 

[taterhed]

-----^ Tru 'dat

 

[geist1223]

If you have read through all the paperwork either on Hard Copy or on a Disc you will likely find that they do not promise to actually sell your Wyndham and in all likelihood you will continue to owe on it. Also there will be no actual promise that you can turn in your unused Pueblo Benito weeks to Pueblo Bonito Weeks that Pueblo Benito will rent out and credit your Maintenance Fees. They are too cheap to rent Online.

 

[easyrider]

While I haven't looked for resale Pueblo Bonito Sunset Beach I know I have seen very nice one and two bedroom units given away or sold for very little. I saw a Monte Cristo Estates in the bargain bin here at Tug a while back.

One problem with Pueblo Bonito properties is that as an owner, the PB week you own, can only be traded through RCI to reserve at a different Pueblo Bonito property. Other some what recent problems were caused the divorce of the owners and how that effects the management of the resorts.

With the Wyndham account a person can reserve at many locations, including PBSB. RCI usually has many extra vacations listed for PBSB.

If it was me, I would keep the Wyndham and tell Pueblo Bonito I want my money back because they facilitated this problem. OR, I would keep them both. I actually do like PBSB and four weeks at a time sounds very nice too me.

Bill

 

[whitewater]

The other thing I'll mention is that you shouldn't pay them to get rid of your Wyndham. You can almost certainly get rid of it for no cost on by posting it here in the bargain deals forum.

or wyndham will take back for "free" assuming it is paid off.

that said try giving away to support Tugg community and lots of people like wyndham (me included) and find value in it. I also own PBSB. Sorry about your experience.

 

[Karen G]

One problem with Pueblo Bonito properties is that as an owner, the PB week you own, can only be traded through RCI to reserve at a different Pueblo Bonito property.

Through the PB Owner Services dept. one can actually trade internally and I think the fee for doing so is $100. We were able to exchange our fixed two bedroom unit at the Rose for two one-bedroom units at the Rose one year. There were restrictions on the properties we could exchange into though. Since we owned a two-bedroom presidential fixed week, we weren't able to exchange for any other two bedroom presidential unit as they were all sold as fixed weeks, but they did offer the option of trading for two one-bedrooms or studios.

I think the deal was that PB Rose owners could exchange into the Rose, Blanco, and Mazatlan PB, but we couldn't exchange into Sunset Beach. Sunset Beach owners could exchange into any of the PB properties. I'm not sure what the restriction was for Mazatlan owners. This internal exchange feature wasn't highly publicized and I learned of it only through the PB Owners Facebook page. I think it is still an option from what I've read on the FB page.

 

[neil p]

Ok, first, you need to clearly state what transpired, because of the mechanics of how you explained what happened does not seem to add up. State what actions you have taken thus far. If you sent a rescind notice and if so, list the dates.

The other thing is to clearly state what your desired outcome is. Do you want to remain a Wyndham Timeshare Owner? Do you want to be a Pueblo Bonito Owner? Can you afford to be both? Try going back to whatever you were thinking when you made this deal, that should guide you to what your objective is or was. Once you have that clear, this forum, myself or others can guide you as to what steps to take to accomplish what you want. Also, list who you have engaged to provide any services thus far and if you paid anything. No need to list amounts, just whether you tendered payment as of yet. All the other information regarding PB programs, trading, exchanging is not relevant at this time unless you wish to keep the membership you purchased.