Diamond Resorts Purchasing ILX (2010)

[pgnewarkboy]

Or not. We are 3 years in to Diamond Management and all we have to show is a new elevator, which quite honestly doesn't work any better than the old one, oh, and new stainless steel toasters. Our resort, Royal Palm, was one of the Sunterra resorts hijacked by Diamond. The resort is recently renovated, but that was complete prior to Diamond's takeover.

What we have seen is MFs increase from around $800/year to almost $1400/year for a 2-Bdrm unit. Yes, we are approaching the point where one can rent for what the MFs are, and IMHO, that is not a good situation.

Sunterra (and later Diamond) tried for the first few years to push folks into "The Club", but they had a very tough time selling it b/c most folks (except the Dec-Feb weeks) don't receive enough points to go anywhere else (I think we were offered 7,000/year for our unit, plus having to pay $3000 for the privilege). Most owners, which have been fixed week for years have decided to keep their weeks instead of joining "The Club".

This year (this past Nov) we noticed that they aren't even doing sales pitches at the resort anymore. There was an undercurrent of speculation that Royal Palm and Flamingo may be sold off to someone else, or maybe, they just didn't feel like the sales volume supported the need for a sales staff, but at any rate, it did feel odd not to have the sales pitch at least somewhere around.

Now, I don't really mean to knock Diamond in the whole, as I think that for some resorts (that are assigned higher point values), "The Club" can work really well. However, I think that you will find that with a number of resorts without a lot of active sales, Diamond will deflate the point values to try to get you to purchase more points. I think this may have backfired a bit in St Maarten as a number of people that we talk to all think that it is much cheaper and works out as good if not better just to trade the week and take your chances in RCI...

I can't disagree with your assessment of your resort situation. You own there and I don't. It is clear, however, that you are very angry and that this anger is reflected in some of your other assessments. Diamond did not "hijack" Sunterra as you charge. Sunterra was reckless and had to go into bankruptcy court. Diamond lawfully bought out Sunterra with the approval of the bankruptcy court trustee and other creditors. Furthermore you speculate that Diamond deflates point values for nefarious reasons. This charge is unsubstantiated. I see no evidence of point value deflation - period. I have been with Diamond since they lawfully bought Sunterra. It is, on the other hand well established, that Marriott has actually decreased the value of points held by its timeshare owners. I don't know what their reasons were.

 

[dononlake]

This whole thing makes me sick.....

According to written info I've received from Premiere Vacation Club, I will no longer be able to deposit my former week into II for future exchanges. Instead, I will receive 3500 points for my studio at Los Abrigados, every other year (i.e. 1750 points/yr). My 2010 assessment has gone from $307.50 to $484.41 in 2011, including the $134.00 Club fee - this represents a 57.5% increase. The written material also indicates that the Club fee will double the following year, because we are receiving a 50% discount in 2011. I called customer service and they told me I could opt out of the Club fee until 12/1/11, but if I did & decided to rejoin later, I would have to pay a $2,995.00 membership fee. I asked what I was getting for joining the Club & she mentioned I could trade into 27 additional resorts (most of which are international). I mentioned that Diamond Resorts had 177 resorts according to their website, & asked if I would be able to trade into those as a Club member, and she said not at this time. I'm not sure what to do, as trading my studio week into II gave me the opportunity to trade into II's 1500+ resort inventory - this whole thing makes me sick.....

 

[pgnewarkboy]

According to written info I've received from Premiere Vacation Club, I will no longer be able to deposit my former week into II for future exchanges. Instead, I will receive 3500 points for my studio at Los Abrigados, every other year (i.e. 1750 points/yr). My 2010 assessment has gone from $307.50 to $484.41 in 2011, including the $134.00 Club fee - this represents a 57.5% increase. The written material also indicates that the Club fee will double the following year, because we are receiving a 50% discount in 2011. I called customer service and they told me I could opt out of the Club fee until 12/1/11, but if I did & decided to rejoin later, I would have to pay a $2,995.00 membership fee. I asked what I was getting for joining the Club & she mentioned I could trade into 27 additional resorts (most of which are international). I mentioned that Diamond Resorts had 177 resorts according to their website, & asked if I would be able to trade into those as a Club member, and she said not at this time. I'm not sure what to do, as trading my studio week into II gave me the opportunity to trade into II's 1500+ resort inventory - this whole thing makes me sick.....

I don't know the specifics of your situation. I am a Diamond Club member and can trade into any of the Club Resorts - all of them.

 

[nightnurse613]

Well, you gotta love DRI for telling you that your fee will DOUBLE next year. $400 is still a good price for a studio for a week in Sedona! 3500 pts won't get you much in DRI inventory anyway (every other year). Like they say, you still have what you own.

 

[dougp26364]

I'm not sure this will help any ILX owners feel better but, DRI has made improvements IMHO on what the old Sunterra units use to be like. Of course, Sunterra owners were hit with pretty steep increases in MF's but, those increases were spread out over two years.

We were just at The Suite's at Fall Creek, which use to be the Plantation at Fall Creek when Sunterra owned it. Under Sunterra's management, it wasn't a resort we really considered due to past experience with Sunterra. Now it's one of our first choices when going to Branson.

This is our photo album from our most recent stay. Just click on the picture. Keep in mind this is a standard (not deluxe) unit in one of the oldest buildings (building 7) on site.



Like I said, I don't know that this is any consulation to ILX owners who may be happy with their resort that way it is but, it's apparent that your current HOA/BOD and management company ran your resort into bankruptcy. DRI is going to take a more fiscally responsible approach to managing the resort. ILX apparently had resorts in locations that are good and resorts that aren't beyond brining back to top standards (an uniformed opinion/assumption since I've never stayed at an ILX managed resort).

FWIW it's been a three year project with the Sunterra properties after DRI bought them out. There were many of the same complaints then as what's in this thread. Those former Sunterra owners who have remained appear to be posting happier threads now that they're seeing quality improvements for their money.

 

[dononlake]

Opted Out Of The Club

Well, you gotta love DRI for telling you that your fee will DOUBLE next year. $400 is still a good price for a studio for a week in Sedona! 3500 pts won't get you much in DRI inventory anyway (every other year). Like they say, you still have what you own.

I decided to opt-out of The Club (Collection), and notified Premier Vacation Club in writing, and deducted the $134 fee from my 2011 dues. I just couldn't see opting in with their promise to double The Club fee in 2012, and the only benefit that was explained to me was access to 27 additional resorts (12 US, 15 Int'l)...I already have access to all those resorts via Interval Int'l with my Marriott timeshare. They stated in writing they were waiving a $2995 membership fee - who would pay that to add only 27 more resorts to choose from??

 

[csalter2]

You have choices.

I decided to opt-out of The Club (Collection), and notified Premier Vacation Club in writing, and deducted the $134 fee from my 2011 dues. I just couldn't see opting in with their promise to double The Club fee in 2012, and the only benefit that was explained to me was access to 27 additional resorts (12 US, 15 Int'l)...I already have access to all those resorts via Interval Int'l with my Marriott timeshare. They stated in writing they were waiving a $2995 membership fee - who would pay that to add only 27 more resorts to choose from??

Just and fyi. DRI has over 100 resorts in their system all over the world. The difference would be that you would not have to pay to use them like you would with II. You would have to spend the $149 with II and if you stayed in the DRI resorts you would not have to spend anything. A lot depends on how you travel if you feel the need to join the Club or not. I own Marriott too. Their new points system has similarities to DRI's. I have until tomorrow to decide if I am going to join their point system. I may wish to have a week or more with Marriott, but they are even more expensive than DRI's. Consider how you travel. I have changed my travel and the points system with Marriott becomes advantageous because I don't have kids all the time and I don't always need a 2 bedroom. I may only use a one bedroom now. I could lockoff my unit with Marriott, but I have to pay for that. Sometimes I like staying longer than a week.

Figure out what's best for you and then decide.

 

[dononlake]

Premiere Vacations Club Members Do Not Have Access to Diamond Resorts

Just and fyi. DRI has over 100 resorts in their system all over the world. The difference would be that you would not have to pay to use them like you would with II. You would have to spend the $149 with II and if you stayed in the DRI resorts you would not have to spend anything. A lot depends on how you travel if you feel the need to join the Club or not. I own Marriott too. Their new points system has similarities to DRI's. I have until tomorrow to decide if I am going to join their point system. I may wish to have a week or more with Marriott, but they are even more expensive than DRI's. Consider how you travel. I have changed my travel and the points system with Marriott becomes advantageous because I don't have kids all the time and I don't always need a 2 bedroom. I may only use a one bedroom now. I could lockoff my unit with Marriott, but I have to pay for that. Sometimes I like staying longer than a week.

Figure out what's best for you and then decide.

Carlito - I understand where you're coming from, and in fact I have already joined the Marriott Destinations program which gives me the choice of points with Marriott, or weeks at II, every year.

Diamond Resorts now manages Premiere Vacation Club/ILX resorts following the latter's bankruptcy. The bankruptcy was probably brought about largely because PVC/ILX was undercharging for maintenance fees, and not maintaining the resorts the way they should have been - cost increases in maintenance fees, are therefore inevitable. The original PVC/ILX resorts will remain, but PVC members are now being given the option to join a PVC Collection Club, which only adds 27 additional resorts to choose from - this Club is different, and far inferior to the Diamond Resorts Club.

 

[gravityrules]

... Diamond Resorts now manages Premiere Vacation Club/ILX resorts following the latter's bankruptcy. The bankruptcy was probably brought about largely because PVC/ILX was undercharging for maintenance fees, and not maintaining the resorts the way they should have been - cost increases in maintenance fees, are therefore inevitable. ...

I've seen this idea expressed elsewhere but I think it is incorrect. ILX appears to have been brought down by speculative real estate purchases and development and the 2008/9 trainwreck in the financial markets. I don't think it had anything to do with the operations side. You are seeing this idea of underfunding advanced to justify DRI's decision to make current ILX owners pay for their takeover of ILX through exhorbitant MF increases. And if current ILX deeded owners can be persuaded to give up their deeds and join the 'club', DRI's control of ILX properties becomes even greater. It's quite a coup for DRI, allowing them to expand their system, collect whatever management fees they'd like to charge and have present ILX owners fund it all. There is plenty of reading in the Festiva threads about this business model.

 

[smelly1]

DRI points

My wife and I have owned a week in a DRI property - Tahoe Vacation Resorts, and love it.

Does anyone know if we can buy Club Points? How can we convert our week to points and then buy more points on the resale market?

Thanks
Daneil

 

[dougp26364]

My wife and I have owned a week in a DRI property - Tahoe Vacation Resorts, and love it.

Does anyone know if we can buy Club Points? How can we convert our week to points and then buy more points on the resale market?

Thanks
Daneil

The rules for converting weeks to either a trust based ownership or getting them into THE Club seems to remain a moving target. At one point, you could simply pay a fee of $2,995 and put your weeks into THE Club. Lately, it seems as if you need to make a developer purchase and then they'll allow all your weeks to go into THE Club. DRI has offered to convert deeded ownership into trust based ownership. Generally speaking an additional developer purchase is required/encouraged.

DRI never seems to be to happy about converting resale deeded weeks into either trust based ownership or allowing them to join THE Club without at least a minimum developer purchase of trust based points.

You can buy trust points resale but, you appear to be limited to staying only at the 13 or so resorts in that particular trust. I've read a few post of people who have purchased trust based points and have not been able to exchange those points with I.I. It should be possible to buy trust based points, make a reservation at one of the resorts in the trust, then exchange that week through one of the independant exchange companies such as SFX (anti-trust laws have been used by independant exchange companies to secure the exchange week).

Of course, DRI would LOVE for you to come into a presentation and buy direct. That seems to be the simplest route to converting weeks either into a trust based ownership or putting deeded weeks into THE Club.

In our case, we had two weeks purchased direct from DRI back in the late 90's that we were allowed to bring into THE Club by paying the joiner fee of $2,995. While I realize that sounds like a lot of money, based on our usage I've saved that money plus some because of THE Club benefits such as no fee internal exchanges. I've still received the same usage from those weeks as I would have outside of THE Club but, what was once wasted space (using smaller units or using only the nights I needed rather than reserving a fulls week for a long weekend stay) is now utilized more efficiently.

 

[smelly1]

DRI

Doug, thanks for your information. DRI wanted to sell us 4,500 points for $16,000. I countered with $3,500 and my 2 bd lock off for 15,000 points - enough to buy a Christmas or 4th of July week in a 2 bdrm. At any rate, their offer was laughable. How could anyone go for that?

I will continue to pursue making the conversion at a reasonable cost. As it stands, we vacation in Tahoe twice a year - Christmas and 4th of july. This fits in nicely.

Daniel

 

[dougp26364]

Doug, thanks for your information. DRI wanted to sell us 4,500 points for $16,000. I countered with $3,500 and my 2 bd lock off for 15,000 points - enough to buy a Christmas or 4th of July week in a 2 bdrm. At any rate, their offer was laughable. How could anyone go for that?

I will continue to pursue making the conversion at a reasonable cost. As it stands, we vacation in Tahoe twice a year - Christmas and 4th of july. This fits in nicely.

Daniel

I'd suggest looking for Califonia Trust points on E-bay. I haven't looked recently but, a penny/point might be on the high side right now. If all you're wanting is to vacation in Lake Tahoe during certain times of the year, then resale of trust points would probably make sense.

Keep in mind I might have that particular trust's name incorrect. I don't deal with trust points some I'm not certain what resorts are in what trust. I know there is a US Trust and a Hawaiian Trust. I'm pretty certain there is a California Trust that incudes the Tahoe resort. It should be easy enough to find out with a little research or even a call the DRI.


EDIT: Looks like the Lake Tahoe Resort is in the US Collection. I found two contracts with bidding starting at 1 cent when I looked on E-bay. One was for 5,500 points and the other for 12,000 points.

 

[skimeup]

Just back from Los Abrigados

I own a one bedroom Sedona Vacation Club and a two bedroom PVC, which allows me to use any of the ILX resorts and access to the passport club (which used to have super bargains of underutilized weeks). I can no longer log in to the Owner's Club to check passport weeks, so I don't know if that benefit has gone away but there are other places now to find those bargain weeks. I did get those same increases in maintenance fees, but since I am only interested in Los Ab - or maybe San Carlos, I immediately opted out of "The Club". (I did look at the 27 properties online that "The Club" included and did not see anything of interest.) That made my MF increase by 25%. The letter did indicate that this includes costs for health benefits for staff that did not used to be paid - if that is true, I cannot argue with providing those benefits. And the resort, from my recent visit, is looking tired and the rooms in need of a facelift. The grounds still look terrific.

Per the letter I received and the discussion I had with the reservationist, I believe that I can still use my week the way I used to - that is to say, I can still make a reservaiton to use the week any time and it is covered by the MF. I can now opt to use it as points which would allow me to split that week into several of the ILX resorts - and if I have it correct, that is about the only way I can split the week using their point system. It appears, again from my discussion, that I can use the week as points or a full week at my option each year - I do not have to choose points or week on a permanent basis. However, this may be a moving target - clearly Los Abrigados is the premium property in this acquisition and they will want to free up inventory there, so they are interested in making it easy for me to use my time elsewhere. They could also like to get me to join the "Club" but apparently that membership will cost $288 per year - yikes!

I agree that it was likely real estate speculation and not management of resorts that did in ILX. However, I would certainly like to see the units improved - right now they are at a lower end Best Western/La Quinta level and they really should be at the higher end.

I have not been particularly happy with trading with II so I have used SFX resorts and am starting with DAE. I see that they include other DRI resorts, so I assume that once they get Los Ab up to snuff it will be included as well. In general, if you book a week you can put it into exchange - as long as you have documentation that the week belongs to you. Is there something about DRI that prohibits using a a booked week to exchange? I have booked both of my weeks for 4th of July (hoping for a big family thing) but if my family cannot go, I certainly see no reason to believe that I cannot deposit my unused week somewhere. What is very confusing is how one can go about modifying a res - splitting time, or cancelling. As all timesharers know, one must book way ahead to get the best times and then life happens.

So we are left with lots of feelings of anxiety about what will happen to our lovely Los Ab. Here is a kudo for DRI. Speaking of life happens, I had a week booked at the end of September and my daughter had to have emergency surgery. They did allow me to use that time in late January - which could have gone into February - that was very nice.

I have to make note, too, of the fact that my MFs have been going up at all my timeshares. It seems that lots of owners are walking away (or perhaps dying, and their kids don't want the bother???) - and many are getting folded into clubs of one sort or another. There seem to be all sorts of rules at each club. Witness: Shell Vacations Club bought into Inn at the Opera and tried to convince me to pay them to buy into SVC for which they would not give me enough points to go to Iat O. Go figure that one! VRI seems to be managing Nob Hill Inn, which made the MF skyrocket and weeks become far less available. Royal Holiday now owns some time at Powell Place - also has affected availability. I think it is inevitable that most of the stand alone places are going to be absorbed into clubs sooner or later. Now is the time to start researching which clubs have properties where and what to do about the places we own!

 

[marg2]

I am relieved to see this thread here, having forgotten to consult this forum when I got the letter from Diamond in December notifying me of the new lay of the land. My deeded week is with Los Abrigados, 1 bedroom, silver, every other year. I was originally a member of the Sedona Vacation Club but reluctantly purchased into Premiere Vacation Club a few years ago under the hard-sales pitch. Now that Diamond has taken over, having access to 27 more resorts that they are offering through their Premiere Club Connection does not interest me because my heart and interest is only with Los Abrigados (and Sedona). I opted out of the Premiere Club Connection (and it’s club fees) before paying my 2011 MF.

I'm told that I will be given 6000 points for my week (3000 per year), and that although this is not enough points to exchange into some of the other 6 resorts formerly part of Premiere Vacation Club, I would be grandfathered in and, subject to availability, should be able to book at these other resorts, if I want to. But what I’m more concerned about is being able to book at Los Abrigados at any time of the year. I see that more points are required (7000 to 9000) for travel in high and peak season. Does anyone know if I’ll be able to use my 6000 points to go to Los Abrigados anytime of the year? According to their charts, my 6000 points allows booking just for mid season. I can’t help but feel cheated in all of this.

When I bought into PVC I was allowed to use my other timeshare, without paying exchange fees, to book at Los Abrigrados. I hope I will still be able to do this.

I’m going to Sedona in April and will try to find out more information about Premiere Vacation Collection benefits.

 

[ppmc]

ppmc

I too am going to Los Abrigados in april.I have had conversations with the sales people at SmartCoice timeshare resale in scottsdale who used to list alot of our properties in Sedonna and wont list them right now because of the confusion.In their words it is unclear as to the benefits to a new owner.I find this very disturbing that this has left our properties unmarketable.I keep looking for others who have come to this same conclusion but it is either still to new that they dont understand or they are okay with it.I have read how suprised at the mt increase but the real suprise is that you cant sell them in its currrent lauguage.Any one have a response?

 

[marg2]

Perhaps one good thing that has come out of all of this is that I'm no longer being hounded by timeshare resale companies, one of which managed to convince me to sign up, last May, to rent out my passport weeks. I ended the agreement, but only after they took $500 from me. They caught me at a week moment. What a racket that is

 

[pedro47]

Why is the cost of purchasing Club points so high now as compared to a couple of years ago. $16,000 dollars for 4500 points is to much to pay in my opinion.

 

[alaskacie]

Just went on a Diamond Tour yesterday; they offered 6000 points, but referenced that 6500 may be possible; with the purchase of 1500 points for $6400 (which would likely have come to 4800/5000 after a drop).

M/F is paid for 2011, so this is eligible for conversion. I'm not using the Los Ab anymore and am willing to give it away to anyone who wants it; either for the deeded week (m/f 735) or to use to upgrade their diamond portfolio. You'd pay $5k for a total of 7500 (possibly 8000) points.

 

[csalter2]

Be aware...

Just went on a Diamond Tour yesterday; they offered 6000 points, but referenced that 6500 may be possible; with the purchase of 1500 points for $6400 (which would likely have come to 4800/5000 after a drop).

M/F is paid for 2011, so this is eligible for conversion. I'm not using the Los Ab anymore and am willing to give it away to anyone who wants it; either for the deeded week (m/f 735) or to use to upgrade their diamond portfolio. You'd pay $5k for a total of 7500 (possibly 8000) points.

I would suggest that you look at DRI's points system to make sure that you can get what you want when you travel. I use and like DRI's system, but even 8000 points may not be enough for you to trade into say a 2 bdrm during the summer in some places. Look at the DRI website and find out how many points are needed for the size unit you will need when you travel and to where you may wish to travel at what time of year.

 

[kmiller1]

Hello everyone need a little assistance in understanding the way Diamond Resorts works with fixed weeks. We are looking to change our fixed weeks to points and one place we looked at was not what we needed but we did go through a meeting with Diamond Resorts last June in Arizona and we told them we already had two fixed weeks. One was week 45 and one was week 9. I only remember a little bit of the spiel but i was hoping you could give me a little insight. We think we liked what we heard but at the time we just couldn't afford to change over our points. Now we can and I wanted to see if they changed anything since June of last year when I was at a Diamond Resort in Arizona.

Information will be helpful.

 

[dougp26364]

Hello everyone need a little assistance in understanding the way Diamond Resorts works with fixed weeks. We are looking to change our fixed weeks to points and one place we looked at was not what we needed but we did go through a meeting with Diamond Resorts last June in Arizona and we told them we already had two fixed weeks. One was week 45 and one was week 9. I only remember a little bit of the spiel but i was hoping you could give me a little insight. We think we liked what we heard but at the time we just couldn't afford to change over our points. Now we can and I wanted to see if they changed anything since June of last year when I was at a Diamond Resort in Arizona.

Information will be helpful.

We own a fixed week with DRI at Polo Towers. When we joined, we had to pay a joiner fee. At the time it was $2,995. Every year we have the option of keeping our fixed week or releasing it to DRI. When we release that week, the points are deposited into our THE Club account for us to use. We can then make reservations using our club points online or by calling DRI.

We also have a floating week that was put into THE Club. We do not have to make the election every year to change that week into points. It's done automatically. If we want to reserve a unit at our home resort, we have a 2 month home resort advantage where we can use those points to reserve a week. We're given the same number of points it would take to resrve the full unit but, if we wanted to only reserve a one bedroom unit for one week and a studio unit for another week, there's not enough points. I had been told by someone in the past that, if we wanted to exercise a more traditional lock-off situation for this resort, we'd need to call owner services and make that arrangement. I don't know if that works or not since we have had no desire to complete such a transaction.

 

[pedro47]

When will the ILX Resort be available for Diamond Club members to exchange into?

 

[csalter2]

Now!

When will the ILX Resort be available for Diamond Club members to exchange into?

The ILX resorts are available now. I saw them when I was on the reservaton page of the site and when you try to book a reservation under AZ you will see the ILX properties coeme up.

 

[kmiller1]

We own a fixed week with DRI at Polo Towers. When we joined, we had to pay a joiner fee. At the time it was $2,995. Every year we have the option of keeping our fixed week or releasing it to DRI. When we release that week, the points are deposited into our THE Club account for us to use. We can then make reservations using our club points online or by calling DRI.

We also have a floating week that was put into THE Club. We do not have to make the election every year to change that week into points. It's done automatically. If we want to reserve a unit at our home resort, we have a 2 month home resort advantage where we can use those points to reserve a week. We're given the same number of points it would take to resrve the full unit but, if we wanted to only reserve a one bedroom unit for one week and a studio unit for another week, there's not enough points. I had been told by someone in the past that, if we wanted to exercise a more traditional lock-off situation for this resort, we'd need to call owner services and make that arrangement. I don't know if that works or not since we have had no desire to complete such a transaction.

Thanks for the input.

So far we have two fixed weeks. We are trying to decide if it is worth keeping them as fixed or changing them to points. Now in your mind it is better to keep the fixed weeks or is it more beneficial to switch over to points. That fee, is that every year or is that a one-time deal? Also, do you still pay maintenance fees on your fixed weeks or not through DRI? Sorry, for the many questions but I would like us to get better then the average places to stay at these days. I only stayed in two really bad places through II, one was in Atlantc City, NJ and the other was in San Diego, CA. I somehow feel that we would get a better choices of resorts if we were involved in a "The Club" idea. Also, once you pay that 2995 are you considered a VIP or not?

Thanks
kmiller1