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Has anyone else gotten this from Airbnb?

Discussion in 'Wyndham Vacation Resorts' started by SNA27, Dec 1, 2019.

  1. SNA27

    SNA27 TUG Member

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    It's the $6 figure I don't understand. 50% discount, upgrade etc. are clear enough.

    In my example:
    As a VIP lister on Airbnb, I made ~600/28000 or ~$21/1000. If I could have gotten the 1-Bedroom Deluxe I had listed, I would have made ~600/20250 or ~$30/1000.

    From Airbnb renter's perspective, if he had gotten what he was looking for, he would have paid ~$775 ($600 + Airbnb service fee + taxes ) for a unit costing 40500 without 50% discount. Or ~$19/1000.

    Since I booked him a 1-bedroom deluxe with balcony for 28000 points, and upgraded him to a 2-bedroom with Balcony costing 63500 points without the 50% discount, you could say he got $775/63500 or $12/1000.

    So, even with the most generous math, $6/1000 is too low and arbitrary.

    I think it varies from place to place and market demand is a better guide. I set the price by looking at other listings on Airbnb and google maps hotel search!
     
  2. tschwa2

    tschwa2 Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    A few in SC, VA and FL, a single resort in NC, MD, PA, NY, UT, ME, WI, and TN plus Jamaica and the Bahamas
    If I look up wyndham.com and put in the same dates:
    Total for Stay
    1 Adult, 0 Children × 2 Nights For $692.47 USD

    Check In Time4:00 pm
    Check Out Time10:00 am
    Total Rooms1
    • Date
    • SAT, 12/14/19
    • SUN, 12/15/19
    • Price Per Night
    • 440.52 USD
    • 146.32 USD
    Estimated Taxes and Fees$105.63 USD *
    Total Tax 18%$26.34 USD
    Total Before Tax$586.84 USD
    Total$692.47 USD

    Someone could book a non refundable rate for a 1 BR deluxe and get points and credit card bonuses if they use those for $165 less than booking your unit through AirBnB. You did get an upgrade but even if I compare those nights in a 2 BR deluxe it is still cheaper to book the non refundable rate through wyndham.com


    Total for Stay
    1 Adult, 0 Children × 2 Nights For $765.56 USD

    Check In Time4:00 pm
    Check Out Time10:00 am
    Total Rooms1
    • Date
    • SAT, 12/14/19
    • SUN, 12/15/19
    • Price Per Night
    • 479.23 USD
    • 169.55 USD
    Estimated Taxes and Fees$116.78 USD *
    Total Tax 18%$30.52 USD
    Total Before Tax$648.78 USD
    Total$765.56 USD
     
  3. SNA27

    SNA27 TUG Member

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    I only brought up the non-owners since you mentioned property taxes. In your second post, you do seem to concede that property taxes are irrelevant. It's the arbitrary JUST BECAUSE TS exchanges are not taxed!

    I guess one should not expect logic in taxation.
    I have no problem getting my head around the fact that taxman likes to tax and is looking every which way he can!:)

    My city removed all those red light cameras after losing BIGLY on them! I guess they had to tell the brother-in-law to take his damn cameras and get out because they were not collecting enough 'REVENUE' to even offset the costs! I hate those cameras and I am glad they are out!:)
     
  4. SNA27

    SNA27 TUG Member

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    Very interesting. Those dates are not available for Club Wyndham owners now. But, apparently, they have units available for cash! I wonder where that inventory comes from.
    I think I will consult ExtraHolidays also to set prices. Isn't wyndham.com the hotel site?

    I checked the site and those dates are not available.
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2019
  5. tschwa2

    tschwa2 Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    Yes a hotel site. They get inventory because members book nights and give to extra holidays to rent at a 40% commission. They get inventory every time a member converts vacation points to hotel points, or to use on a cruise or airfare or for mf. Yes those are terrible use of points but people do them all the time and in exchange for the $2-3 wyndham pays for those points, wyndham gets those points and can book whatever they want and rent it out or use it for promotional stays or whatever else they may want to do with it.
     
  6. SNA27

    SNA27 TUG Member

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    12/14-16 is not available at Wyndham hotel site. ExtraHolidays has only 2-bedroom deluxe (no balcony) available for $988.84.

    upload_2019-12-2_13-20-7.png
     
  7. dgalati

    dgalati TUG Member

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    Im sure if you keep checking daily 2-4 times a day it will show up. Trust me I have seen the inventory come and go in the last 15 days. Be petistant and you will be rewarded.
     
  8. dgalati

    dgalati TUG Member

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    $6/1000 is what is used as a average rental example. The $6 is maintenance cost per thousand points. Example Grand Desert deed 77,000 points below.
    Total HOA
    • Maintenance Fees:
      (77,000 / 1000) * $3.70 = $284.90
    • Reserve Fund:
      (77,000 / 1000) * $0.90 = $69.30
    • Property Tax:
      (77,000 / 1000) * $0.13 = $10.01
    • Total HOA Fee:
      (77,000 / 1000) * $4.73 = $364.21
    • Program Fee
      $.58/1000
    • Total * $5.31/1000
    • The owner renting 200,000 points at $6/1000 on this example will make about $140. Now if they received a 50% discount and don't pass along the savings it is about a $300 profit. Now also consider the room is upgraded from a 1 bedroom to a 2 bedroom and you can see they can make money on renting for less then the cost of a non VIP owner. Some VIP owners will pass along the free upgrade and the 50% discount and still make some money at $6/1000.
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2019
  9. dgalati

    dgalati TUG Member

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    Many VIP owners have very low maintenance fee deeds. See a partial list drepublic put together.
    [​IMG]
     
    Grammarhero likes this.
  10. SNA27

    SNA27 TUG Member

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    Ok! I see that $6 is an approximation of MF/1000. But I doubt any VIP owner will rent at cost.
    MF/1000 is irrelevant to me. I would rather go by the market demand.

    I now understand the antipathy expressed by some members to your repeated claim that renting from VIP users in the 60 day period is superior to owning!:)

    Best way to recoup MF for me has been when my son gets to stay at Canterbury or Midtown45 on his company business and I get reimbursed the going rate.
    Second best would be to rent to family and friends but so far I have only gifted them! Those gifts are greatly appreciated. So, that's a non-monetary but very tangible gain!:thumbup:
     
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  11. SNA27

    SNA27 TUG Member

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    But I do see the merit, belatedly:(, in not owning at all and simply paying for the vacation at ANY resort from Airbnb, TUG or eBay and avoid all the MF and other headaches associated with ownership!

    I plan to create a spreadsheet of Wyndham vacations I have taken and attach a dollar value to each based on market prices. I have a feeling it will be revealing and remorse-inducing!:(

    Well, I will just have to make lemonade out of this lemon and come up with a plan to recoup the MF and get some ROI too!:ponder:
     
  12. chapjim

    chapjim TUG Member

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    And I'll add that except for some event/high-demand weeks, it is usually difficult to rent weeks if I don't pass along at least some of the 50% discount.
     
    dgalati and T-Dot-Traveller like this.
  13. T-Dot-Traveller

    T-Dot-Traveller TUG Member

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    ALSO -make one for the great vacations and happy family members
    and how the vacations you have gifted are appreciated .

    money is just a piece of paper / memories can be forever & generational .

    *********
    My grandparents bought a cottage in 1939 / still being family used today . I have 40+ first cousins
    and I would say all of them have memories of family times with their siblings and extended family ..
    Hard to put on a spread sheet but just as important .

    AND - you found a new hobby and TUG friends to help you learn & enjoy it .
     
    TheHolleys87 and SNA27 like this.
  14. SNA27

    SNA27 TUG Member

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    I haven't found a way to download the reservations. I wish they would provide that. So backward! They don't make it easy, do they!:(
    But after cut&paste and massage, I have an excel with all my reservations but I still have to get the points used for each reservation. I guess I will have to make another excel from the Points history! So tedious! And, do something clever to grab the points by Confirmation#. :ponder:

    Any ideas, tips??
     
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  15. Grammarhero

    Grammarhero Official TUGBBS Rescission Master TUG Lifetime Member

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    Wyndham, EY 434k pts
    Williamsburg Plant, EY 4L/4
    DRI South Bend, EY 1/1

    Been to:
    Intl: Aruba, Aus, Bah, China, Jpn, HK, Macau, Mex
    US: AZ, CA, DC, DE, IL, IN, KY, MD, NC, NJ, NV, NY, OH, OR, PA, SC, TN, TX, VA, WA, WV
    Are you sure this is the right graph? Natl Harbor seems too low.
     
  16. Grammarhero

    Grammarhero Official TUGBBS Rescission Master TUG Lifetime Member

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    Been to:
    Intl: Aruba, Aus, Bah, China, Jpn, HK, Macau, Mex
    US: AZ, CA, DC, DE, IL, IN, KY, MD, NC, NJ, NV, NY, OH, OR, PA, SC, TN, TX, VA, WA, WV
    1) are you retired? If so, running a Wyndham rental business using VIP benefits would take about 20 hours a week, but wouldn’t be a bad idea. Of course, if you want to run this business, you’d probably want to pick up some resale Grand Desert or Natl Harbor contracts to continue bookings, and you have to be careful with use year realignments. If you are not retired, don’t worry about it, and enjoy life.
    2) your ROI will be very low at first but improves with time. The longer you have VIPF, the longer you and your children get your VIP savings, and the longer you can rent at profit.
    3) as I said, it’s not like you overpaid by $173k. You overpaid by $60k. You seem like a HNWI or a sub-HNWI. $60k might not be much in the long run for you.
     
    T-Dot-Traveller likes this.
  17. SNA27

    SNA27 TUG Member

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    Grammarhero, you do throw a curveball at me with your acronyms! But I have binged them and understand exactly what you mean!:) There was talk radio host in LA, who used to have a pithy response to 'How are you?'. Better than most but not as good as some!:)
    I am going to try (Yoda is yelling TRY NOT, DO!:)) to make excellent lemonade! I want to quant, to the extreme, this deal in which I find myself, as in the movie 'TheMartian'!
    My son thinks we should turn a profit! Easy for him to say because his 'we' usually means yours truly!:(
    Don't you love your children who think BIG and leave the DETAILS to you to get it done! Like they have this grand idea and all it needs is for some dolt to execute it!:rolleyes::):):)
     
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  18. Grammarhero

    Grammarhero Official TUGBBS Rescission Master TUG Lifetime Member

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    Wyndham, EY 434k pts
    Williamsburg Plant, EY 4L/4
    DRI South Bend, EY 1/1

    Been to:
    Intl: Aruba, Aus, Bah, China, Jpn, HK, Macau, Mex
    US: AZ, CA, DC, DE, IL, IN, KY, MD, NC, NJ, NV, NY, OH, OR, PA, SC, TN, TX, VA, WA, WV
    HNWI is someone with $1 million in liquid assets. Sub-HNWI is someone with $100k to $1 million in liquid assets. I’m the latter for now.

    Our net worth is $400k. I do wonder that instead of smiling each time I see our bank, 401k, and IRA account increases each month, maybe I should the splurge on The $26k to get VIPG. Would take convincing the wife.
     
  19. SNA27

    SNA27 TUG Member

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    Your numbers are way off! In CA, especially in Silicon Valley, they would think you're a low-balling alien from Mars!:)

    You live in DC, the richest area of the country for no credible reason other than being the source of honey! All those who dip their hands in honey feel compelled and unashamed to lick some of it!;) Ayn Rand warned us about this!:(

    I hope your wife vetos your idea!;) After all that spiel about being frugal and savvy about acquiring resale?:ponder: Get a grip! Get more resale, if you must!;) With cheap resale points, you can crown yourself VIP! You don't need a discount or upgrade from Wyndham! You can do that for yourself!;)

    Great advice coming from a guy who was taken to the cleaners by Wyndham Salesmeisters!:D
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2019
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  20. SNA27

    SNA27 TUG Member

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    I just got the Smoky mountain deed I bought for $6300. The seller got all of $10. Amazing!

    The document actually says
    'For and consideration of Ten Dollars cash in hand paid, and other good valuable considerations not herein mentioned, receipt of all of which is hereby acknowledged we, X and Y, hereinafter called the Granters, and P & Q, Grantees, their successors, assigns and representatives the following described property.'
    (escrow guys missed a verb somewhere in there! It sticks in my grammar craw!:))

    Anyway, I don't begrudge the gentleman who gets the bulk of it! He's also on commission, no salary and is a devoted husband to his wife suffering from dementia! Ambidextrous artist, to boot!:)
     
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  21. tugcccsp

    tugcccsp TUG Member

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    The resorts only collect the Occupancy Tax. Those are daily charges made to the guests when they occupy a room. In most states, there are two other taxes the owner is required to collect, Accommodations Tax and Sales Tax (or sometimes referred to as Excise Tax). The resorts do not collect these two other taxes, unless they are the owners of the rooms and are charging them as hotel stays. So, in many government jurisdictions there are three separate taxes in these cases. Those seem excessive, but that is what governments like to do. Taxes: We pay when we work, we pay when we buy things, we pay when we invest our savings, we pay when we stay at hotels, we pay when we rent out rooms, and we pay when we die.
     
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  22. Sandi Bo

    Sandi Bo TUG Member

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    Actually, I think they all say that, pretty sure. I remember questioning something similar when I sold my Dad's house (in Florida, if that matters). My brain dumbed it down to standard practice, some legal mumbo jumbo, and don't worry about it. Because as the seller, it did concern me to see the $10 figure.
     
  23. Grammarhero

    Grammarhero Official TUGBBS Rescission Master TUG Lifetime Member

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    DRI South Bend, EY 1/1

    Been to:
    Intl: Aruba, Aus, Bah, China, Jpn, HK, Macau, Mex
    US: AZ, CA, DC, DE, IL, IN, KY, MD, NC, NJ, NV, NY, OH, OR, PA, SC, TN, TX, VA, WA, WV
    If you buy Grand Desert or National Harbor resale for $1, once you no longer want the,, you can always give back via Ovations after depo
    To be fair, the definition of HWNI and sub-NWNI are standard. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-net-worth_individual
     
  24. SNA27

    SNA27 TUG Member

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    I now have everything from the Reservations and Points History in an excel. A couple of Macros made short work of the tedious process! It made boring stuff interesting!;) My analytics should be revealing!

    Right now, I am trying to audit and reconcile the contract awards to make sure that I have indeed received all the points I should have. A contract trade, point adjustments, RCI Deposit, Point Deposit etc. make it all a cumbersome process. If you're off by a penny, you could very well be off by millions! I am off by 7000 points :wall: I have to check by user-year! There has to be an explanation!:(
     

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