HCC Associate vs. PE Premier Preview

[GOLFNBEACH]

While doing my due diligence on HCC I came across the Private Escapes Premier Preview membership option. I already own a HGVC week and at this time in my life do not have time for more than 2 additional weeks of vacation.

HCC Associate - $30,000 membership, $3,500 annual, 15 days. 80% refundable.

PE Premier Preview - $50,000 membership, $4,600 annual, 14 days, plus nightly fee of $82. 100% REFUNDABLE.

Does PE Premier Review allow me the same scheduling benefits of Premier? (1 to 14 days advance registration, fewer holidays than HCC, advantage of 7 days reciprocity to Platinum or Pinnacle.)

At some point in the future I could upgrade to take advantage of unlimited use.

Can anyone else provide more details to help me make a more informed decision? Thanks for all the help on this wornderful forum.

 

[pwrshift]

Is this the PE site .. I couldn't get it to go anywhere meaningful or even search their inventory or fee programs. Very strange and less than impressive.

Brian

http://www.privateescapes.com/

 

[capjak]

Is this the PE site .. I couldn't get it to go anywhere meaningful or even search their inventory or fee programs. Very strange and less than impressive.

Brian

http://www.privateescapes.com/

That is the site. It has dropdown menus etc.. you just have to play awhile to figure it out. PE has more places/homes than HCC but I higher fees. you pay the 4600 and than have to pay daily $82...

 

[Steamboat Bill]

"Vinyarder" is the only PE member on TUG and he just joined HCC and is a member of TWO destination clubs. Perhaps he can provide some input for you.

 

[LTTravel]

While doing my due diligence on HCC I came across the Private Escapes Premier Preview membership option. I already own a HGVC week and at this time in my life do not have time for more than 2 additional weeks of vacation.

HCC Associate - $30,000 membership, $3,500 annual, 15 days. 80% refundable.

PE Premier Preview - $50,000 membership, $4,600 annual, 14 days, plus nightly fee of $82. 100% REFUNDABLE.

Does PE Premier Review allow me the same scheduling benefits of Premier? (1 to 14 days advance registration, fewer holidays than HCC, advantage of 7 days reciprocity to Platinum or Pinnacle.)

At some point in the future I could upgrade to take advantage of unlimited use.

Can anyone else provide more details to help me make a more informed decision? Thanks for all the help on this wornderful forum.

PE is definately more expensive that HCC for a similar home price point ($800-$850,000- though I think that the HCC homes are nicer but PE has a few more benefits. (eg. New York, 1600 Broadway HCC one bedroom, PE studio, LaCosta HCC 2 bedroom, PE 1 bedroom, Waikaloa HCC 3 bedroom, PE 2 bedroom) The two programs you are comparing are not equivalent. The PE Premier Review is a "trial" program similar to the one week trial membership that just expired on HCC. The trial programs are 100% refundable. Though you can continue with PE's "trial membership" forever, I think that HCC's trial membership eventually has to be either upgraded or cancelled- (I would check with them directly) HCC's and PE's full programs are both 80% refundable. If you call them up, they may be willing to give you the trial membership at HCC which just expired yesterday if you are interested. Why not consider a trial at HCC and a Lite at DHH? $20,000(100% refundable) + $25,000(80% refundable), yearly $8750 yearly dues ($1750 + $7000), 14 days. VS. PE $50,000(100% refundable) plus $5748 yearly dues, 14 days. But with this you get much greater variety for just $3000 more per year, not to mention DHH's $1000 food credit, airport transfers ($300 value) and car rental ($800 value) and breakfast and laundry service ($250 value) making them almost equal.

 

[pwrshift]

The corporate membership is the only one I'd ever be interested in so I could use membership for customer use, employee use, family & relatives, etc., so that I would NOT have to be there to supervise them like children.

I'm assuming that you can do that quite freely .. ie. run a contest and a customer wins and gets a week.

In addition...if you took a trial (no doubt they'll offer them again) on a low level membership would the 'corp' prices and benefits be locked in at the current price?

Brian

...At some point in the future I could upgrade to take advantage of unlimited use.
.

 

[vineyarder]

Does PE Premier Review allow me the same scheduling benefits of Premier? (1 to 14 days advance registration, fewer holidays than HCC, advantage of 7 days reciprocity to Platinum or Pinnacle.)

At some point in the future I could upgrade to take advantage of unlimited use.

Can anyone else provide more details to help me make a more informed decision? Thanks for all the help on this wornderful forum.

As I understand it, PE Premiere Preview membership does allow you all the scheduling flexibility of PE Premiere, and allows you to book any holiday except Xmas or New Years as far in advance as you'd like, as well as booking long weekends far in advance (if you wish). You are limited to 14 nights per year, but as mentioned previously, unlike the HCC trial, you can continue in the PE Previews plan as long as you want, maintaining the 100% refundability of your deposit.

I think that HCC's trial membership eventually has to be either upgraded or cancelled- (I would check with them directly)

Yes, this is true; up or out after 1 year.

If you call them up, they may be willing to give you the trial membership at HCC which just expired yesterday if you are interested.

They have removed the 'expires August 31 2007' from their website, so it looks like the trial program is still an option.

PE is definately more expensive that HCC for a similar home price point

Since you can only do the HCC trial for one year before 'up or out' (and it only includes 7 nights), if you compare HCC Associate membership with PE Premiere, and assume that the nonrefundable portion of the HCC deposit is amortized over a 10 year holding period, then the cost per night for HCC is $373 per night, and the cost for PE Premiere Preview is $589 per night, so PE is definately more expensive, BUT with PE Premiere Preview you can book spring break, President's week, July 4th, Labor Day, Thanksgiving, etc., and you can use your 14 nights in any combination from 1 night stays to a 14 night stays, arriving and departing on any day ofthe week, so you could concievably book a 7 night spring break week plus a 4 night Thanksgiving break plus a 3 night July 4th break, and book them all a year in advance (or even further), whereas with HCC Associate you can only book in 7 day increments, arriving on a set day, and you cannot book any of the holidays, and only 1 reservation can be booked as a long-term reservation, so you get a lot more flexibility with PE Premiere Preview. So it really comes down to your personal needs; i.e. how you plan to use the clubs. If holidays (other than Xmas/NY) are important to you, and/or you need/want to plan ahead for all/most of your travel, and/or you need/want the ability to book short-stays, then the flexibility of PE Premiere Preview is worth the extra cost. OTOH, if you do not need/want to travel on holidays, and are fine with 7 day stays, one booked up to a year in advance and one 90 days out, then HCC Associate is the better deal.

All that being said, I see the two clubs as being very complementary, and being a member of both covers all needs (at least on paper; I just joined HCC yesterday).

There is really no reason not to join HCC as a trial member, since the entry point is so low ($20K), the annual dues very low ($1750 for 7 nights), and the risk essentially zero (since the deposit is 100% refundable, the only risk is if the company failed, which is pretty unlikely given their current finances/assets). The only downside is the 1 year 'up or out' rule. Since PE Premiere Preview is also extremely low downside (since deposit is 100% refundable), but can be permanent, why not join both clubs, giving you 21 nights usage over the next year, with a 7 day long-term advanced reservation via HCC and whatever usage you want of the 14 nights in PE, at a cost of a $70K deposit (100% refundable) and annual dues of $6350, giving you 21 nights at an average cost of $469, way less than the cost of renting a comparable property (especially at holiday/high season rates)... Then at the end of the year, you decide whether to upgrade the HCC membership and/or continue with PE Preview or drop both or keep both!

 

[pwrshift]

And can anyone show us what those 'financials' are ... in detail ... or do you have to sign up, pay up, and shut up when/if you see them? If the members are financing their company and assets, I think they should disclose everything, private or not. Donald Trump finances on other peoples money too, but at least he's regulated by the SEC.

Brian

....the only risk is if the company failed, which is pretty unlikely given their current finances/assets). !

 

[LTTravel]

Vineyarder,

PE is definately a player in the DC market. It is run by Rich Keith who used to work for Tanner and Haley and left to start his own company when he realized that Tanner and Haley was not run properly. I think that it is structured and run well. But I did not know that you can book more than one holiday more than one year in advance and for less than a week. Is this theoretical or is it really possible? What are the booking rules?

 

[LTTravel]

And can anyone show us what those 'financials' are ... in detail ... or do you have to sign up, pay up, and shut up when/if you see them? If the members are financing their company and assets, I think they should disclose everything, private or not. Donald Trump finances on other peoples money too, but at least he's regulated by the SEC.

Brian

I hope you didn't invest in his Atlantic City properties. All bankrupt.

 

[GOLFNBEACH]

The only downside is the 1 year 'up or out' rule. Since PE Premiere Preview is also extremely low downside (since deposit is 100% refundable), but can be permanent, why not join both clubs, giving you 21 nights usage over the next year, with a 7 day long-term advanced reservation via HCC and whatever usage you want of the 14 nights in PE, at a cost of a $70K deposit (100% refundable) and annual dues of $6350, giving you 21 nights at an average cost of $469, way less than the cost of renting a comparable property (especially at holiday/high season rates)... Then at the end of the year, you decide whether to upgrade the HCC membership and/or continue with PE Preview or drop both or keep both!

A week ago I was in the market to buy a used timeshare in Florida for golf and beach use, and now I am actually considering (am I crazy) dropping $70K on joining both clubs as vineyarder describes.

I love the price point of HCC but I want the reservation flexibility of PE.

 

[LTTravel]

A week ago I was in the market to buy a used timeshare in Florida for golf and beach use, and now I am actually considering (am I crazy) dropping $70K on joining both clubs as vineyarder describes.

I love the price point of HCC but I want the reservation flexibility of PE.

I think that you will like a DC much more than a Timeshare. You can drop your DC membership much easier than reselling your Timeshare. Timeshares offer little flexibility and the trading opportunities that they claim are MUCH more difficult than they claim.

 

[vineyarder]

But I did not know that you can book more than one holiday more than one year in advance and for less than a week. Is this theoretical or is it really possible? What are the booking rules?

It is definately possible, not just theoretical. I have Thanksgiving, Xmas, and Spring Break all booked within the next 7 months... Xmas and New Years are allocated via a lotterty held 13 months in advance; the more places and dates you request (i.e. the more flexible you are), the more likely you are to get one of your choices, and if you don't, you get priority for the following year. All other 'holidays' are first-come, first-serve, booked as far in advance as you want; the only restrictions on the other major holidays (Thanksgiving, Spring Break, and President's week) are that you cannot use the reciprocal properties (i.e. Premiere can only use Premiere properties those periods, can't upgrade to Platinum or Pinnacle Property). The counter-balance to the first-come, first-serve system is that while you have unlimited usage, you can only have 28 days reserved at a time (14 for Previews members)... So someone could book the next 4 years President's week, but then they would have no reservation days left to use the rest of the year. This seems to work quite well, with very few people actually booking greater than a year in advance, unless it is a very special event, like a wedding or reunion. For example, right now, in Premiere, there are about a dozen homes open over Thanksgiving, and for Spring Break / Easter week there are still numerous options open, including Cabo and Hawaii.

Personally, I find that I keep 3 long-term reservations on the books, and usually try to leave about 7 days open for shorter term bookings and long weekends, which I re-book over the course of the year as I use them. In terms of duration, you can book anywhere from 1 night to 14 nights, arriving and departing on any day. Fabulous flexibility.

 

[vineyarder]

I think that you will like a DC much more than a Timeshare. You can drop your DC membership much easier than reselling your Timeshare. Timeshares offer little flexibility and the trading opportunities that they claim are MUCH more difficult than they claim.

Amen! The success rate for Four Seasons Aviara or Four Seasons Scottsdale trading into Four Seasons Jackson Hole was 0% in 2006, despite over 200 requests, and the sucess rate for trades between Aviara and Scottsdale was in the low teens.

 

[GOLFNBEACH]

I think that you will like a DC much more than a Timeshare. You can drop your DC membership much easier than reselling your Timeshare. Timeshares offer little flexibility and the trading opportunities that they claim are MUCH more difficult than they claim.

That is the reason that I am considering the PE trial over the HCC trial (or associate) even though the price is much higher.

1. With PE I can get 100% of my membership fee back at any time. With HCC once I join I only get 80% back.

2. With PE I think I will actually get a better feel of how the club works and how flexible it actually is. With HCC I am only picking one non-holiday week so I will never know how easy (or difficult) it would be to actually get the locations and times I want.

Some thoughts running through my head:

1. From the PE website under FAQs something I really like (just like most country clubs) "A sound financial structure and unprecedented transparency, including independently audited financial summaries available each year to members, an elected board of managers with voting and oversight powers, and a Members Only website that tracks all performance aspects of the Club."

2. The value side (cheap side) of me really likes the HCC price point.

3. I don't like the extra per night fee with PE.

 

[vineyarder]

Forgot to mention Reciprocal usage

PE is definately more expensive, BUT with PE Premiere Preview you can book spring break, President's week, July 4th, Labor Day, Thanksgiving, etc., and you can use your 14 nights in any combination from 1 night stays to a 14 night stays, arriving and departing on any day ofthe week, so you could concievably book a 7 night spring break week plus a 4 night Thanksgiving break plus a 3 night July 4th break, and book them all a year in advance (or even further), whereas with HCC Associate you can only book in 7 day increments, arriving on a set day, and you cannot book any of the holidays, and only 1 reservation can be booked as a long-term reservation, so you get a lot more flexibility with PE Premiere Preview. So it really comes down to your personal needs; i.e. how you plan to use the clubs. If holidays (other than Xmas/NY) are important to you, and/or you need/want to plan ahead for all/most of your travel, and/or you need/want the ability to book short-stays, then the flexibility of PE Premiere Preview is worth the extra cost. OTOH, if you do not need/want to travel on holidays, and are fine with 7 day stays, one booked up to a year in advance and one 90 days out, then HCC Associate is the better deal.

Forgot to mention earlier, but with PE Premiere you also get the option of 7 days per year of reciprocal usage of homes in Platinum (avg. $1.6M) or Pinnacle (avg. $3.5M - $4M), albeit at a higher nightly rate. I'm not sure whether this applies to the Preview membership, however.

 

[LTTravel]

3. I don't like the extra per night fee with PE.

Just consider the yearly dues as $5748 and ignore the daily fees. Remember, the full membership of PE includes unlimited nights which does not apply to the trial membership. The daily fee is a carryover from Tanner and Haley which also had unlimited utilization. It is a way of making members who use the club more, pay a little more. I think that it is a very fair way of designing a club with unlimited utilization. If I was a member and used only 28 days in an unlimited membership in a year, I would like to know that I paid less than someone who used it 60 days.

 

[Steamboat Bill]

I am glad to see TUGers consider joining TWO destination clubs as I posted a thread here several months ago exploring this concept.

I should probably SELL all my timeshares and vaction properties and join several clubs.

I like HCC, PE, BelleHavens, and the new DHH.

 

[LTTravel]

I am glad to see TUGers consider joining TWO destination clubs as I posted a thread here several months ago exploring this concept.

I should probably SELL all my timeshares and vaction properties and join several clubs.

I like HCC, PE, BelleHavens, and the new DHH.

I agree with you. Other DC's to consider

Quintess had a great program also which expired in March. They would refund 80% of the current fee of membership for their charter membership and it has already gone up from $345,000 to $395,000 and will probably go up again soon. With the quality of their properties and service, it was a good deal. Now they only give you 80% back
Lusso is definately worth looking at for a higher end club and I think currently a good deal. They give you back 100% of your membership fee plus 50% of any appreciation. They started at $325,000 and are currently at $375,000 and going up to $395,000 on September 15. So if you had joined in January, your membership will be worth $360,000 now or a 10.8% gain in 8 months. This will probably expire soon. They also offer unlimited useage. I heard a rumor that they will be announcing 3 more homes after the price increase September 15. I don't remember where I read that.
PE also had a 100% refund policy which I think also ended this year. Early members also got a fraction of the real estate appreciation back to cover some of their yearly dues.

 

[Kagehitokiri]

so total "annual" fees of PE premiere preview is $5748.
i cant imagine they allow reciprocity in the premiere preview membership...
but if they do, i might consider joining just for 1 trip.
(like the 2 watercolor resort properties for example - 7BR total)

one comparison re properties >
PE premiere's punta mita property is beachfront with infinity pool.
HCC has 3 ski-in/ski-out townhomes.

 

[LTTravel]

i one comparison re properties >
PE premiere's punta mita property is beachfront with infinity pool.

The photo is not clear. Maybe someone who has been there can clarify. You can't get a good view of the home from the photos. But here is a description of La Playa Estates from 2004. Prices and values have incrased since then.

La Playa Estates

Costa Banderas
The La Playa Estates development consists of seven beachfront estate homes and 19 well-appointed ocean view homes set along a two-mile stretch of sandy beach. The beachfront homes feature their own private pools, unique floor plans and excellence in construction, finishings and services, all with panoramic views and direct beach access. The ocean view homes are built on two elevated terraces that offer unobstructed views of the bay. Standard amenities include, but are not limited to, Subzero refrigerator, Dacor oven and stove, Bosh dishwasher, granite counter tops, covered two-car garage, marble flooring, Primavera wood carpentry and PVC and aluminum windows Exclusive for 26 owners, the beach clubhouse and spa area features a meandering infinity pool with built-in sun lounges, swim-up bar and facilities for entertaining large groups. There are also tennis and paddleball courts on the premises. La Playa Estates is located near Estiladeras Beach at Km 8.3 on the highway to Punta de Mita. Unit prices range from $650,000 to $1,200,000 USD. Title insurance is available. For more information, contact laplayarealty@hotmail.com or (329) 291-7062.


I think that the PE home is one of the "Ocean View" homes, not the "Beachfront Estates"

 

[Kagehitokiri]

this picture clearly shows direct beach access.

http://images.private-escapes.com/site2/pe/Punta_Mita,_Mexico.prop/lrg-Pool.jpg
http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showpost.php?p=385007&postcount=19

edit - ah, i see what youre saying now. fortunately this clears things up >

http://www.lapuntarealty.com/casadelasflores/index.htm

so PE's is a 3BR beachfront home, and the 4BR would have been $1.2MM. so they got a fairly good deal, just not sure how much. regardless of how much though, it means its not directly comparable to HCC (like i did earlier) because its value is higher than acquisition cost.

 

[LTTravel]

The picture of the outside of the house shows only the front door and back. I would like to see a full picture of the house. The descriptions states "15 paces from your home is the pool"
From the photos, if you look at the front and back of the house, you do not see the pool. From the living room, if you look out, there is a large grass area before the water, and no pool. There is a picture of a hallway and the pool on the otherside. I don't get the layout.

 

[Kagehitokiri]

if you look at the realty site i linked, the pool is actually quite a distance (30-40 feet?) from the 4BR that is for sale. from the aerial shots, it seems that distance varies for each of the 7 beachfront properties.

PE could definitely have gotten some better pictures, or even give a fuller property layout, rather than just interior floorplan. kind of like http://www.exclusiveresorts.com/images/destinations/TUS-fp-mainlevel.jpg

 

[LTTravel]

http://www.lapuntarealty.com/casadelasflores/index.htm

If this is what it looks like, I would say it is pretty nice.