How to Deal with a son & DIL that will not spend any holiday with you?

[Sugarcubesea]

You have to stop the hurt and the only way to do so is to protect yourself now. Your son is not stupid but he has to grow up and fend for himself in an abusive relationship. Your grandson has bad role models and he is also growing up to be dysfunctional, and if I understand correctly, he is disrespectful of his grandparents. If you can sum up your feelings well, you may want to make one final attempt to speak with him directly (on the phone?) about how you feel, and certainly without her presence. Enough is enough.

A dear close friend of ours, who past away this March, had 2 sons who refused to be in the same room with one another. I know the full story but so as not to get into the details... She was driving 2.5 hrs every Christmas Day to see her older son, until one year she decided to stop doing so. All her voicemails and snail mails to him were one-way communications. She was distraught that her eldest son chose to cut out of any relationship with his brother and also blamed his mother for what had conspired between the siblings. She really wanted her 2 sons to get along. We repeatedly told her to let their relationships be and not let herself be vulnerable to more hurt. Well, a year ago, her elder son said he found god, and came back into their lives. No one really knows what happened and why. When she was dying, she was at peace as her wish had been for the brothers to get along and be on speaking terms.

So one never really knows if and when someone will change and be a better person.

Actually, my grandson is very sweet and comes running into my arms whenever he sees me. He always tells me how much he misses me and it breaks my heart that I’m not able to spend more time with him.

 

[rapmarks]

My son and family has never spent a holiday with us. They visit us in Florida for one week, I pay for the plane tickets. When we stayed two nights at their home we were very uncomfortable. I have never spoken on the phone with my daughter in law. When they visit her parents in the summer, we are allotted two days. They do not stay at our house, but stay at a hotel. On the second day she stays at the motel, and comes over late in the day. They have one child and she doesn't work, but intends to get her phd when he goes to first grade. She has worked on two masters degrees during their marriage, in non job producing fields. We are extremely generous with them and with our daughter. my son tries to call us every week and skype with his son, but she never appears in the picture or room.

 

[VacationForever]

Actually, my grandson is very sweet and comes running into my arms whenever he sees me. He always tells me how much he misses me and it breaks my heart that I’m not able to spend more time with him.

Great! He deserves a nice present from you from the list!

 

[Bailey#1]

There's an old Irish saying, A son is a son until he takes a wife, a daughter is a daughter for the rest of your life! I guess this is true for you. It is sad
but it sounds like there is a lot of truth to this for many others as well.

 

[Sugarcubesea]

My son and family has never spent a holiday with us. They visit us in Florida for one week, I pay for the plane tickets. When we stayed two nights at their home we were very uncomfortable. I have never spoken on the phone with her. When they visit her parents in the summer, we are allotted two days. They do not stay at our house, but stay at a hotel. On the second day she stays at the motel, and comes over late in the day. They have one child and she doesn't work, but intends to get her phd when he goes to first grade. She has worked on two masters degrees during their marriage, in non job producing fields. We are extremely generous with them and with our daughter.my son tries to call us every week and skype with his son, but she never appears in the picture or room.

I’m so sorry you are going through the same thing I’m going through. I always made sure on every holiday that we took turns between my parents and my in laws. I have always treated my in laws with love and I loved spending time with them.

 

[Sugarcubesea]

There's an old Irish saying, A son is a son until he takes a wife, a daughter is a daughter for the rest of your life! I guess this is true for you. It is sad
but it sounds like there is a lot of truth to this for many others as well.

I had never heard that saying and I’m sad that it’s like this for others

 

[merriot]

Call your son and ask him to meet you for breakfast or lunch someplace quiet where you can talk. I'd write down my thoughts before the meeting...that way you can be objective and stay on track...hopefully he will understand the hurt her insensitivity has caused you, your grandson and son himself. Wasn't it Shakespeare that said a child's ungratefulness is sharper than a serpent's tooth.
As we get older, love of family or friends is the most important sustaining factor in life. I very much understand how you feel.

 

[rapmarks]

I’m so sorry you are going through the same thing I’m going through. I always made sure on every holiday that we took turns between my parents and my in laws. I have always treated my in laws with love and I loved spending time with them.

My in laws were too busy for us, they had so many friends and spent holidays with them. They would allo dec 23 for us to host them for Christmas. After they moved away, they came back home three times. The first time they spent time with us, the kids were three and seven. The next time we were only allowed one hour as they had lots of friends to see too. The third time, they never told us they were there and did not visit us. They did not visit his son either. We found out after they got sick that they had been out. After they got sick, they had no friends, and they expected us to quit our jobs and move out and take care of them. We spent many years taking care of my mother in law after her second husband died.

 

[DeniseM]

I don't think you are going to change anything, and if you some how coerce your DIL into coming to a family event, she will be unpleasant and probably spoil the event. You cannot change her attitude, and you are making yourself miserable trying to.

I would send the grandchild a nice gift, and send the adults modest gift cards, and then just let it go and enjoy your holidays. This is a "wisdom to know what you cannot change" situation.

They have offered to come over on December 23 and she said it would be just like Christmas Eve. I have not responded but my other son and daughter are telling me to tell them no, it’s unfair to me to have to cook 3 big holiday meals in a row.

If you really want to see them, you should do Dec. 23rd. I would not cook a big dinner. I would do appetizers and drinks, with the idea that if they don't show up, you can use the food on the other days.

 

[Iggyearl]

Thank you for starting this thread. I know it must be therapeutic for you and it has been eye-opening for the rest of us. Just goes to prove that "Leave It to Beaver," "Father Knows Best," "My Three Sons" were all mirages from a glorified TV world. There are no perfect families (maybe just a few). If I could make one recommendation (from personal experience) please don't give away money that will affect your lifestyle. Live for yourself and your immediate family. You can't save the world by being generous.

My brother - in his infinite wisdom - once gave $5,000 to a couple who belonged to their church. The couple used the money, then declared bankruptcy. His donation was wasted. Today, my brother is divorced and could not write a check for $1,000.

 

[r1lee]

There's an old Irish saying, A son is a son until he takes a wife, a daughter is a daughter for the rest of your life! I guess this is true for you. It is sad
but it sounds like there is a lot of truth to this for many others as well.

This is well known, even in Asian culture.

I would just cut them out. I have no time for stupidity. I’m not saying this from the outside, i have cut off my mom for her own stupidly while still communicating with my dad. I dont go out of my way to see my mom, if she wants to see me and her grandkids then she can arrange the time.

 

[jehb2]

As for the gifts...My MIL is the sweetest, kindest, really awesome MIL. She also knows that her kids and grandkids already have a lot. So there is this charity you you can pick from a list (10 chickens to a 3rd world family, etc. ). She selects multiple gifts in the names of each of her children & grandchildren . We all like it, especially my kids (They really love the gift of chickens).

I suggest this is the gift you give your son, DIL, and grandchild. Make a donation in their name to the charity of their choice. Your DIL will probably hate it. But I sense she'll dislike whatever you give. At least this present won't go to waste. And this present is what Christmas is all about. Not choosing from an Amazon list containing $3K worth of merchandise.

 

[DeniseM]

Let me just say that I had the opposite problem with my (former) MIL. She never hosted any holidays, and sometimes ruined ours.

I remember one Christmas Eve where she showed up and looked at my complete Christmas dinner, china and crystal on the table and said, "I hope you didn't go to any trouble - we stopped and got a hamburger on the way over."

 

[Patri]

Oh Sugar, you and I could trade stories. How old are the two? It seems like it is always the female who causes these problems. My son, quite young, fell into a similar trap but adored his wife. For a few years we truly felt we lost him, but I insisted that the family keep the doors open. My other kids were so mad at him. Now the divorce is almost final, he is getting joint custody, and our son is BACK. We are all close again. Do not give up hope.

 

[jehb2]

This has been this gal's way of doing things since the beginning...

Okay, this story explains it all. You'll never be able to change this this person or this situation. You and your other 2 kids can get together every year as planned. Once you finalize the date invite the other son and his family. Will they ever come? No. But chances are he'll eventually divorce this woman and realize that his family was always there for him.

My brother was married to an evil woman for 10 years. We didn't get to see much of him during that time. He came to my wedding but she wouldn't (thank goodness). Eventually they divorced. And ever since then he's has never missed a major family function, and he lives out of state.

 

[rapmarks]

I would not agree with cutting them off. My husband's brother cut off contact with his mother, grandmother, and us for twenty years, because of dislike of her second husband. That was my husband's only relative. In 1999, I sent him a message that we were going to be in Phoenix for a week, if they were interested in meeting us for dinner. Since then the two brothers talk on the phone Sometimes for hours, and he has met my daughter, but has never seen my son. It means so much to my husband to have his brother back.

 

[bogey21]

Set your dates, invite them, and if they don't come it's their problem. I know this will be hard on you, but you have to live your own life. You can't "rescue" your son - he has reclaim his gonads from his wife's pocketbook on his own. I would send a modest gift to your grandson because he has no say in any of this.

Close to my thinking. I have nothing to do with my kids over the holidays (or birthdays for that matter). I give them no gifts and rarely see them on either of these days. Terrible, you say. Let me explain. When my kids were in their early teens we discussed this. I told them there would be no inheritance when I die and no presents on birthdays, Xmas, etc. I also told them I would pay for all their education, buy them each their first car, pay for their travel on mission trips, sports tournaments they participate in, etc.

What I do in lieu of birthday, Xmas gifts, etc. is pick out things throughout the year to help them with while I am alive. I have made many car payments, insurance payments, house payments, DIL's student loan payments, etc at times of my choosing without being asked. I also have set up and contribute to 529 accounts for their kids' education. All on my own volition. The truth is they have never asked me for anything and expect nothing when I die.

There is no question in my mind that they appreciate what I do for them and don't miss not seeing me on Xmas, Birthdays, etc. and are comfortable not receiving Birthday or Xmas gifts from me. I am there for them when they need me. Because of my age they have chosen to call and make sure I am OK almost every day.

George

 

[vacationhopeful]

I’m just shocked. I guess they are going to look for jobs after the holidays and just have her parents pay for their living expenses.

It’s so sad and I wish I knew a way to not blow up and just tell them how much their behavior has hurt me the past 7 years.

No jobs? Living with her parents? THEY are not saving money ... they are broke and not working.

This young couple has issues ... drugs, drinking, gambling, co-dependence, personality disorders, lazy ass disease, etc. Both lost their jobs around the same time? Did they get arrested? Change the locks on your house and get a monitor home security system. And create a secure, locked room at your home. My bet is DRUGS (heroin). Entertain them on neutral ground, like the Olive Garden where they can order drinks.

Change the locks on your house, get a monitor home security system and KEEP them OUT of your home ... before jewelry disappears, check books vanish and they learn the neighbor's schedules. They are broke.

PS. Most county court houses have records of evictions and foreclosures ... might go research those public records were they USED to live.

 

[Jan M.]

You said this has been going on for 7 years so that tells me they are old enough to know that their behavior is unacceptable. Hopefully eventually your son will wake up and leave this spoiled selfish girl child. In the meantime make sure he knows that he and your grandchild are welcome in your home. I wouldn't specifically say that the DIL from hell isn't welcome, I would just not ever mention her in any invitations. My assessment of her is that there isn't much chance of her ever becoming a better person.

About them quitting their jobs around the holidays when they have a child and expecting everyone else to provide for them. This is so appalling that words fail me.

At some point during the holiday season can you arrange to have your grandson for a few hours so you could take him shopping to pick out what he would like for Christmas and afterwards maybe go to someplace he likes to eat? He would get to take the presents home with him. It would be a very unusual child that wouldn't love to do this with the grandparent(s). I wouldn't give your DIL a thing. I would tell your son that you have a gift for him at your house if he is able to find even a half an hour to come get it on one of the days the rest of the family will be there celebrating. If he can't manage that then I would tell him that you are sorry that he wasn't able to take advantage of the opportunity to receive the gift. I would keep the gift small, say no more than $25-$30, in a gift certificate or cash that you can use for yourselves if he doesn't show up.

I wouldn't place a further burden on your son by telling him how much all this has hurt you. He knows. I would be willing to bet your other two kids have let him know what they think of the situation.

I have a SIL who taught me the phrase that someone else posted. First time shame on you; second time, shame on me. Focus on going forward. Think about what all of us have said, decide on a course of action and stick to it. You can't change someone else, you can only change yourself and how you deal with them.

 

[VacationForever]

I have assumed that they live some distance away.... but that is "ass u me". If they live close by, then it is so much easier to set up meeting your grandson and hang out together.

 

[vacationhopeful]

Go look up "The Serenity Prayer" on google. Is a standard in AA meetings. Attend a few AlAnon meetings or NarcAnon meetings ... understand WHAT a co-dependent is (that is what YOU are becoming). Consult a lawyer about getting custody of your grandchild. If you are providing all cost for your grandchild to live in YOUR HOME, get custody and the tax deductions ... plus where is this child current medical coverage? Welfare (medicaid card?), food stamps? rental assistance? Homeless Prevention programs?

In my state, if you allow anyone to stay in your home ... and you ask them to leave and they REFUSE, you have to evict them. In State Superior Court .. and you have to have a reason. As I think to myself about some tenants, "Make my day .. don't pay YOUR rent!" .. as that is the quickest, fastest and easiest way to REMOVE anyone from your house. Prepay for a week at a fleabag motel .. that would cost you WAY less than a lawyer for eviction court action ... and your daughter can get a FREE LEGAL AID LAWYER to fight your lawyer on any Eviction Action. And yes, this has gotten to be a regular feature in my local eviction court ... parents on the landlord side of the courtroom trying to remove their adult child from their home ... with a $200+/hour lawyer .. for cause (as most parents have no written rental contract with their adult child)... usually having to get several police reports and filed criminal charges with convictions or witnesses to violent/threaten acts against the parents. And then the parents discover jewelry missing and other valuable possessions missing... as do the neighbors.

 

[DaveNV]

I have two kids. My daughter, the younger of the two, learned all the right lessons, and she has been a model citizen all her life. I could not be more proud of her. Her brother is 16 months older, and for reasons I'm still not sure about, has been nothing but a pain since he was a teenager. Problem after problem, failure after failure, trouble after trouble, arrest after arrest, and none of it, of course, was *ever* his fault. (Yeah, right.) He's now in his 40s, and is nearly homeless. He stopped coming to me several years ago when I told him I was not a bank, and that I was tired of him only asking me for things - usually money. When I told him there would be no more money, he stopped coming around. I guess he's trying to teach me a lesson. Not sure. It took me a long time, but I learned there is no shame in telling an adult No. He knows I love him, but it is not my responsibility to make his life work. He's on his own, as far as I'm concerned. Maybe I'm trying to teach HIM the lesson. But it is what it is.

My advice to you is to stand your ground. If you want a family gathering for the holiday, tell the collective family that your gathering will be on a certain day and time. Everyone is invited to attend, and if they don't show up, well, that's their loss. Tell them your grandchild's gifts will be waiting at your house. Don't send anything to your son or DIL, regardless. Make them come and ask for it.

If you want to play Devil's Advocate, when they do come over, take your son aside privately, and ask him how long this charade of an abusive marriage is going to last. That should be grounds for a spirited discussion. On the other hand, he may be looking for a way out, and might just need someone in his court. It's a thought.

Good luck. I know it's painful.

Dave

 

[clifffaith]

No jobs? Living with her parents? THEY are not saving money ... they are broke and not working.

This young couple has issues ... drugs, drinking, gambling, co-dependence, personality disorders, lazy ass disease, etc. Both lost their jobs around the same time? Did they get arrested? Change the locks on your house and get a monitor home security system. And create a secure, locked room at your home. My bet is DRUGS (heroin). Entertain them on neutral ground, like the Olive Garden where they can order drinks.

Change the locks on your house, get a monitor home security system and KEEP them OUT of your home ... before jewelry disappears, check books vanish and they learn the neighbor's schedules. They are broke.

PS. Most county court houses have records of evictions and foreclosures ... might go research those public records were they USED to live.

Yikes, much scarier scenario than I thought, but you may be right. My thought is the DIL wants to get herself and the child under her parents' roof and the tell sonny boy to take a hike.

 

[Panina]

My opinion is your son is in an abusive relationship. You cannot change that only he can. As a parent you can try to meet him alone once in awhile, ask him, maybe for breakfast or lunch. Just let him know your door will be open for him if he ever needs to come home alone. He probably is aware that there are problems with his wife but being he has a son he is trying to make the best of it.

As far as gifts, I would ask your son to speak to your grandson on the phone. I would let your grandson know that from now on you will be putting money into a college fund for him and in addition getting him $100 dollar gift for his birthday and Christmas and he should let you know what he wants. If you buy expensive gifts for your grandson you dil could return them to the stores for money. I would tell your son instead of buying gifts for you and your wife I am putting the money in a college fund for my grandson.

I would also ask you son if he can arrange every few weeks to spend an afternoon or weekend with your grandson even if he just drops him off. Keep asking, say I understand you and your wife are busy and it's important to me to spend more time with my grandson.

You will not change you dil, she is self centered. Your son will only change if he decides he had enough, nothing you say will make him change his mind.

There is hope, I have witnessed it. Just realize the more you say dil is wrong, the more your son will defend her to prove to you everything is ok.

 

[geist1223]

Had something similar problems but minor in comparison from opposite side. During our first trip home (I was in USMC) my MIL complained that we did not spend 1/2 of our time with them. My parent were divorced. MIL thought it should be 1/4, 1/4, and 1/2. We didn't do that but it was not 1/3, 1/3, 1/3. My inlaws got the biggest share. So before we came home from a tour in Europe we sent a letter in advance that said Richard (my Dad) would pick us up at the Airport and we would spent from w to x with Richard, then we would spend x to y with Katie (my Mom), then y to z with Don and Joyce ( my inlaws). That we would do partial days visits with others while staying with one person/group. We said that if anyone did not like the schedule please let us know and we would be happy to remove them from the schedule. Everyone decide mthe schedule sounded mighty fine.

Also when we lived in the area we let everyone know that Thanksgiving belong to Katie, that Easter belonged to Don and Joyce, and New Year's belonged to Richard. That Christmas belonged to us at our home and no one was to show up uninvited.

I agree with all the advice that the parents should go on with their lives and plans. Hopefully some day their Son grows a pair.