How to Deal with a son & DIL that will not spend any holiday with you?

[rapmarks]

This made me think back to holidays growing up. We always went to my fathers family, my grandma lived next door. We loved them, but really would have enjoyed being with our cousins. After the delicious meal, my grandma, my two aunts, my great uncle, and maybe my father , would all fall asleep. My sisters, my mother and I would have to be quiet and we were so bored. My father never made any effort to be with my mother family.

 

[lizap]

I can't agree with the sexist rhetoric that your son should "grow a pair" or "wear the pants in the family". Man or woman, your son is making a conscious decision that keeping the peace is more important than spending time with you. At this point he knows you'll keep trying to make things work, so he's not forced to make any changes. If I were in your shoes I'd do what others have suggested and just invite them over on Christmas Eve with the rest of the family. If they don't make the effort to come, it's on them not you. Having a grandson in the mix definitely complicates matters as you'll have to find other means to keep that relationship open.

I suspect the harsh reality is your son just doesn't care that much about visiting his family during the holidays. It sounds like you've gone above and beyond to try to foster a relationship, but it's now time to take a step back and let things balance out?

If you love your parents and want to spend time with them, you should not allow your spouse to manipulate you into "divorcing" your parents. This applies to whether you are male or female. (Similarly, I can't imagine a spouse who truly loves you making this requirement.) This is especially true when you have grandchildren. They should be given the opportunity to get to know both sets of grandparents. In this case, this is a male adult child who is not willing to stand up to his selfish wife for whatever reason. Of course, there is only so much you can do, and you have to let it go, but I think you should communicate to your son exactly how you feel. If this continues, unfortunately your son's wife's behavior is likely to lead to resentment down the road and marital problems.

 

[elaine]

All I have to say is “what’s wrong with people?” I have not had a close rltnshp with mil for 25 years. But we certainly make time for family visits and make sure she has family for the holidays. It’s a family obligation whether you feel one or or not (which we all usually enjoy immensely) and the right thing to do for kids. Having a connection with elders is a societal good for communities.
However, I echo another who said don’t make your son choose and don’t put him in a bad spot.
But, I would also close the bank. Not bc they don’t visit but bc they need to stand on their own and not be further enabled.
Advice to live by: conduct yourself with grace and dignity in times of adversity. Always strive to be proud of your behavior and response to il-behavior. Easy to say, many times hard to do. But you’ll never regret it.
So but an appropriate gift, send your grandson lots of cards, cookies, etc from grandma and let them know they’re always welcome. Elaine

 

[tompalm]

If you love your parents and want to spend time with them, you should not allow your spouse to manipulate you into "divorcing" your parents. This applies to whether you are male or female. (Similarly, I can't imagine a spouse who truly loves you making this requirement.) This is especially true when you have grandchildren. They should be given the opportunity to get to know both sets of grandparents. In this case, this is a male adult child who is not willing to stand up to his selfish wife for whatever reason. Of course, there is only so much you can do, and you have to let it go, but I think you should communicate to your son exactly how you feel. If this continues, unfortunately your son's wife's behavior is likely to lead to resentment down the road and marital problems.

Getting carried away with divorcing your parents. I went away to college when I was 20 years old and only saw my parents twice a year. After that, I joined the Navy and was stationed in Hawaii while my parents were in Florida. I tried to get home once a year to see them, but that didn’t always work out. Just because you don’t see your parents or talk to them very often, doesn’t mean you don’t want anything to do with them. Our expectations for our children might be different than what they are able to accomplish. Sure, after I got married, I told my wife that I was going to visit my parents over the holidays or this summer and if she didn’t want to go that was fine. That is what I expect out of my son, but when he does that, it causes great conflict and stress in his marriage. So for now, we accept the situation as it is and let him know that we love him. Sometimes, that is all you can do.

 

[lizap]

Getting carried away with divorcing your parents. I went away to college when I was 20 years old and only saw my parents twice a year. After that, I joined the Navy and was stationed in Hawaii while my parents were in Florida. I tried to get home once a year to see them, but that didn’t always work out. Just because you don’t see your parents or talk to them very often, doesn’t mean you don’t want anything to do with them. Our expectations for our children might be different than what they are able to accomplish. Sure, after I got married, I told my wife that I was going to visit my parents over the holidays or this summer and if she didn’t want to go that was fine. That is what I expect out of my son, but when he does that, it causes great conflict and stress in his marriage. So for now, we accept the situation as it is and let him know that we love him. Sometimes, that is all you can do.

Every situation is unique, but you should not allow your spouse to dictate the kind of relationship you and your children (their grandchildren) have with your parents. We are very blessed in that we had a great relationship with both our parents and our in-laws. We have a great relationship with our son-in-law. We have a different kind of problem - our daughter/son-in-law don't want to grow up and accept the reponsibility of adulthood, although they have two children.

 

[brownhaired_girl]

I am so sorry you are experiencing this. Your DIL is an emotional abuser because her focus is on “I” and what can you do for me, always. Even though she is married to your son, they are not truly a couple because mutuality and equality are absent from the relationship.

I have a daughter who is a manipulator and user. I found Al Anon tremendously helpful in learning how to deal with her and to set boundaries in our relationship. Though my daughter isn’t an addict, the manipulation that is present with addicts is something I needed help with. As with any drug or alcohol abuse, treat the situation like she has a disease. There has to be some compassion present because she is a sick person.

Here is what I have learned from my two years in Al Anon:

Don’t hate the addict, hate the disease.

Don’t hate the person, hate the behaviour.

If it is hard to watch it, imagine how hard it is live it.


Learn and practice detachment, which is removing yourself from someone else’s outcome. Detachment isn’t selfish, it’s caring for yourself and letting others care for themselves.

Trust your intuition. You don’t need to explain or justify your feelings to anyone.

“No” is a complete sentence.

If your son quits his job and asks for monetary help, try detachment. It may sound like this: “You’re young, smart and resourceful. I’m sure you can figure something out.” Then walk away.

Through pain comes growth. It sounds like they both have some growing to do. I can highly recommend Melody Beattie’s book Codependent No More.

Christmas is just another chance for DIL to use you. She expects you to hold a separate, special dinner because Christmas is reserved for her family? Maybe try, “sorry we’ll miss you this Christmas, hopefully, we’ll get to see you next Christmas”. Christmas gifts only come on Christmas, so if they don’t show up, then neither do the gifts. You can give your grandson a gift the next time you see him.

All said, you still need to try to have a cordial relationship with DIL. Listen politely and very carefully to what she says, and then go and do exactly as you please. Come to terms with this: she may not be the daughter-in-law you dreamed of, but she is the daughter-in-law that you have. Choose to have whatever relationship is possible with her, for the sake of keeping contact with your son and grandson. If your DIL sees you cannot be ruffled, she'll have to change her act and smarten up over time. Put the grandson and son first and be as lovely as you can, leaving the venting for friends or your hubby.

This post needs a LOVE button. Such wisdom.

 

[folashade]

My son does not like conflict and he has the personality that will do or say whatever someone asks of him. He stated to his grandmother that he just wants to keep the peace at home when he was explaining to her why he could not attend her 87th birthday party at a restaurant that she was paying for.

I can't agree with the sexist rhetoric that your son should "grow a pair" or "wear the pants in the family". Man or woman, your son is making a conscious decision that keeping the peace is more important than spending time with you. At this point he knows you'll keep trying to make things work, so he's not forced to make any changes. If I were in your shoes I'd do what others have suggested and just invite them over on Christmas Eve with the rest of the family. If they don't make the effort to come, it's on them not you. Having a grandson in the mix definitely complicates matters as you'll have to find other means to keep that relationship open.

I suspect the harsh reality is your son just doesn't care that much about visiting his family during the holidays. It sounds like you've gone above and beyond to try to foster a relationship, but it's now time to take a step back and let things balance out?

Whether male or female I would have said to grow a pair. But I do agree with the stepping back.

This goes beyond holidays and is truly sad. It seems like any event that involves his family is a no go. I would simply try and find a way to ensure that you spend time with your grandson outside of the holidays whenever possible. I'd leave the door open and he is always welcome but I wouldn't revolve anything around his family nor would I become a bank. The grandma situation would have been it for me but the quiting of the jobs to "save" would be the nail in the coffin for this level of insanity.

 

[b2bailey]

This has been an emotional roller coaster just reading it, can't imagine having to live it. That being said, very few have dared to wonder...' What is she (DIL) thinking?

Any possibility she has a mental/emotional issue regarding some form of social anxiety? Could there be some religious conflict?

I'm in the boatload that says -- do the best you can, and don't do it if it doesn't feel good in your gut. Or...' to thine own self be true'.

Don't know if you are a prayerful person, but I'd have to be asking for help daily with this one.

 

[VacationForever]

It is going to sound harsh, but he bears alot of responsibility with the current situation. Saying that by not showing up at family's events is because he wants to make peace at home is not good enough.

There are many self-centered and manipulative DILs or SILs out there. She is definitely one of them. But he chose her, married her and stay with her, knowing what she is like. He chose her over his family. OP needs to accept it and shield herself from further hurt.

 

[VegasBella]

I think you need to have a frank conversation with your son and daughter-in-law, preferably together, to talk this through. There could be reasons you haven't considered because you're looking at this from your own perspective. It doesn't seem like you're trying to see things from your son or DIL's perspectives.

I also doubt that she expects you to buy everything on that list. I could be wrong but usually a wishlist doesn't mean you expect all of them, it's a list to choose from. The list - and the conversation you and she had about it - also suggests that they don't feel close to you. Unless you asked for a list, I suspect the list comes from a place of 'if I don't give her a list she will give us an offensive gift.' I am guessing she doesn't make a list for her family.

Are they a different religion than you? Different political values? Different philosophical values? Maybe something happened in the past?

Or... one of the family members who is present at these holidays has done something offensive/mean to the DIL - is it possible that they want to see you but not one/some of the rest of the family that also shows up on these holidays? And that's why they want to come on the 23rd, perhaps a day they expect that this/these other family member(s) won't be there?

Why are the specific holiday days so important to YOU? What's wrong with visiting on the 23rd? Who said you had to cook?

Have you expressed your feelings to them? Do they know this actually hurts your feelings? Or is all this expressed passive-aggressively through stingy gift-giving etc?

Maybe it's better to simply be thankful for all you have and to try to celebrate the season with generosity, forgiveness, charity, peace...

 

[Jan M.]

My husband's oldest brother is like your son. He goes along to get along with his wife and always has for the over 50 years they have been married. His wife is very controlling. When my MIL was alive she would ask me to go with her to visit them as they lived several states way. My job was to visit with my SIL and distract her so when my MIL took her evening walks my BIL could go with her and they could talk. My SIL would get mad if he seemed to be enjoying talking to his own mother too much and they could talk unsupervised by the SIL on the walks. My MIL liked to take walks and would let on that she was unsure about walking by herself in an area she didn't know so he had an excuse to accompany her. How pathetic is that?

On the way home from one of our trips my MIL was so upset with her oldest son's lack of backbone and tired of worrying that my SIL wouldn't allow her to see her son, their two children and her great grandchildren anymore. She was determined to cut him out of her will as she wanted his wife to get nothing. This wasn't the first time this had come up but this time I could tell she wasn't going to get over it and really meant to do it. This was the only time I ever had heated words with my MIL. My husband and his sister were the executors on her will and I flat out told her that my husband would never do that to his brother even if they had never been particularly close. She wanted me to persuade my husband to do what she wanted and I refused. I told her even if I agreed with her that it would cause him to lose respect for me if I asked him to do something against one of his family. When I got home I told my husband that I had lost my temper with his mother and what was said. He said that was fine with him if she replaced him as an executor, that I was right that he would never do anything against one of his siblings. He talked to her and she did take him off but didn't disinherit his brother.

All of us in my husband's family have taken turns being on that SIL's list. She doesn't allow her husband or kids to talk to you when you are on her list. You wait it out, in a year or two reestablish communication and know there will be a next time. When I met our nephew's wife to be for the first time I could tell that she was too strong a person to allow herself to be ruled by my SIL. My husband's other siblings and their spouses remember me joking that this DIL will never drink the Kool Aid like the rest of that family do and all agreed with my assessment. This BIL and SIL have a daughter who is older than her brother, married and had kids sooner. My SIL has always run their family from the time they started dating in high school and this niece will be 50 years old next month! Sure enough the day came when my SIL cut off all communication with their son and his family and no one else was allowed to have anything to do with them. Our nephew's two early grade school aged children were devastated that their Grandpa wouldn't see or talk to them anymore. Our nephew was hurt even more so at being abandoned by his father. The men in my husbands family are wonderful with kids and my SIL was jealous of his closeness with those grandchildren. She did this to punish their son's wife figuring the DIL would come groveling to her. That didn't happen because their son refused to allow his wife to do that as she had always been very nice to his mother just not subservient enough to his mother to suit her. I have to say that we were quite surprised when we found out our nephew stood up to his mother and very, very proud of him.

After several years of estrangement this past Spring our nephew's wife invited his parents to dinner hoping to ease her husband's hurt. My SIL and BIL went and in turn invited them for Easter dinner. However our nephew's wife said it is clear that her husband and his father will never have the close relationship they previously had. In May our nephew and his family moved to another state for him to take a new job. I got the impression he sought out the job to move himself and his family away from his parents and sister. The pain of his father's betrayal still hurts that much.

My SIL has always made sure that no one could fault her when it comes to family obligations and say she isn't a good wife. When you are on her list, she will clearly give you the frozen treatment at a family gathering but she always insisted that they come to family gatherings when they were able to, even when money was tight for them to make the trip. Her issue is that she just has to be the one in control at all times and anyone that poses a threat to her absolute control gets eliminated. I earned my current spot on her list three years ago by asking about her son and his family at a family wedding they weren't able to make the trip to attend. At the time none of us knew what was going on with their son and his family but she saw my asking after them as a threat. The nice thing about this BIL and SIL living so far away is that none of us lose any sleep over being on her list and usually never even know nor care why we are on it. Earlier this year when I found out what was going on with their son and his wife I however knew exactly what I did to earn my spot.

Because of what my BIL allowed to happen with his own son and grandchildren I have come to bitterly regret intervening on his behalf when my MIL wanted to disinherit him. My husband and his two other brothers now all know about what transpired and all feel that their oldest brother is lower than a worm to treat his own son and grandchildren like that all just to keep peace with his wife. And that their father would be ashamed of him. My husband said you don't have to be the dominate partner in a marriage to call yourself a man but a real man doesn't abandon his parents, his siblings and most especially his own child at the whim of a woman.

My point in relating all of this is that our TUG friend's son could likely stay in this relationship just like my BIL. We've been assuming that the son is unhappy. He like my BIL may not be unhappy or not unhappy enough to leave. It is very sad to think that like my BIL he just doesn't care enough to prevent himself from ending up estranged from all of his family, maybe even his own son someday, because of his wife. Like my BIL it is his choice, he knows what is right he just can't bring himself to find the gumption to do it. The signs are all there. Remember he didn't attend his 87 year old grandmother's birthday dinner because his wife wouldn't like it. His wife should have said that he absolutely needed to go as at 87 you never know how much time she has left or if her mind will start to slip.

 

[Egret1986]

Maybe it's better to simply be thankful for all you have and to try to celebrate the season with generosity, forgiveness, charity, peace...

I have read through all the posts and feel that I must be in the minority in my feelings. I kind of feel sorry for the son and DIL to an extent. None of us know the whole story, including Mom. As the saying goes, there's two sides to every story. This is THEIR relationship, THEIR marriage.

I know that it would make me happier if my two sons did things more "my way", too. But I do everything in my power not to force my will on them. I know from my own experience the effects that this can have on one's self and well-being. It doesn't bring one closer. It brings on resentment and drives a wedge in the relationship.

From the outside looking in based on what's been shared, it would seem there's this terrible young man with no backbone (among other things) and a tyrannical young woman with no redeeming qualities.

Whether that's true or not, none of us know. To me, that's the saddest part of this whole thread...how these two people have been judged by all without knowing anything more than what a hurting Mom has posted. Sometimes, pain can mask reality. I'm not diminishing your hurt, Mom. It's very real. It's hard to let go of those precious ones that we raised. It hurts when we don't get what we want or expect from them. But give them the opportunity to fly free. Let them make their mistakes. Let them grow. Maybe the marriage will work, maybe it won't. That's for them to determine and not anyone else.

My Mom never believed my marriage would last and told my husband when we announced our engagement that her daughter wasn't going to support him. I think she finally realized, though never admitted to it, that I had married well and he was the best son-in-law she could have been blessed to have. We will celebrate 35 years of marriage this Christmas Eve......and they said it wouldn't last; ha!

You don't have to be their "bank". You don't have to jump through hoops for them. If you've done that in the past, that's on you. Maybe a missing a backbone is genetic.

As VegasBella stated, "...be thankful for all you have and try to celebrate the season with generosity, forgiveness, charity, peace...." It will be better for all!

Merry Christmas to all!

 

[Sugarcubesea]

This post needs a LOVE button. Such wisdom.

I agree, so many wise and loving folks on this forum...thank you all so much for helping me and suggesting ideas and thoughts for me to move forward...

All of you have showed me so much love and compassion, I just want you to know how much being a member of TUG means to me...

 

[Sugarcubesea]

This has been an emotional roller coaster just reading it, can't imagine having to live it. That being said, very few have dared to wonder...' What is she (DIL) thinking?

Any possibility she has a mental/emotional issue regarding some form of social anxiety? Could there be some religious conflict?

I'm in the boatload that says -- do the best you can, and don't do it if it doesn't feel good in your gut. Or...' to thine own self be true'.

Don't know if you are a prayerful person, but I'd have to be asking for help daily with this one.

My son has told me she suffers from anxiety. A few year's ago when I meet my DIL's grandmother (on the dad's side of the family), I was surprised to find out she even existed, she was not at the wedding, or the baby's baptism. She told me once her son married, she rarely saw them and she asked me if I would bring my grandson over to her so she could hold her great grandson. I realized at that moment this is what my life will look like. My DIL's dad is a very meek man that very rarely says more than two words. I think because my DIL grew up in a household that only did activities with the wife's side of the family this is what my DIL wants to do in her marriage.

I just need to continue to tell my son I will always love him and try to carve out time with my grandson during non-holidays...

 

[Sugarcubesea]

It is going to sound harsh, but he bears alot of responsibility with the current situation. Saying that by not showing up at family's events is because he wants to make peace at home is not good enough.

There are many self-centered and manipulative DILs or SILs out there. She is definitely one of them. But he chose her, married her and stay with her, knowing what she is like. He chose her over his family. OP needs to accept it and shield herself from further hurt.

I agree 100%, I actually do not blame my DIL but rather I blame my son, he is making the choice to NOT be with his family and his extended family. He needs to decide if he wants to have this life and if he wants to see his family.

 

[jackio]

I just need to continue to tell my son I will always love him and try to carve out time with my grandson during non-holidays...

Unfortunately, this is all you can do at this point. Coming to terms with this will be healthy for you. I am sorry it has to be this way for you, but I hope that you can come through it with peace in your heart .

 

[Patri]

DIL may actually be very lonely, and tired of running things. It can be exhausting. So she falls back on her parents. Do son and DIL have healthy outside interests and friends?
The whole situation is sad.

 

[ace2000]

Different perspective here, but in our situation our son-in-law's parents own a restaurant. Unless we decide to travel together, they always go to the in-laws for Christmas AND Thanksgiving, since the restaurant is closed on holidays.

We adapt and make another off day our time to celebrate - usually the day before or the day after. It's really not so bad. It took my wife a few years to accept, but at this point it doesn't phase us a bit.

 

[klpca]

I just need to continue to tell my son I will always love him and try to carve out time with my grandson during non-holidays...

This is the part where you have control (not that anyone - other than DIL - is trying to control anything). Hallmark etc, hype up the holidays - a lot - and in the process amplify any situation where you are outside of the "norm" for holiday get togethers. Christmas is a holiday, but really it is just another day. There are 364 other ones, equally good for seeing family. In my husbands family, we have driven 6 hours round trip for every Easter, half the Christmases, and probably 1/3 of the Thanksgivings. My in laws all live in the same community so it has always been expected that *we* will drive. I have hosted a few holidays over the years, but his family won't make the drive any more because of the traffic. (We know all about the holiday traffic!) That's how things went until 18 months ago, when my husband was diagnosed with cancer - stage 3 - and then had a heart attack - on Easter no less. Since then we have started meeting his family halfway between our homes at a park or restaurant about every six weeks to celebrate birthdays. It has been the best time ever. It is so relaxed and everyone gets a chance to visit. They still want us on the holidays too, but the drive is a bit much for my husband, so for now it's just birthdays. It has been surprisingly delightful.

I am truly sorry that you have to go through this, especially that it affects your happiness during the holidays. Hopefully as your grandson gets older, you will be able to find some holiday activities that can be special just for the two of you. I still have the fondest memories of shopping with my grandma (lol - that was her thing!) and of us going into the Sees Candy store to pick out some special chocolates. To this day, I can tell you what her favorites were. She made me feel special on those shopping trips. My grandmother was the calm person in my life during my childhood. Maybe you can be that person for your grandson.

 

[lizap]

Unfortunately, this is all you can do at this point. Coming to terms with this will be healthy for you. I am sorry it has to be this way for you, but I hope that you can come through it with peace in your heart .

You could also communicate to your son how you feel about this situation..

 

[lvhmbh]

If you read back in OP's posts you will see that she DID make alternate plans. She asked what they wanted to do and spent the money on the tickets for it. They cancelled the night before. OP's son didn't go to his 87 year old G-Mother's birthday????? and we should "give him a break". I would just make sure my G-son knew I love him, continue to give him Christmas presents and let it go. When speaking with my son I would tell him I love him, will always be there for him but I'm tired of these "games". And tell him the next move is his. I would also tell him that there is no money, so please don't bother to come to us for it - we're planning our retirement. JMHO - good luck!

 

[Talent312]

... I thought my DW's family - the feuding Bradburns of Knoxville (4 siblings) - was dysfunctional.
One brother+sister are not talking to the other brother+sister, and one brother+sister are not talking.
Once a year, when we go to visit, we try to figure out who can be in the same room.


.

 

[elaine]

In this situation, I would not have a talk with anyone. No good will come of it and it willl likely only get worse.
Ask them what day works for them and then get some food that can go straight to the freezer if needed. Don’t ever buy any event tickets until they show up on designated date for a few years. But plan something fun. A new game, decorating cookies or gingerbread house.
This is his wife and family now. You are extended family. Don’t make him choose or feel uncomfortable. He already chose. Life’s not perfect. maybe she’ll come around in a few years. maybe not.
It’s hard to let go and let kids make poor decisions. Also in that camp myself.agreee with lvhmbj Elaine

 

[lizap]

In this situation, I would not have a talk with anyone. No good will come of it and it willl likely only get worse.
Ask them what day works for them and then get some food that can go straight to the freezer if needed. Don’t ever buy any event tickets until they show up on designated date for a few years. But plan something fun. A new game, decorating cookies or gingerbread house.
This is his wife and family now. You are extended family. Don’t make him choose or feel uncomfortable. He already chose. Life’s not perfect. maybe she’ll come around in a few years. maybe not.
It’s hard to let go and let kids make poor decisions. Also in that camp myself.agreee with lvhmbj Elaine

When we married, we became part of each other's family. We both love our in-laws. Marrying, in no way, should mean that you have to disavow your mom and dad. It is important to discuss things like this with your spouse-to-be before you marry so that you will know his/her feelings. Neither one of us would have ever considered marrying someone who disliked our families and tried to stop us from seeing them; you marry a person but, in a sense, you also are marrying into a family... To expect most adults to cut ties with their families is very unrealistic and problematic and frankly unhealthy for the vast majority of marriages.. now, if the adult child wants nothing to do with his parents, that's another issue..

 

[elaine]

Totally concur. But wife and child is his nuclear family. Per my prior posts, I cannnot imagine not having dh’s families as part of ours or versa.
But OP’s adult child is following his wife’s lead. Other than offering to get together and saying you miss them, you cannot force it. Again. My prior post of what’s wrong with people. I wonder if this is a Millennial thing of just doing what one wants or feels good for them? Not saying all Ms are like that. I’ve got a great one.