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Marriott’s Response to My Letter on Our Cancelled Exchange & How They View Exchanges

windje2000

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I'm not on here to further aggravate owners, so please take it down a notch or 2 in your defensiveness & rudeness towards me. I'll be happy to clarify as much as I can.... but...Wow!!! You are a very angry person SueDonJ, you are the one who makes these "encounters" distasteful...You obviously know everything and don't need my help. Curious Sue why haven't you called the company and gotten the "official" down low, and posted your official response from MVW? You think I am condescending & dismissive? Why, because I am giving you answers you dislike! I in no way have been condescending & dismissive. Straight forward, yes! You owners have the ability to pick up the phone and call to get answers to your questions. If the person on the phone doesn't know the answer, ask to speak to someone who does know. Email - owner.services@vacationclub.com. Interval decided what they were going to cancel, it wasn't just an II mass cancellations that occurred. MVC had to make a decisions to keep owners safe, a HURRICANE was coming, they closed the resorts! Everyone got canceled. Did you know that weeks owners lost their week if they didn't have travel protection? II wouldn't take any deposits. Do you have any idea how many weeks owners who did NOT get ANY compensations? There was no secret behind the scene swapping going on. Everyone lost out and unfortunately it was horrible and sad to say the least!

It's very obvious that you are all confused.

windje2000 - QUOTE=Those of us who are DC members who don't elect points should be aware of the fact that we are no longer members of II.
This is an incorrect statement. If you are enrolled into the Destinations Program you are a member of II. Why are you under the impression that you are no longer a member of II if you don't elect points? Your II account isn't through the Destinations Program it's still through II. Even if you never decide to use II, you still have an active paid account with Interval, that you could use if you wanted. There is no such thing as the....DClub Exchange inventory, including DClub II inventory. This doesn't exist. When owners 'Elect' their weeks for DP that is what frees up inventory for DP.

There's a reason for the existence of the 'corporate account' and the fact that all DC members had to change from their old accounts to new ones.[/QUOTE]
The only reason you get a new II account called a 'corporate account' is so you aren't charged the $139 exchange fee if you go to another Marriott. If you use your II account and you have deposits in your II account that are pre-destinations then those deposits are still charged the $139 exchange fee. Once those deposits are used, then your old II account is canceled and not active any more. That is the only reason for issuing a new II #.

The yearly club dues that you pay each year covers your Interval account. It is still an Interval account and it is no different than your Interval account that you had pre-destinations, you just get a new II number, and now you don't pay the $139 exchange fee if you go to another Marriott. You have access to exactly the same inventory that any other Owner has who uses II as their exchange company, regardless if it is a pre-destinations, or you pay for your own II account, or you aren't in the DP program...it's all the same Interval account.

Most likely... the reason in the slow process with II deposits is due to the date you are choosing to deposit with II. How many of you know how to look at the TDI on the resort you own on Intervalworld.com? Do you know how to decide what date to pick? Do you even know how to use II? Had an owner 2 days ago who has a Platinum GV and wants to go to Cypress Dec 8, 2017. I get a hold of II lock off his GV ask if he can get a 2BR at CY with his 1 BR... yes it is available and because it was within 59 days there was no upgrade fee. This owner got a 2 BR at Cypress Harbour with his 1 BR at GV.

You all want something official from MVW so call up and get it. Ask questions, but don't be angry with me because you don't like my responses. You can either take the information I am giving and put it to use, or go about your day and ignore it.

I have no direct contractual relationship with II. Contracts require something called consideration, something which I have not paid to or otherwise provided II. My contract is with DClub. You seem to suggest that MVC is II's agent in offering these memberships, which would indeed provide the contractual nexus you allude to.

I may well be an indirect member of II through access via the 'corporate account' (MVC terminology, not mine) and, as you allege, may be subject to the same II rules and regulations as any direct member of II, but that ignores the fact that I am also

1. subject to the rules of DClub, and

2. subject to the contract or relationship between MVC and II regarding the 'corporate account.'

You allege that the only reason for the separate corporate account is to facilitate that payment of fees to the exchange company. Coding a field with some 'if this then that' ("ITTT") logic would be a much much simpler way of accomplishing exactly the same objective.

There is clearly another reason for partitioning the DClub II members from the remainder of II. What might that be?

The creation of a partitioned DClub II member and inventory pool facilitates management of the pool of Marriott occupancy deposited by DClub members.

You allege that indirect members of II have access to the same inventory as direct members. That may be true, but the question is whether or not both direct and indirect members of II are seeing only Marriott inventory that remains after DClub takes what it believes it is due from the occupancy deposited in the corporate account, or otherwise manages that pool for its own benefit.

What your post fails to address is the proposition that MVC considered its broad powers to engage in what I concluded my post with:

I am starting to wonder if the observation I made in that old post is exactly how MVC is justifying its behavior.

In other words,

1. DClub members are not members of II but rather members of DClub.

2. MVC has broad powers to manage DClub Exchange inventory, including DClub II inventory.

3. These broad powers provide MVC with the ability to consider the HHI resorts as a portfolio.

4. These broad powers allow MVC to manage DClub exchange reservations (including II reservations) between and among the various HHI resorts virtually any way they want to.

The only change I would make to these would be to use the term indirect or derivative in describing the II membership in item 1.

Finally, let me make this so clear that even you can understand it. Your remarks generally and regarding SueDonJ in particular are offensive, shed no light on the answers and simply serve to obfuscate the truth with bombastic argle bargle.
 

GregT

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Finally, let me make this so clear that even you can understand it. Your remarks generally and regarding SueDonJ in particular are offensive, shed no light on the answers and simply serve to obfuscate the truth with bombastic argle bargle.

I agree with Windje here - the comments on Sue are very odd (nicest word I can think of).

She is as fair and impartial as they come and not sure why she was attacked. She rocks and an invaluable member of our community. Let's all stay on point here.

Best,

Greg
 

JIMinNC

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GregT's experience that is discussed in this linked thread (https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php...-due-to-hurricane-damage.263771/#post-2062622) seems to show Marriott taking a rather non-accommodative position toward even a DP owner reservation, which seems to be a very different approach than the one we have discussed at length that they used last month in Hilton Head where - based on anecdotal evidence - they bent the rules to accommodate other HHI/DP owners over exchangers. But as I was thinking about that, something dawned on me:

While we have multiple statements made by resort staff at Grande Ocean that said guests from other resorts were accommodated last month at Grande Ocean, I don't recall that we have heard of a single specific situation where an owner using their ownership has been relocated from a damaged resort to a room at an open resort. (Is this correct or did I miss a specific example?) We do have multiple examples of Encore package guests being accommodated in partially open resorts in Hilton Head and Palm Beach. We even have one example from my original Grande Ocean thread where windje2000 was expressly told that his mid-September Monarch reservation would not be relocated to Grande Ocean. Marriott Customer Advocacy also consistently denied that owners were relocated in HHI.

So what if, in reality, no owners using their ownership at other HHI resorts were accommodated at Grande Ocean last month? What if what Customer Advocacy said was factually accurate? What if the only reservations relocated from other HHI resorts were cash stays, Encore stays (also cash), and maybe Rewards Points? Then, what the GO front desk staff said would be true (guests were relocated to GO from other HHI resorts), as would be the statements made by Customer Advocacy (none of them were using ownership at other HHI resorts). What if MVW made the decision to maximize revenue by not cancelling their cash reservations and instead cancelled the II exchanges at the relatively less damaged resorts (Grande Ocean, Surf Watch, etc.) so they would have the space to accommodate all of the cash/Encore reservations from Barony, Monarch, Harbor Point, Harbour Club, Heritage Club, etc.? In this scenario, all of the comments about setting up an informal exchange system would be moot, and the question/narrative would shift to their rights to cancel bonafide II exchanges to accommodate cash guests.

I realize this is just more speculation - but given the lack of transparency at MVC - speculation is all we have.
 
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SueDonJ

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I'm not on here to further aggravate owners, so please take it down a notch or 2 in your defensiveness & rudeness towards me. I'll be happy to clarify as much as I can.... but...Wow!!! You are a very angry person SueDonJ, you are the one who makes these "encounters" distasteful...You obviously know everything and don't need my help. Curious Sue why haven't you called the company and gotten the "official" down low, and posted your official response from MVW? You think I am condescending & dismissive? Why, because I am giving you answers you dislike! I in no way have been condescending & dismissive. Straight forward, yes! You owners have the ability to pick up the phone and call to get answers to your questions. If the person on the phone doesn't know the answer, ask to speak to someone who does know. Email - owner.services@vacationclub.com. Interval decided what they were going to cancel, it wasn't just an II mass cancellations that occurred. MVC had to make a decisions to keep owners safe, a HURRICANE was coming, they closed the resorts! Everyone got canceled. Did you know that weeks owners lost their week if they didn't have travel protection? II wouldn't take any deposits. Do you have any idea how many weeks owners who did NOT get ANY compensations? There was no secret behind the scene swapping going on. Everyone lost out and unfortunately it was horrible and sad to say the least!

It's very obvious that you are all confused.

windje2000 - QUOTE=Those of us who are DC members who don't elect points should be aware of the fact that we are no longer members of II.
This is an incorrect statement. If you are enrolled into the Destinations Program you are a member of II. Why are you under the impression that you are no longer a member of II if you don't elect points? Your II account isn't through the Destinations Program it's still through II. Even if you never decide to use II, you still have an active paid account with Interval, that you could use if you wanted. There is no such thing as the....DClub Exchange inventory, including DClub II inventory. This doesn't exist. When owners 'Elect' their weeks for DP that is what frees up inventory for DP.

There's a reason for the existence of the 'corporate account' and the fact that all DC members had to change from their old accounts to new ones.[/QUOTE]
The only reason you get a new II account called a 'corporate account' is so you aren't charged the $139 exchange fee if you go to another Marriott. If you use your II account and you have deposits in your II account that are pre-destinations then those deposits are still charged the $139 exchange fee. Once those deposits are used, then your old II account is canceled and not active any more. That is the only reason for issuing a new II #.

The yearly club dues that you pay each year covers your Interval account. It is still an Interval account and it is no different than your Interval account that you had pre-destinations, you just get a new II number, and now you don't pay the $139 exchange fee if you go to another Marriott. You have access to exactly the same inventory that any other Owner has who uses II as their exchange company, regardless if it is a pre-destinations, or you pay for your own II account, or you aren't in the DP program...it's all the same Interval account.

Most likely... the reason in the slow process with II deposits is due to the date you are choosing to deposit with II. How many of you know how to look at the TDI on the resort you own on Intervalworld.com? Do you know how to decide what date to pick? Do you even know how to use II? Had an owner 2 days ago who has a Platinum GV and wants to go to Cypress Dec 8, 2017. I get a hold of II lock off his GV ask if he can get a 2BR at CY with his 1 BR... yes it is available and because it was within 59 days there was no upgrade fee. This owner got a 2 BR at Cypress Harbour with his 1 BR at GV.

You all want something official from MVW so call up and get it. Ask questions, but don't be angry with me because you don't like my responses. You can either take the information I am giving and put it to use, or go about your day and ignore it.

All due respect, since you showed up here two weeks ago you haven't taught any of us anything that we haven't already learned through years of experience as owners and shared as members of TUG. Rather than berating us sarcastically by saying things like, "you obviously know everything and don't need my help," maybe you could spend a few hours reading through the forum posts for the last month or so to give you an idea of how knowledgeable we actually are. Honestly, I'm not saying that to antagonize you or to falsely inflate our self-importance, but because it's true. I am routinely surprised by the level of thought and expertise that many people share here, and incidentally so are the MVW reps at the exec level with whom I've discussed over the years items that have come up that are relevant to all owners.

At this point the TUG members who have been directly impacted by MVW's inventory management following the hurricanes are and have been in contact with MVW reps who, I'm guessing, are a pay grade or five above you. The rest of us aren't calling and demanding explanations for a few reasons, first is obviously that we're not personally affected and are well aware that MVW will not discuss this with us for that reason. Next is probably that we know the TUGgers who are involved will be happy to share with us, teach us, whatever share-able information they get from MVW. But beyond that and relative to this particular issue, we know that MVW has a history of not explaining inventory management as technically as we would like (which in all cases is understandable from their legal position but still maddening and frustrating from ours.) The people directly affected by this unprecedented inventory management issue aren't getting satisfaction; the rest of us know it would be an exercise in futility for us to try!

Personally, I'm not angry with you. I'm frustrated, sure, but not angry. It doesn't appear that you are actually reading the posts to which you're responding, actually trying to understand the issue and its complications. If you were, then you wouldn't be asking us if we, "even know how to use II" or trying to teach us about TDI. It's downright ridiculous that you have come away from this thread with the idea that what's in question are the basics of II membership/usage.

Finally, the fact that you're an MVW rep is not going to help you on TUG. You are more than welcome to stay, go, lurk, whatever ... but just like with every other person who participates on TUG, the useful information that you share will be appreciated and the questionable will be challenged. And, you will be expected to follow the TUG Posting Rules. That's how it works here, and it works very well.
 
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urfriend

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urfriend

“I'm not on here to further aggravate owners, so please take it down a notch or 2 in your defensiveness & rudeness towards me.”

“You obviously know everything and don't need my help.”

“It's very obvious that you are all confused.”

.....

You seem to have a very unique approach to offering “help” to many highly experienced owners, who also know and have regular dealings with both Owner Services and Customer Advocacy.
But... very obvious that although they may be experienced...they have no clue what they are ranting about regarding certain subjects.
 

bazzap

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But... very obvious that although they may be experienced...they have no clue what they are ranting about regarding certain subjects.
You are of course welcome to your opinion.
Personally, I find most TUG members comments demonstrate a very good understanding and in terms of ranting are far more balanced than some of your outbursts.
What has been asked quite a few times now, and I too would certainly welcome this, is a clear statement of and reference to the specific rules MVC have invoked in making recent decisions on cancellations and restricted replacement options.
 

Fasttr

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To my fellow TUGgers.... In my opinion, urfriend is an internet troll.

In Internet slang, a troll is a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting quarrels or upsetting people, by posting inflammatory,[1] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response [2] or of otherwise disrupting normal, on-topic discussion,[3] often for the troll's amusement

....and as such I have made a personal decision to ignore all future posts from urfriend.

Don't feed the troll.
 

klpca

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.
To my fellow TUGgers.... In my opinion, urfriend is an internet troll.

In Internet slang, a troll is a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting quarrels or upsetting people, by posting inflammatory,[1] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response [2] or of otherwise disrupting normal, on-topic discussion,[3] often for the troll's amusement

....and as such I have made a personal decision to ignore all future posts from urfriend.

Don't feed the troll.
That thought had occurred to me as well. Methinks we may have been played.
 

SueDonJ

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I think s/he's exactly who s/he says s/he is, an MVW employee who thinks we're not giving him/her enough credit for the wealth of knowledge s/he's decided to bestow upon us.

:)

As moderator I'm giving this poster a little bit of leeway and time to read through the TUG Rules link provided and start following the rules, or be moderated. The reason being s/he had no clue how to find the sticky threads in the TUG Marriott forum, meaning s/he may not have found the TUG Rules sooner than this.
 

urfriend

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You are of course welcome to your opinion.
Personally, I find most TUG members comments demonstrate a very good understanding and in terms of ranting are far more balanced than some of your outbursts.
What has been asked quite a few times now, and I too would certainly welcome this, is a clear statement of and reference to the specific rules MVC have invoked in making recent decisions on cancellations and restricted replacement options.

Call owner services and request that information. 855-682-4847
 

urfriend

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I think s/he's exactly who s/he says s/he is, an MVW employee who thinks we're not giving him/her enough credit for the wealth of knowledge s/he's decided to bestow upon us.

:)

As moderator I'm giving this poster a little bit of leeway and time to read through the TUG Rules link provided and start following the rules, or be moderated. The reason being s/he had no clue how to find the sticky threads in the TUG Marriott forum, meaning s/he may not have found the TUG Rules sooner than this.
You're right I don't have no clue how to navigate here. I only joined 1 week ago
 

urfriend

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That thought had occurred to me as well. Methinks we may have been played.
well you both are wrong no troll here. I will chose not to respond to any more of you on this thread. Good luck
 

dioxide45

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GregT's experience that is discussed in this linked thread (https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php...-due-to-hurricane-damage.263771/#post-2062622) seems to show Marriott taking a rather non-accommodative position toward even a DP owner reservation, which seems to be a very different approach than the one we have discussed at length that they used last month in Hilton Head where - based on anecdotal evidence - they bent the rules to accommodate other HHI/DP owners over exchangers. But as I was thinking about that, something dawned on me:

While we have multiple statements made by resort staff at Grande Ocean that said guests from other resorts were accommodated last month at Grande Ocean, I don't recall that we have heard of a single specific situation where an owner using their ownership has been relocated from a damaged resort to a room at an open resort. (Is this correct or did I miss a specific example?) We do have multiple examples of Encore package guests being accommodated in partially open resorts in Hilton Head and Palm Beach. We even have one example from my original Grande Ocean thread where windje2000 was expressly told that his mid-September Monarch reservation would not be relocated to Grande Ocean. Marriott Customer Advocacy also consistently denied that owners were relocated in HHI.

So what if, in reality, no owners using their ownership at other HHI resorts were accommodated at Grande Ocean last month? What if what Customer Advocacy said was factually accurate? What if the only reservations relocated from other HHI resorts were cash stays, Encore stays (also cash), and maybe Rewards Points? Then, what the GO front desk staff said would be true (guests were relocated to GO from other HHI resorts), as would be the statements made by Customer Advocacy (none of them were using ownership at other HHI resorts). What if MVW made the decision to maximize revenue by not cancelling their cash reservations and instead cancelled the II exchanges at the relatively less damaged resorts (Grande Ocean, Surf Watch, etc.) so they would have the space to accommodate all of the cash/Encore reservations from Barony, Monarch, Harbor Point, Harbour Club, Heritage Club, etc.? In this scenario, all of the comments about setting up an informal exchange system would be moot, and the question/narrative would shift to their rights to cancel bonafide II exchanges to accommodate cash guests.

I realize this is just more speculation - but given the lack of transparency at MVC - speculation is all we have.
Not sure that them potentially setting up an internal exchange program discussion would still be moot. For every week that is reserved, there is underlying ownership. Remembers, these are timeshare first and MVC only turns them in to quasi hotels because they do cash rentals.

In either case, it is quite possible that you are absolutely correct. Perhaps they only moved cash and Encore guests from other properties. As you say, we don't have any first hand or even second hand knowledge from an actual owner staying on an owner stay that had their weeks reservation moved to a different resort. If it is indeed true, I guess we do see where Marriott places its owners in the grand scheme of things. Are they meeting their fiduciary responsibility as the management company if they did indeed do as you say? Are our HOAs meeting theirs by allowing Marriott to do this?
 

Dean

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Call owner services and request that information. 855-682-4847
Do you really believe that owner services has this information. At best their going to have the talking points given to them which are worthless at this point. As I noted previously, there are those here that have gone FAR higher than that and gotten little more than boilerplate responses if even that. While I personally think the choices of what MVC did were reasonable, they certainly have left a lot on the table as to communication, consistency and honesty. And since you haven't posted a "formal" explanation, I'm assuming you don't have the info either and thus I suspect you're assuming that owner services actually has real information as well when it appears they do not.
 

heathpack

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Wow @urfriend... reflecting so well on MVC. Total cringe.
 

JIMinNC

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I mentioned this in passing in a comment in another thread since it was relevant there, but since this is the continuation of the discussion I started about our HHI/Irma saga, I thought I would post this here too in order to give positive credit to the folks at II who helped make it happen - and to the TUGgers who helped in suggesting places we should look at for a late fall 2018 trip (really our only available window for next year).

Overnight last night, our replacement week that we got from II after the HHI Irma cancellation matched for a 2BR at Marriott's Desert Springs I in Palm Desert for mid-November 2018. While Palm Desert wasn't originally a priority for our travels next year, it's still somewhere we would like to try, and given our limited travel options for next year due to already planned trips, I consider it a win to get this with the replacement week. Thanks again to Mark DelCampo at II for helping to make the best of a bad situation - which is more than I can say for MVC, given the experiences Superchief, windje2000, and I had, and now GregT is experiencing. While I agree with some some of the comments that MVC may have had some constraints in their ability to provide acceptable restitution, I still think their lack of communication, lack of transparency, and overall lack of a customer-sensitive approach to their Irma response does not reflect well on the company. II, on the other hand, distinguished themselves in responding to a situation that was not of their own making.
 

VacationForever

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I mentioned this in passing in a comment in another thread since it was relevant there, but since this is the continuation of the discussion I started about our HHI/Irma saga, I thought I would post this here too in order to give positive credit to the folks at II who helped make it happen - and to the TUGgers who helped in suggesting places we should look at for a late fall 2018 trip (really our only available window for next year).

Overnight last night, our replacement week that we got from II after the HHI Irma cancellation matched for a 2BR at Marriott's Desert Springs I in Palm Desert for mid-November 2018. While Palm Desert wasn't originally a priority for our travels next year, it's still somewhere we would like to try, and given our limited travel options for next year due to already planned trips, I consider it a win to get this with the replacement week. Thanks again to Mark DelCampo at II for helping to make the best of a bad situation - which is more than I can say for MVC, given the experiences Superchief, windje2000, and I had, and now GregT is experiencing. While I agree with some some of the comments that MVC may have had some constraints in their ability to provide acceptable restitution, I still think their lack of communication, lack of transparency, and overall lack of a customer-sensitive approach to their Irma response does not reflect well on the company. II, on the other hand, distinguished themselves in responding to a situation that was not of their own making.
Glad you managed to make lemonade out of lemons. You will enjoy DSV I and it is not a lemon by any means.
 

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398
I mentioned this in passing in a comment in another thread since it was relevant there, but since this is the continuation of the discussion I started about our HHI/Irma saga, I thought I would post this here too in order to give positive credit to the folks at II who helped make it happen - and to the TUGgers who helped in suggesting places we should look at for a late fall 2018 trip (really our only available window for next year).

Overnight last night, our replacement week that we got from II after the HHI Irma cancellation matched for a 2BR at Marriott's Desert Springs I in Palm Desert for mid-November 2018. While Palm Desert wasn't originally a priority for our travels next year, it's still somewhere we would like to try, and given our limited travel options for next year due to already planned trips, I consider it a win to get this with the replacement week. Thanks again to Mark DelCampo at II for helping to make the best of a bad situation - which is more than I can say for MVC, given the experiences Superchief, windje2000, and I had, and now GregT is experiencing. While I agree with some some of the comments that MVC may have had some constraints in their ability to provide acceptable restitution, I still think their lack of communication, lack of transparency, and overall lack of a customer-sensitive approach to their Irma response does not reflect well on the company. II, on the other hand, distinguished themselves in responding to a situation that was not of their own making.
I am glad for you that Mark DelCampo at II found a solution for you.

Mid November is normally a nice time to be in the desert and the DSVI is a great resort next to the JW Marriott Desert Springs Resort & Spa. Plenty of golf courses around and a good choice of restaurants too. There is a lot to see plus there is the Palm Springs Air Museum that may interest you. We used to own here but still go back because we like the desert and love to visit Joshua Tree National Park. An amazing photography site and many activities too. We took a basic course in rock climbing here with the Sierra Club.

I still hope that GregT will also get something for his points. The insurance isn't worth the paper it is written on because of that clause about the 30 day limit so now we know.

We booked an Encore package recently and I asked them if we could insure it but the lady at the desk didn't know so I signed up but told her that I would cancel it if I found out the next business day that it couldn't be insured because it was for March 2019. It was way too early to book it yet but the Big Island was included.

I found out that Encore Packages cannot be insured either so I rescinded by FAX well within the rescission period and I asked them to confirm it by email or in the mail but I heard nothing.

I waited a long time on the phone and got transferred several times and then we got disconnected so had to call again. They had received the FAX and they cannot confirm by email or in any other way that it is cancelled. Our credit card was charged so had to call them again but they had received the FAX and reversed the charge immediately. No problem with that.

Now you know that Encore Packages are not eligible to buy insurance for nor does our yearly insurance policy insure them either nor our timeshare stays but we knew that. Our yearly policy does insure us for hurricanes but I haven't read the fine print so it may not be much better either. By the time that you receive the policy, it may be too late to cancel.
 
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