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New Points Borrowing Policy?

Discussion in 'Wyndham Vacation Resorts' started by carlbarry, Jul 11, 2019.

  1. carlbarry

    carlbarry Guest

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    I went on-line to book Nashville for November 3. Cost would be 28,000 points. I have 12,000 remaining this year, so I'd have to borrow from next year.
    When I clicked on "book" I got a message that I don't have enough points.
    I called Wyndham and was told that if I'm borrowing points, I have to book within 3 months of the reservation; so I have to wait until August.
    I don't remember this ever happening to me before. I'm an owner since 2008.
    Is this just a new way for Wyndham to screw owners?
     
  2. paxsarah

    paxsarah TUG Member

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    This has always been true of borrowing points (at least as long as the 9 years I've owned). However, prior to the changes in May of 2017, it was possible to essentially use the Credit Pool as a tool for borrowing longer than 3 months prior to check in - you could pool a future year's points and use those points immediately. That is no longer possible.
     
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  3. Richelle

    Richelle TUG Member

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    You could pool points, prior to the start of the use year. VIPs has longer to do that. Otherwise, if you missed your deadline, they would have had to wait until 3 months from to borrow. I know that you know this. I only bring up that distinction, in case they were not aware of it.


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  4. Richelle

    Richelle TUG Member

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    This is from the 2014 directory. It clearly states 90 days out. Yeah, they are really trying to screw you over by letting you borrow points for free.


    IMG_3901.jpg


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    Last edited: Jul 11, 2019
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  5. paxsarah

    paxsarah TUG Member

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    At the risk of being blocked here like I’ve been on Facebook ;) this hasn’t changed. You can still only rent to cover the last night in the standard booking window, not borrow. Borrowing is still only within the express window, no matter how few points you need.
     
  6. Richelle

    Richelle TUG Member

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    Doh! I’ll delete that part. Don’t want to contribute to the misinformation. Thanks.


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  7. Richelle

    Richelle TUG Member

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    Oh, and (if you are who I think you are), I blocked you for a reason. I will discuss it with you more if you want to send me a PM.


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  8. capital city

    capital city TUG Member

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    Damn Richelle, you blocked Paxsarah? I've never seen them say anything out of line. Not trying to jump in the middle but have to say that's really surprising.
     
  9. Richelle

    Richelle TUG Member

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    But you are jumping in the middle of it. It is not your business or concern. I told her she could PM me if she wanted to know why. I am more then willing to talk to her about it. There was a reason I did say why publicly. It’s because it’s between us and no one else. Mind your own business.


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  10. ecwinch

    ecwinch Moderator

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    [Mod Note: In the interest of friendly discourse, I would like to ask that disagreements on other platforms not be dragged onto TUG. It makes for a very disjointed conversation that just leads to confusion and really has nothing to do with TUG. To paraphrase....Render unto Facebook, the things that are Facebook’s...

    Thanks for your consideration in this matter.]
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2019
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  11. ronparise

    ronparise TUG Member

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    what would happen if you made a reservation 90 days ahead of check in, at some random resort with borrowed points; hold that reservation for a day or so, and then cancel? Would the "cancelled" points be available to make the the reservation you really want, or would the points go back into the year you borrowed them from?
     
  12. dgalati

    dgalati TUG Member

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    That's the Ron I know. Always looking for a angle. LOL
     
  13. capital city

    capital city TUG Member

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    I may be wrong but I think we have found that points actually go back where they came from. Which is why I dont understand why they are still realigning contracts
     
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  14. dgalati

    dgalati TUG Member

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    Wyndham is out right taking points from owners when realigning contracts and not prorating points
     
  15. Richelle

    Richelle TUG Member

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    That’s exactly why I said she could message me privately, when she mentioned it.


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  16. bnoble

    bnoble TUG Member

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    But by telling them that in a public post, you invited comment. Welcome to my ignore list.
     
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  17. Baby Jane

    Baby Jane Guest

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    When they aligned ours several years ago they gave us 250000 to move it from October to January. We have exactly a million.
     
  18. Sandi Bo

    Sandi Bo TUG Member

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    And when they aligned ours, which at that time was almost all developer points, 1.4M with an April-March use year THEY DID NOT OFFER ANY PRORATED POINTED (didn't finish my sentence - edited 7/13).

    What happens to points that Wyndham chooses to take back? Grrrr.

    Yes, I can confirm that (points are returned where they came from). Also, haven't done it, but if you rent points now, and then cancel, the points are taken back and money is refunded.

    And they still don't always realign contracts. <3 Wyndham and their consistency. I don't see an advantage in having multiple use years anymore, other than some of us have lost out in the deal (others have not). You can end up paying multiple point deposit fees if you had points tied up in a reservation and then cancel it.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2019
  19. paxsarah

    paxsarah TUG Member

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    This was entirely my fault. I should have kept my snarky aside off the forums. Not my finest moment.
     
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  20. dgalati

    dgalati TUG Member

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    Yes that was the past to prorate and was fair to the Owner. Now Wyndham realigns and does not prorate. You can see how this helps Wyndham. Think about if you had a April use year with 1 million points and it wasn't prorated. that would be a 750,000 plus for Wyndham by pushing 9 months of use to the next year. Most owners may never have this happen but it is a big amount of points that are being taken from owners. When it does happen you pay maintenance fees on the points that are not available because of the realignment.
     
  21. Richelle

    Richelle TUG Member

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    I probably could have phrased that better. It was only meant to be temporary. I completely forgot until you brought it up. Sorry about that. Now I cannot seem to find out how to unblock you. I’ll figure it out.


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  22. paxsarah

    paxsarah TUG Member

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    It's all good. :)
     
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  23. carlbarry

    carlbarry Guest

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    The are NOT letting us "borrow points for free." They are points we've paid for in advance to get a discount. How is it free if we purchased a timeshare, and then pay maintenance fees? And by the way, I also own DVC, and they have no such policy--and no other Wyndham rip-off policies like housekeeping points and reservation fees.
     
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  24. Richelle

    Richelle TUG Member

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    First, that is something they can easily charge a fee for but don’t. The service of letting you borrow is free. Your points are tied to physical inventory. You cannot take physical inventory from next year and use it this year. Those points you borrow have to come from inventory this year. Those points you borrowed are coming from Wyndham’s allotment. So they are letting you borrow from their allotment and using your points next year in return. The resources needed to support the process of keeping track of it all, cost money. Especially with a timeshare system of hundreds of thousands of owners. I’m not sure how familiar you are with the costs if IT, but the more processes they add, the more money it costs. The bigger the system, the more expensive it is to maintain.

    Second, you can not compare DVC to Wyndham in that regard. Quality of rooms, and resorts, sure. But when it comes to the systems and their business models, what works for a small program like Disney, would not work for a system that is much bigger. Just like what works for an even smaller program like Vacation Villages, would work for Disney. Disney has 14 locations, Wyndham has 224. Disney has 4,000 suites. Wyndham has 25,000. Because Disney is smaller, it’s a lot less complicated. Fewer locations to manage and less inventory to keep track off. Less owners as well. Their costs are less. When they get bigger, they will start racking on fees, or maybe they will just pad the extra costs into the maintenance fees. That’s pretty much their business model. Make every one pay the same maintenance fees, even if they don’t use as many resources like housekeeping or the booking system, as other owners. At least on Wyndham’s business model, you’re not paying for things you don’t use. They could give every one unlimited housekeeping and reservation transaction credits, but then our program fee would be higher. Wyndham is not perfect by any means, but their current business model means, I’m not paying to clean someone else’s room. I’m paying for someone to clean mine. It keeps my costs lower when everyone pays for their own usage. If you don’t like how they operate, you always have the option to turn it back into Wyndham through Ovations. That’s assuming you didn’t finance it, and are still paying on it. No sense in sticking with something you don’t like. Just stop comparing how Wyndham operates, to how DVC operates because it’s comparing apples and oranges. Comparing Wyndham to Diamond would make more sense because they are similar in Size. Marriott has fewer locations which keeps some costs low, and makes it easier to maintain the resorts, but they have close to the same amount of units. So that might sense to compare them to Marriott too.


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  25. carlbarry

    carlbarry Guest

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    Disney does charge different MF for the different resorts. Also, Disney has an image to maintain, so does not have their sales force hammering people over the head, nor would they ever nickel and dime owners like Wyndham does.
    My Wyndham TS cost me $100, so I didn't finance. I get my money's worth from it. But it doesn't mean that the level of service Wyndham offers its owners compares to what Disney does.
     

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