Renting a "Home Resort" and impact of combining/banking SO from multiple mandatory resorts

[DeniseM]

Yes. I am not speaking for myself but someone else who is a victim of this.

VacationForever: Please clarify - are you saying that you personally know someone who was TURNED AWAY AT CHECK-IN, at a Vistana resort, because they rented a Staroption reservation???

This would be very surprising because:

-Vistana already said that they would deal with this issue with the OWNER, and they would not punish guests.

-The front desk doesn't get involved in this.

-Long before this point, the owner would be notified that his reservation was cancelled.

-It's never been reported on TUG.

 

[YYJMSP]

So, let's introduce another wrinkle to interpretations.

What about if I grab a dozen units using SO's from all over the place (some from the resort in question, some not) and then invite all of my direct relatives and their extended families to come along? There's some verbiage in the CCRs about not being allowed to "rent for commercial purposes" or something along those lines (i.e. you cannot use the bookings as part of something that is effectively a vacation rental business).

I feel fine with charging them for my costs, as 1) they are all coming with me not at some random time on their own, 2) they are all part of my vacation as I am there with them, and 3) I am not renting as a business venture to strangers they're basically all my relatives. I believe this isn't quite the letter of the law, but within the intents of some vagueness in those rules, as this usage is an extension of my vacation plans.

 

[VacationForever]

VacationForever: Please clarify - are you saying that you personally know someone who was TURNED AWAY AT CHECK-IN, at a Vistana resort, because they rented a Staroption reservation???

This would be very surprising because:

-Vistana already said that they would deal with this issue with the OWNER, and they would not punish guests.

-The front desk doesn't get involved in this.

-Long before this point, the owner would be notified that his reservation was cancelled.

-It's never been reported on TUG.

It is hypothetical.

 

[Helios]

VacationForever: Please clarify - are you saying that you personally know someone who was TURNED AWAY AT CHECK-IN, at a Vistana resort, because they rented a Staroption reservation???

This would be very surprising because:

-Vistana already said that they would deal with this issue with the OWNER, and they would not punish guests.

-The front desk doesn't get involved in this.

-Long before this point, the owner would be notified that his reservation was cancelled.

-It's never been reported on TUG.

I thought he said he would be upset if it happened to him, not that it had actually happened to him.

 

[Helios]

It is hypothetical.

I should have read to the end of the thread. Sorry.

 

[DeniseM]

This was confusing to me:

Yes. I am not speaking for myself but someone else who is a victim of this.

Someone else who IS a victim, doesn't sound hypothetical.

 

[Helios]

So, let's introduce another wrinkle to interpretations.

What about if I grab a dozen units using SO's from all over the place (some from the resort in question, some not) and then invite all of my direct relatives and their extended families to come along? There's some verbiage in the CCRs about not being allowed to "rent for commercial purposes" or something along those lines (i.e. you cannot use the bookings as part of something that is effectively a vacation rental business).

I feel fine with charging them for my costs, as 1) they are all coming with me not at some random time on their own, 2) they are all part of my vacation as I am there with them, and 3) I am not renting as a business venture to strangers they're basically all my relatives. I believe this isn't quite the letter of the law, but within the intents of some vagueness in those rules, as this usage is an extension of my vacation plans.

There you go, one more unclear scenario...I would think that is against the rules if you are making a profit (1 or more cents from MF) renting to friends or family. But, how can Vistana prove you made said profit...

 

[Helios]

Someone in the HGVC forum used the term "renting to new friends". How about those...

 

[Helios]

Out of curiosity, what would happen if someone reaches out to Vistana/Suzanne Clark and ask the question directly?

After all, we are just providing our thoughts which are not Vistana's position.

 

[DeniseM]

how can Vistana prove you made said profit

Remember - At this point, Vistana is in "don't ask - don't tell" mode. Vistana has no contact with guests, and doesn't even have a way to contact them - they don't want to know.

If YYJMSP calls them and says he's having a family reunion and needs 10 guest confirmations, they won't even blink. Especially since he is an Elite Owner.

 

[Helios]

Remember - At this point, Vistana is in "don't ask - don't tell" mode. Vistana has no contact with guests, and doesn't even have a way to contact them - they don't want to know.

If YYJMSP calls them and says he's having a family reunion and needs 10 guest confirmations, they won't even blink. Especially since he is an Elite Owner.

Agree, you said it well before when you mentioned Plausible Deniability.

Couldn't the resort front desk ask?

 

[Helios]

I also thought they were going to get tougher now that they are owned by Interval.

 

[Helios]

So, let's introduce another wrinkle to interpretations.

What about if I grab a dozen units using SO's from all over the place (some from the resort in question, some not) and then invite all of my direct relatives and their extended families to come along? There's some verbiage in the CCRs about not being allowed to "rent for commercial purposes" or something along those lines (i.e. you cannot use the bookings as part of something that is effectively a vacation rental business).

I feel fine with charging them for my costs, as 1) they are all coming with me not at some random time on their own, 2) they are all part of my vacation as I am there with them, and 3) I am not renting as a business venture to strangers they're basically all my relatives. I believe this isn't quite the letter of the law, but within the intents of some vagueness in those rules, as this usage is an extension of my vacation plans.

If you change a SO reservation name, do they give you any reminders about not renting? I get them even if I have a reservation with the exact same dates for me. I get just a reminder, not a question about me renting the unit. I also get the same reminders when I rent a Home Resort Resie.

 

[DeniseM]

When they made all the changes, we wondered what was going to happen, but so far, Vistana has actually distanced themselves from the guests of owners/guest confirmations.

-They won't talk to guests anymore.
-They won't accept guest's contact info.
-They have no way to contact guests.

 

[DeniseM]

Couldn't the resort front desk ask?

This would be an enormous PR disaster. Can you imagine the drama that would ensue?

If you turned people away at the front desk, this would create enormous bad will and negative publicity towards the resort, and Vistana already said they weren't going to punish guests.

If they wanted to know, they could find out much earlier - but since they intentionally changed their policies so they no longer have any contact with guests, they apparently don't want to know.

 

[bizaro86]

This would be an enormous PR disaster. Can you imagine the drama that would ensue?

If you turned people away at the front desk, this would create enormous bad will and negative publicity towards the resort, and Vistana already said they weren't going to punish guests.

If they wanted to know, they could find out much earlier - but since they intentionally changed their policies so they no longer have any contact with guests, they apparently don't want to know.

Don't ask don't tell, but we will collect a fee for our troubles...

 

[tschwa2]

I think they stopped taking guest information and allowing guests to confirm to make it harder to rent- not to distance themselves. As far as I know this is the only company that will not confirm a reservation for a guest. Yes I can do a conference call with a guest but I would really rather not. It is annoying enough that I have to call to put a reservation in a guest name to begin with.

 

[Helios]

This would be an enormous PR disaster. Can you imagine the drama that would ensue?

If you turned people away at the front desk, this would create enormous bad will and negative publicity towards the resort, and Vistana already said they weren't going to punish guests.

If they wanted to know, they could find out much earlier - but since they intentionally changed their policies so they no longer have any contact with guests, they apparently don't want to know.

So, this goes beyond plausible deniability...this boils down to you can break the rules if you want, we simply don't care...

 

[DeniseM]

I don't know - I'm just guessing, like everyone else.

 

[Helios]

Don't ask don't tell, but we will collect a fee for our troubles...

Everybody wins this way...you go ahead and rent illegally and we get a piece of the action (but let's call it a fee if you are not 4* or 5*, if you are 4* or 5* you are fine)...it is all cool......

 

[tschwa2]

So, this goes beyond plausible deniability...this boils down to you can break the rules if you want, we simply don't care...

I am sure the owners who are renting SO reservations believe that and would like to have everyone believe that.

 

[Helios]

I think they stopped taking guest information and allowing guests to confirm to make it harder to rent- not to distance themselves. As far as I know this is the only company that will not confirm a reservation for a guest. Yes I can do a conference call with a guest but I would really rather not. It is annoying enough that I have to call to put a reservation in a guest name to begin with.

Making it harder?

 

[Helios]

I don't know - I'm just guessing, like everyone else.

Of course, I am just putting things into perspective with my spin of sarcasam.

 

[tschwa2]

Making it harder?

Yes because now when I rent my home resort reservation, my guest can't confirm directly with the resort or with Vistana. I own a few SBP platinum and gold plus summer weeks and 2 Harborside weeks. I like to be able to make a reservation, forward a confirmation and have the renter call directly to confirm. They can't do this now. I have to make a conference call unless the guest is content to pay with only a confirmation in hand.

 

[Helios]

I am sure the owners who are renting SO reservations believe that and would like to have everyone believe that.

But, if everybody believes that then the system crashes...let's hope not...all the owners from low MFs properties will rent the attractive inventory that makes it to the 8 month mark.