ROFR metric / Ongoing ROFR Activity

[NYFLTRAVELER]

As I said in the other thread, that’s about the going price for Oceanside. Based on the points you mentioned- the week at Marriott presentation must have been garden view. Keep in mind the resale week will not be eligible to enroll in points program.

Yes. Cannot convert to Points. Do you think $5k is a fair purchase price ?

 

[MOXJO7282]

Yes. Cannot convert to Points. Do you think $5k is a fair purchase price ?

It looks like there was a Aruba Surf 2BDRM OV Gold that sold on Ebay for $5300 with $500 closing. Ebay is usually the cheapest buying platform so I'd have to say $5k for an OS gold would be considered a good deal.

 

[jmhpsu93]

Two Grande Vista 2BR Gold weeks in ROFR, one for $2029, one for $516. Both include all closing costs and 2019 week usage. First one submitted 1/24 and the second should go out today, I think.

 

[jmhpsu93]

Two Grande Vista 2BR Gold weeks in ROFR, one for $2029, one for $516. Both include all closing costs and 2019 week usage. First one submitted 1/24 and the second should go out today, I think.

Broker received ROFR waiver on first one today. Hope to slip the second one in past the goalie. Will record on rofr.net once the transfer is complete.

 

[Mlvnsmly]

I just had ROFR waived for Oceana Palms Gold Oceanfront week for $8500. It came back in 2 days. At a glance, the price looks high, but there were very few OF units sold as weeks originally (due to the fact that the resort is relatively new and the change to the DC program) so the resale market is almost non existent. I made an offer once before, but marriott exercised at $3700. There was another that asked anywhere from 6k-8k but the seller would always disappear when the offer was sent. The only other ones I've seen are generally asking around 17k-19k. I will add it to ROFR.net.

 

[GoldenVIKE]

Hi all, just wanted to run a points resale past this group since you as a community have been so helpful in the past.

As a buyer, I'm considering a contract to increase our MVCI ownership by 2,500 points from 7,850 pts to 10,350 pts. (We currently own 4000 DC points plus an enrolled week at Ocean Pointe w/ conversion value of 3,850 in case you're wondering about the odd number of current ownership)

Anyway, the resale we're considering buying is structured like this:
- We (buyers) pay $15,299 which is broken down as: $5,850 purchase price ($2.34/pt) + $7,500 xfer fee + $95 ROFR fee + $199 closing costs + $1,655 2019 MFs + $300 education fee MINUS $300 education fee waiver due to current ownership status.
- Sellers bring $13,950 to closing, so that the contract actually reads that the purchase price is $19,800 ($7.92/pt), which with after all of the aforementioned fees the total contract amount is $29,549 ($29,249 after education fee is waived).

Based on this I'd imagine the risk of ROFR being exercised is roughly 0%. It surprises me that the sellers would be up for bringing so much to the table to close. I'm sure that includes a broker fee but sheesh. The broker seems to be reputable and they've had very good and professional communication (emails, phone call, docusign, etc). Also a good BBB rating: https://www.bbb.org/us/fl/ocoee/pro...keting/the-timeshare-group-llc-0733-174740553

This seems like a good/fair deal. Any red flags??

 

[Fasttr]

Hi all, just wanted to run a points resale past this group since you as a community have been so helpful in the past.

As a buyer, I'm considering a contract to increase our MVCI ownership by 2,500 points from 7,850 pts to 10,350 pts. (We currently own 4000 DC points plus an enrolled week at Ocean Pointe w/ conversion value of 3,850 in case you're wondering about the odd number of current ownership)

Anyway, the resale we're considering buying is structured like this:
- We (buyers) pay $15,299 which is broken down as: $5,850 purchase price ($2.34/pt) + $7,500 xfer fee + $95 ROFR fee + $199 closing costs + $1,655 2019 MFs + $300 education fee MINUS $300 education fee waiver due to current ownership status.
- Sellers bring $13,950 to closing, so that the contract actually reads that the purchase price is $19,800 ($7.92/pt), which with after all of the aforementioned fees the total contract amount is $29,549 ($29,249 after education fee is waived).

Based on this I'd imagine the risk of ROFR being exercised is roughly 0%. It surprises me that the sellers would be up for bringing so much to the table to close. I'm sure that includes a broker fee but sheesh. The broker seems to be reputable and they've had very good and professional communication (emails, phone call, docusign, etc). Also a good BBB rating: https://www.bbb.org/us/fl/ocoee/pro...keting/the-timeshare-group-llc-0733-174740553

This seems like a good/fair deal. Any red flags??

I’m confused about the sellers $13.95K. Do they have an outstanding loan on the points they are paying off as part of the transaction. And how does what they are paying get added to the selling price?

 

[TXTortoise]

Since all Marriott cares about is the actual price/point, plus maybe the MF, but that's not part of the ROFR I wouldn't think.
Why wouldn't Marriott just return the $13,950 to the seller, and then just pay them the $5850 as ROFR cost?

 

[JIMinNC]

I’m confused about the sellers $13.95K. Do they have an outstanding loan on the points they are paying off as part of the transaction. And how does what they are paying get added to the selling price?

I was confused about that as well, but could it be an upfront fee paid by the owner/seller? I had heard those upfront fees are added to the ROFR price so if MVC exercises, the owner/seller gets their fee back. Is The Timeshare Group LLC an upfront fee company? Even then though, a $13K upfront fee to see points seems excessive for even those compnaies.

 

[GoldenVIKE]

Since all Marriott cares about is the actual price/point, plus maybe the MF, but that's not part of the ROFR I wouldn't think.
Why wouldn't Marriott just return the $13,950 to the seller, and then just pay them the $5850 as ROFR cost?

The contract presented to Marriott doesn't mention anything about the seller bringing all this money to the close. There's an addendum to the contact that stipulates that. I believe this is the broker's strategy of ensuing ROFR isn't exercised. To Marriott it appears that the contract purchase price is $19,800.

Part of me is thinking it's not really my concern why the sellers are bringing so much $ to close, but another part of me thinks this just seems fishy. This seller is only paying $1,600/yr in MF - so why is it worth it to them to pay nearly a decade worth of MFs to get out of their ownership??

For whatever it's worth the broker says they do 5 MVCI DC points resales per week with this structure.

 

[GRCTahoe]

To get pass a ROFR we tried to have the seller pay the MF's , closing cost etc to get the cost higher and MVCI still ROFR it.
They are getting smarter and reading the sections of they contract they did not use to.
I offered nearly 20% more on a similar unit they passed on last year and they ROFR it 2 days ago.

 

[GoldenVIKE]

I'm completely speculating here but perhaps the seller's contribution is just bogus, or perhaps it's a couple different transactions where they get most of it back. Like, "Seller, you pay $14k at close but you get the entire. $6k per point plus $12k back of the $14k for a 'finders fee' or something... so at the end of the day the broker takes a couple grand, the seller makes a profit, the buyer is happy with the price, and MVCI just doesn't realize that these things sell for less than they realize. If my speculation is right, Hopefully I'm not giving away industry trade secrets on here.

 

[Dean]

Hi all, just wanted to run a points resale past this group since you as a community have been so helpful in the past.

As a buyer, I'm considering a contract to increase our MVCI ownership by 2,500 points from 7,850 pts to 10,350 pts. (We currently own 4000 DC points plus an enrolled week at Ocean Pointe w/ conversion value of 3,850 in case you're wondering about the odd number of current ownership)

Anyway, the resale we're considering buying is structured like this:
- We (buyers) pay $15,299 which is broken down as: $5,850 purchase price ($2.34/pt) + $7,500 xfer fee + $95 ROFR fee + $199 closing costs + $1,655 2019 MFs + $300 education fee MINUS $300 education fee waiver due to current ownership status.
- Sellers bring $13,950 to closing, so that the contract actually reads that the purchase price is $19,800 ($7.92/pt), which with after all of the aforementioned fees the total contract amount is $29,549 ($29,249 after education fee is waived).

Based on this I'd imagine the risk of ROFR being exercised is roughly 0%. It surprises me that the sellers would be up for bringing so much to the table to close. I'm sure that includes a broker fee but sheesh. The broker seems to be reputable and they've had very good and professional communication (emails, phone call, docusign, etc). Also a good BBB rating: https://www.bbb.org/us/fl/ocoee/pro...keting/the-timeshare-group-llc-0733-174740553

This seems like a good/fair deal. Any red flags??

I don't see any red flags as long as the contract is not structured in such a way that you could get stuck owing the additional money in some way. It sounds like that either the seller has a loan they are trying to get our from under or the broker is the owner and playing games with the contract to bypass the ROFR. It's illegal in FL, and all states I know of, to attempt to bypass ROFR with a side deal. Based on your last post above it sounds like this is the case.

 

[GRCTahoe]

did you look up the Broker License # to see if he has any violations?
I am a CA Real Estate broker and not sure it is legal, not have the terms in the contract. Means some one is not protected. MVCI is a pretty big company If someone found a way around their ROFR to the tune of 5 xs per week ? I think they might notice.

 

[GoldenVIKE]

I don't see any red flags as long as the contract is not structured in such a way that you could get stuck owing the additional money in some way. It sounds like that either the seller has a loan they are trying to get our from under or the broker is the owner and playing games with the contract to bypass the ROFR. It's illegal in FL, and all states I know of, to attempt to bypass ROFR with a side deal. Based on your last post above it sounds like this is the case.

Illegal? Or against Marriott's policies? Do you have a statute or case you can reference?

 

[GoldenVIKE]

Also just to be clear, I'm completely speculating as an outsider. I don't know if that's the case at all. It's just a scenario that'd make more economic sense to me.

 

[GRCTahoe]

so your net cost is 6.12 per point ? 15,299/2500points

 

[GoldenVIKE]

so your net cost is 6.12 per point ? 15,299/2500points

Yes, or slightly less if you want to subtract 2019 MFs from the purchase price for the sake of calculating $/pt.

 

[GRCTahoe]

You said there was an addendum that stated that MVCI would not see that the seller in bringing in the funds. As Dean also said it is illegal in Florida and all states that he knows of. I am in California and Illegal here to. I would have to look up the reference. But common sense says if you hide it, must not be good. Not sure what escrow company would go along with it, uness he is hiding it from them also. An amendment is suppose to part of the contract to offer the protections of the contract but sounds like a side deal if MVCI dose not get to see it.

 

[Dean]

Illegal? Or against Marriott's policies? Do you have a statute or case you can reference?

Illegal, no I don't have a statutory reference. The addendum would have to be submitted as well for it to be legal as I understand it.

 

[GoldenVIKE]

You said there was an addendum that stated that MVCI would not see that the seller in bringing in the funds. As Dean also said it is illegal in Florida and all states that he knows of. I am in California and Illegal here to. I would have to look up the reference. But common sense says if you hide it, must not be good. Not sure what escrow company would go along with it, uness he is hiding it from them also. An amendment is suppose to part of the contract to offer the protections of the contract but sounds like a side deal if MVCI dose not get to see it.

Makes sense I'm going to ask the broker about all of this. Not worth it to me to be part of a transaction that could put me in legal jeapardy or even just running afoul of MVCI rules, since there are legitimate ways of going about this that are roughly the same general cost. Thanks everyone!

 

[Dean]

Makes sense I'm going to ask the broker about all of this. Not worth it to me to be part of a transaction that could put me in legal jeapardy or even just running afoul of MVCI rules, since there are legitimate ways of going about this that are roughly the same general cost. Thanks everyone!

They likely do closings in house or with a captive company so I'd bet not the first time. Your risk is they could later void your membership if it does pass though highly unlikely they would do so.

 

[csodjd]

To get pass a ROFR we tried to have the seller pay the MF's , closing cost etc to get the cost higher and MVCI still ROFR it.
They are getting smarter and reading the sections of they contract they did not use to.
I offered nearly 20% more on a similar unit they passed on last year and they ROFR it 2 days ago.

I also tried that and failed. I wonder how Marriott would approach a contract that said something like, Seller agrees to pay 2020 and 2021 maintenance fees. Then the price, of course, is increased by the amount of those fees. If Marriott were to exercise, would they be required to agree to the same terms and thus they'd have to pay the seller the higher price and wait for the seller to pay them MF in 2020 and 2021? I'm not sure Marriott could just do the math today because there is a "value" to the seller in getting more now and having a couple of years before having to pay those MF on behalf of the buyer.

 

[Dean]

I also tried that and failed. I wonder how Marriott would approach a contract that said something like, Seller agrees to pay 2020 and 2021 maintenance fees. Then the price, of course, is increased by the amount of those fees. If Marriott were to exercise, would they be required to agree to the same terms and thus they'd have to pay the seller the higher price and wait for the seller to pay them MF in 2020 and 2021? I'm not sure Marriott could just do the math today because there is a "value" to the seller in getting more now and having a couple of years before having to pay those MF on behalf of the buyer.

Sure but the buyer would be at risk for those fees so you'd have to know that if you got stuck it was still an OK deal. I can't say how Marriott approaches a trade situation, say $$$ plus a car for example, but I know DVC requires you to put a $$$ value on the other items that's a reasonable market value.

 

[GRCTahoe]

MVCI dose not have to wait for MF's it is done as a seller credit at closing so in fact MVCI pays the net lower price in the end