Roofing problem

[spirits]

About 15 years ago, our city was hit with a bad hailstorm and many roofs were damaged. Our insurance company was always very good with any claims. They paid for a new roof along with other issues....no problems. But now 15 years later some garage tiles are starting to lift. My husband called our insurance but they do not want to do anything about a small job.
Just now we spoke to a roofer who told us the shingles used 15 years ago were not good quality and the garage and house shingles should be replaced. Now this is another issue. A small patch job is one thing.....a major replace is another.

My question is this.....is the insurance company responsible for ensuring a good product??? I realize that they are not the installers, but if they contracted out for a shoddy product, is that not their responsibility?
We will also get 2 more estimates. Thanks for any advice.

 

[Talent312]

I doubt you'll have any luck blaming the insurer. They honored your claim for the repair.
Ultimately, you were responsible for making the repair. The contractor may be liable to you.

.

 

[spirits]

Talent 312....thanks for the response. There were so many claims that year......the insurance company picked the roofers.....we had nothing to do with it. That is what I was wondering....if we picked the contractor, it would be on us. But the insurance company hired the crews....there were thousands of houses that were damaged...they just went with a group job. If the contractors did shoddy work or used substandard materials, why would we be responsible for that? Just asking....

I was talking to a neighbor and he said that no roof lasts more than 12-15 years anymore.....shingles are very poorly made....no matter that they were supposed to be 25 year shingles (;

 

[rapmarks]

We have had to replace roofs after 15 years, and it seems every time I hire a repairman they like to complain about the previous job.


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[easyrider]

My question is this.....is the insurance company responsible for ensuring a good product??? I realize that they are not the installers, but if they contracted out for a shoddy product, is that not their responsibility?
We will also get 2 more estimates. Thanks for any advice.

No. The manufacturer is responsible for the product. If it was faulty there may be a class action lawsuit, either in progress or finished. You can google the product to find out. There have been many building materials have failed including roofing. You will need proof of purchase for most of these class actions but not always.

Bill

 

[dominidude]

About 15 years ago, our city was hit with a bad hailstorm and many roofs were damaged. Our insurance company was always very good with any claims. They paid for a new roof along with other issues....no problems. But now 15 years later some garage tiles are starting to lift. My husband called our insurance but they do not want to do anything about a small job.
Just now we spoke to a roofer who told us the shingles used 15 years ago were not good quality and the garage and house shingles should be replaced. Now this is another issue. A small patch job is one thing.....a major replace is another.

My question is this.....is the insurance company responsible for ensuring a good product??? I realize that they are not the installers, but if they contracted out for a shoddy product, is that not their responsibility?
We will also get 2 more estimates. Thanks for any advice.

The roof lasted 15 years but you are unhappy. Why? How much longer do you think the roof should last?
As far as I'm concerned, it doesn't seem like anyone did anything wrong.
Your roof is just plain old, that's all.

 

[VacationForever]

I am in full agreement with domindude. Roofs last 10 to 15 years, whether it is shingles or tiles. There are the composite ones that are supposed to last 40 years but don't count on it. Roofs age and replacement becomes the responsibility of the homeowner.

 

[easyrider]

Depending on the materials, a decent roofing product will be fine for 25 + years. There are light weight asphalt shingles that are warranted for 15 years but because of changes to the building codes somewhere in the early 90's, allowing only two layers of asphalt shingles on a roof, most are at about 30 year roofs. There are many batches of asphalt shingles that are defective and many manufactures are paying for the defects. If you google roofing product recall you will see many.

Warantys usually only cover the product but in some cases it covers the labor as well. In other cases it would be a class action suit forcing the manufacturer to pay labor and material. So even if a person does qualify under manufacturer waranty there is still labor and profit that most companies will charge.

I have seen 15 year light weight 3 tab on homes completely worn out and not leaking after 30 years. Just because the warranty is 15 years doesn't mean the shingle automatically goes bad in 15 years. The 15 years is only how long the manufacturer warrantys the product.

Bill

 

[WinniWoman]

I have shingles that are supposedly 50 year shingles. The company that did our roof 8-10 years ago (can't remember) is out of business now.

I remember getting something in the mail about a class action lawsuit. After trying to read all the legalese, I couldn't make head or tails of it and I honestly don't even remember how I responded or if I responded at all.

Anyway, after calling my homeowners insurance about a $165 increase in premiums this year, the rep. mentioned that besides the rating for our area being changed (more thefts and fires- I don't believe that for one minute), that also our roof is older.

 

[Talent312]

I recently tried to get quotes to compare with our Allstate policy.
Allstate's been okay, but I thought we could lower the premium.

However, with a 24-year old roof, no one would give us a quote.
If I want new insurance, I'll need to replace the roof, good or not.

.

 

[Elan]

Depending on the materials, a decent roofing product will be fine for 25 + years. There are light weight asphalt shingles that are warranted for 15 years but because of changes to the building codes somewhere in the early 90's, allowing only two layers of asphalt shingles on a roof, most are at about 30 year roofs. There are many batches of asphalt shingles that are defective and many manufactures are paying for the defects. If you google roofing product recall you will see many.

Warantys usually only cover the product but in some cases it covers the labor as well. In other cases it would be a class action suit forcing the manufacturer to pay labor and material. So even if a person does qualify under manufacturer waranty there is still labor and profit that most companies will charge.

I have seen 15 year light weight 3 tab on homes completely worn out and not leaking after 30 years. Just because the warranty is 15 years doesn't mean the shingle automatically goes bad in 15 years. The 15 years is only how long the manufacturer warrantys the product.

Bill

Exactly. I'd be pissed if my roof only lasted 15 years (at 16yrs now and expect go at least another 4, if not 10+).

Expecting a roof with decent shingles to only last 15 years, because that's the duration of the warranty, is analogous to expecting your car to only last 3yrs/36K miles because that's the duration of the warranty.

 

["Roger"]

A couple of points:

First, as mentioned in prior posts, while there are shingles that have longer warranties, most have a 15 year warranty. And that is by far what most people buy.

Now take the insurance company out of the picture. If you had bought the shingles yourself and they lasted 15 years, would you expect the shingle manufacture to replace the shingles if they began to fail after 15 years? Would it make any difference to the manufacture that other people have had their shingle last longer?

Second, by way of consolation, if it hadn't been for the hail storm, you would probably have been replacing your shingles years ago. The combination of the hail storm and your insurance gave you a number of extra years.

Finally, with regard to warranties including shingles with a 15 year warranty, manufactures these days work into their calculations that a percentage of their product will fail before the warranty runs out. In some cases, owners will have changed and they won't have to pay up. In other cases, they calculate a certain rate of failure into their costs. It is cheaper to do this than making a product that is absolutely sure to make it through the warranty product in which case they will have very few resales.

I have had a lot of experience with this with water heaters. There is something in my well water such I can guarantee that no water heater that I buy will completely make it through its warranty period. I always get a second water heater for the price of labor. As my plumbers note, it is more profitable for the manufactures accept a certain rate of failure than make water heaters that will last forever. They would lose too much resales that way. And for those who want to post that they have had a water heater, a refrigerator, etc. that has lasted thirty-five years, things have changed since when you bought that product. Manufactures are working under a different set of calculations from back then. Products are made cheaper with an expected shortened life expectancy.

 

[Icc5]

Here I thought I only have to get the shingles shot once and be protected for the most part. I guess I will have it again every 15 years.

 

[VacationForever]

Previous owner of a house that I owned put in a 25 year shingles roof just prior to listing and sale of the house to me. I owned that house for 15 years before I sold it. My realtor said it looked old and it should be replaced. No leaks at all but buyer could not get insurance on it even though I had no issue because I had the same insurance throughout. Buyer made me cough up 14K to replace with a composite roof. I gave him a credit against the sale.

My last home has tile roof which I just sold. I have always love the look of tiles and because they are usually listed as good for 40 to 50 years. No issue with the sale, it was only 9 years old, but my contractor told me to also not count on it lasting longer than other roofs, he said problems will start at about the 15th year.

 

[am1]

Another reason to self fund insurance.

 

[bogey21]

I recently tried to get quotes to compare with our Allstate policy.
.....However, with a 24-year old roof, no one would give us a quote.
If I want new insurance, I'll need to replace the roof, good or not.

This surprises me as my Son just bought a house built about 25 years ago. He had no problems getting quotes and in fact none of the companies asked about the age of the roof.

George

 

[Passepartout]

Some roofs are going to last longer, some not so much. I don't feel that the insurance company is (or should be) liable for a roof that they paid for only lasting 15 years. The analogy of a car only lasting as long as the warranty is faulty because with a car, it may need a relatively inexpensive repair to extend it's life (a brake job, timing belt, tires come to mind) well beyond the warranty period. But a roof can't be fixed piecemeal. If it leaks even 'just a little', it's still a leak, and that indicates that the roof has failed.

If other homeowners who had their roofs replaced after the hailstorm by the same insurance company are finding a high failure rate, you might have a case. Call the regulatory agency that deals with insurance regulation and ask. My guess is that you will be told that the insurer covered the damage that occurred , and that replacing it now is simply a case of ordinary wear & tear and the roof is just beyond it's service life. Replacing it (again) is up to the homeowner.

Jim

 

[rapmarks]

My daughter bought a home in 08, new construction. Spent about sixty thousand finishing it up. Had to move for business a few years later, had to sell at huge loss. One potential buyer claimed the roof needed replacement, a six year old roof. Found out there were defective shingles, but had no documentation, was paying on two mortgages for months, had to discount house even further below what she paid for it.


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[rapmarks]

Several years ago we got dropped by our insurance company of forty years. We had a bathroom leak while we were away in winter and the following year we had a lightning strike, but a few years back I had apparently called about whether something was covered. So that counted as three claims , total payout $2700 in ten years, I was dropped and had to pay a twenty percent penalty for five years on that house and my house in Florida. So I would never call the insurance company to ask a question. And when I was trying to shop insurance for my sister, I was told by Florida agent that if she had a claim , and an inquiry counted as a claim,
in the past five years she would not get second home insurance


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[easyrider]

A couple of points:

First, as mentioned in prior posts, while there are shingles that have longer warranties, most have a 15 year warranty. And that is by far what most people buy.

Now take the insurance company out of the picture. If you had bought the shingles yourself and they lasted 15 years, would you expect the shingle manufacture to replace the shingles if they began to fail after 15 years? Would it make any difference to the manufacture that other people have had their shingle last longer?

Not really. Most people purchase laminated asphalt shingles with a 30 year warranty. This is what most retailers sells. Home owners and low end house flippers might use a 15 year 3 tab but the cost is so close to or even more than laminated shingles that no one does. Often it is more costly to purchase a crappy 3 tab because no one is stocking this.

The insurance company can say whatever but if you get a contractor or licensed home inspector to inspect the roof and it is ok for another 5 years, the insurance company or even the bank regarding financing usually regard the roof as good.

Bill

 

[VacationForever]

Not really. Most people purchase laminated asphalt shingles with a 30 year warranty. This is what most retailers sells. Home owners and low end house flippers might use a 15 year 3 tab but the cost is so close to or even more than laminated shingles that no one does. Often it is more costly to purchase a crappy 3 tab because no one is stocking this.

The insurance company can say whatever but if you get a contractor or licensed home inspector to inspect the roof and it is ok for another 5 years, the insurance company or even the bank regarding financing usually regard the roof as good.

Bill

I even got Roof Doctor (a company in CA) to certify the roof was good for at least 2 more years, which is pretty standard here when one wants to show that the roof is in good shape, but the buyer would not budge, using his insurance company's word as leverage. I tried getting him to use my insurance company but he wanted to stick to the insurance company he had for years. It was a relatively expensive home and since I did not want to relist the home I just gave him the 14K credit to close the deal.

 

[Luanne]

Several years ago we got dropped by our insurance company of forty years. We had a bathroom leak while we were away in winter and the following year we had a lightning strike, but a few years back I had apparently called about whether something was covered. So that counted as three claims , total payout $2700 in ten years, I was dropped and had to pay a twenty percent penalty for five years on that house and my house in Florida. So I would never call the insurance company to ask a question. And when I was trying to shop insurance for my sister, I was told by Florida agent that if she had a claim , and an inquiry counted as a claim,
in the past five years she would not get second home insurance

We had this happen when we were still in California. Our insurance, State Farm, dropped our homeowner's insurance due to too many "claims", when in fact one of the "claims" was just an inquiry. Luckily for us our insurance agent went to bat for us. We had been good customers for years. He was able to get it reinstated and to this day we still have State Farm.

 

[rapmarks]

We had this happen when we were still in California. Our insurance, State Farm, dropped our homeowner's insurance due to too many "claims", when in fact one of the "claims" was just an inquiry. Luckily for us our insurance agent went to bat for us. We had been good customers for years. He was able to get it reinstated and to this day we still have State Farm.

Same company, we had a weak agent, we got dropped, kept our three cars with them. And we have three houses now, so they lost a lot of business, and we haven't had a claim since, I believe ten years.


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[WinniWoman]

Allstate dropped us after like 30 years (total with first and second home) and no claims because they suddenly decided they didn't like that the fire dept. was 6 miles away. Mind you we have a secondary fire dept. 2 miles a way and another 2 depts. that are also 6 miles away. Yet my neighbor has Allstate and she is like 1 mile away from me - just up the road.

So what- if you are not living right on top of a fire dept you can't be insured? I was able to get another insurance thankfully.

Here we even pulled out a perfectly fine oil tank out of the ground and put in an above ground one because we know that can be an issue with selling in the future.

Now we have to worry about roofs also? We bought our first home that had a 25 year roof on it- no problem. We owned that home for 10 years and never had to replace it, though we did have a small leak to repair. No biggie.

I HATE insurance companies. Also- it is such a hassle to sell a home anymore. Everyone wants everything to be perfect. They might as well buy a new house then. And- they shouldn't expect the new house to be perfect either. We had tons of repairs to do on our house when it was brand new!

 

[elaine]

We had the bad roof shingles. We filed it the class actions forms. Got $700. Good luck.