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Thoughts on owning a trader v. staying put?

PhilaMom

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Looking for thoughts on whether you prefer owning a low cost trading property, or whether you subscribe to the buy where you want to stay philosophy? Or both? We’re still trying to figure out what we want to purchase, but know we definitely want to pay cash and buy resale. We do like to travel and visit new properties and locations, but find DC points too be too costly for us. On the other hand, II sounds a bit risky in that you may not always get what you want. We live on the east coast and can drive to several properties, and even to Florida if we had to. Thanks for your thoughts!
 

ljmiii

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Are you a twosome or travelling with family? Are you constrained by the school calendar? And do you want week long stays or shorter vacations?

In general, I'm a firm believer in the 'buy where you want to stay' philosophy. And my limited experiences with II have been horrible - I'm now into my fourth vacation season trying to trade my deposited beachfront, highest TDI, Hawaii week. But I read of people on TUG who have fabulous luck trading into wherever they want to go.

The points system adds an additional level of complexity to the buying decision process. By driving down the resale value of weeks MVCI has made them an incredibly good vacation bargain...if you want to go the same place every year (or every other year). Or you can buy points (ideally resale). Knock-on-wood I've been very successful making many points reservations over the past few years. The only place I've failed to get into using my DPs is Marriott's Village d'ile-de-France (which the DP trust can't own).
 

Swice

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I lean more toward the "own where you want/can/willing to go" theory. We own Ocean Watch and it's a great trader. We have gotten excellent trades with that unit. For the most part, we've gotten everything we've asked for (within reason). But as life changes with kids growing up and their schedules becoming more complicated, it has become our easy one to use... summer, spring break, holiday period. It is within easy driving distance. There is a comfort level to it because we have been there many times. Because of that, we don't feel we must be a tourist and "see & do" everything (like we would if we had traded to another location). We also don't feel guilty if we have to leave a day early or arrive a day late. Again because it's within driving distance, we can easily transport food and not have to worry about dumping leftover ingredients at the end of our stay (I hate buying a bottle of ketchup or mustard for one meal!). We have even used points to go for two or three days. We can also "split" our "week" into two stays.

We also own Lakeshore Reserve in Orlando-- bought because the deluxe model trades as two one-bedrooms as opposed to a one bedroom and a studio like most lockoffs. We use that one for trades and have also converted it to points a few times. It's a great property, and while I would gladly go there for a stay without stepping foot in a theme park, it's just not as easy to zip down there because of the location. It takes more planning. Lakeshore is smaller, so there is less opportunity/reservation availability for us to change our reservations to another time. So we do need "firm" plans when we reserve.

When we originally bought, we NEVER would have guessed Myrtle Beach would be our easy go-to spot. We are fair and burn easily in the summer months. We go at different times of the year (easy to burn a few extra points on a three day teacher workday weekend before the the points expire). There is something to be said for a "second home" where your kids can work on homework/special projects (curses to those teachers who assign HOURS of work over holidays!!) without feeling like they're messing up the family vacation plans.
 

TheTimeTraveler

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Yes, buy where you want to stay. And be sure that is desirable and easy to rent and/or easy to trade.

With those factors in mind, if you don't rent it or don't trade it, then you can stay there and enjoy it!

I also would suggest buying a unit which can be locked off (so in essence you get two trades for one annual maintenance fee).

This question is on the Marriott forum, so using this criteria I would think Marriott's Grande Vista in Orlando as an excellent candidate (and a very good value). A Platinum week is the way to go, and be sure to buy a unit that is in the "Florida Club" so that you can also make internal reservations at any one of five member properties (Miami, Ft. Lauderdale, Palm Beach Shores, Orlando, or the Panhandle).

These weeks can also be traded in Interval International.

Best of luck and enjoy!





.
 
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I agree, own where you want to stay and I'd suggest close enough to where you live that you can go from short stays when you just want a nice weekend away.
I own with Well and points are all I know in the timeshare world and they have been extremely flexible. I was able to trade some points in II for a week in Hilton Head at Spinnaker during spring break.
I don't know Marriott's system but it seems like it's a mixture still of points vs weeks owners and some resorts trade for differently and you have to own at a higher end resort to stay there or trade into there.
Obviously I could be misunderstanding what I've read on here about it though.
Own where you want to stay for sure though and find the system that works best for you. This is the best place for timesgare knowledge, bar none
 

mjm1

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I too am a proponent of buying where you would like to use it, but could easily trade or rent it. We have traded through II with success but do like our ability for internal trades using the DC program.

If you are considering non-Marriott’s, I would recommend looking at a resale mandatory unit in the Vistana program. Part of the Sheraton Vistana Villages property in Florida is mandatory, so you would be able to make internal trades within Vistana. Their system is not as big as Marriott, but the resorts are very nice. There are plenty of threads in the Vistana forum for more details.

Good luck with your search.

Best regards.

Mike
 

vacationtime1

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I too am a proponent of buying where you would like to use it, but could easily trade or rent it. We have traded through II with success but do like our ability for internal trades using the DC program.

If you are considering non-Marriott’s, I would recommend looking at a resale mandatory unit in the Vistana program. Part of the Sheraton Vistana Villages property in Florida is mandatory, so you would be able to make internal trades within Vistana. Their system is not as big as Marriott, but the resorts are very nice. There are plenty of threads in the Vistana forum for more details.

Good luck with your search.

Best regards.

Mike

I second Mike's suggestion about mandatory Vistana units -- if the locations (Myrtle Beach and Florida, mostly Orlando) suit you.
 

chriskre

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I don't own a Marriott but do about 3-4 Marriott exchanges thru II every year.
I use my Bluegreen ownership to get those Marriotts.

I live in FL so that makes it easy for me to take advantage of last minute
opportunities but I also reserve a year in advance many times.

I've already got 3 exchanges into Marriotts booked for this year and am
looking for another, so depending on where you want to go, I'd say don't discount
the ability to trade in II successfully. Your most success is an ongoing search
but I have never personally done it. I just check regularly and also get a notification
from TUG's sighting forum when others post the bulk deposits.

I also enjoy owning in the mini systems like Wyndham, HGVC, DVC and Bluegreen
so that I am not just limited to exchanging to get great vacations. The mini's make
TS life much easier. They also give you access to either II or RCI.
 

Steve Fatula

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Depends what YOU want, no one can answer that. We could never own where we want to go, not possible as we like to go somewhere different, but that's us. We are seeing the world, too expensive to own it.
 

Dean

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Looking for thoughts on whether you prefer owning a low cost trading property, or whether you subscribe to the buy where you want to stay philosophy? Or both? We’re still trying to figure out what we want to purchase, but know we definitely want to pay cash and buy resale. We do like to travel and visit new properties and locations, but find DC points too be too costly for us. On the other hand, II sounds a bit risky in that you may not always get what you want. We live on the east coast and can drive to several properties, and even to Florida if we had to. Thanks for your thoughts!
I fall in between. Variables include expectations, flexibility, timeshare knowledge, ability to plan ahead and where one wants to go over time. Owning at a resort is not a guarantee of a reservations even with planning, there are some locations where one needs to own more than one week to be successful. I also feel there's an economy of scale and that for a single week it may not be reasonable to own at all and/or to own to exchange in many situations. There isn't much overlap between good trading options and good resorts to own and use consistently for most people with Marriott. And it may be that non Marriott is the best option in this situation, possibly Bluegreen or Wyndham. Assuming Marriott, overall for those new I think most would be better off trying to find that compromise in between resort though.

For one experienced, flexible, can plan ahead and willing to take the risks; I tend to like lower cost, lower fee properties with lockoff's like Grande Vista, Harbour Lake, Willow Ridge, Manor Club Sequel and Grand Chateau Platinum and Desert resorts (CA & AZ) Gold (Platinum if cheap enough). Depositing 12-13 months out and requesting exchange options at least 13 months out and always looking to move up in resort and/or unit size but at the same time being realistic. For those who want to go to a high demand option consistently, say Hilton Head or Myrtle Beach mid summer, that plan won't work out well. There are also a few resorts without lockoff's that one could consider, esp if they consistently need a 2 BR anyway like Doral, Legends edge, Manor Club all Platinum and Grande Ocean Gold (but likely not other HHI options). I likely left out something and there are many variables that might work well for the right situation.

One of my favorite situations is a week to own and use consistently (and that rents well on off years) combined with a trading resort with lockoff's that can be reserved the same time frame. That's esp true if the seasons match up to the resorts with a Thursday start day.
 

dougp26364

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I guess for me the easiest way to explain this is to ask, how much discussion do you see on TUG about South African weeks right now?

Why do I ask this question? Because a decade (maybe longer) ago, SA weeks were all the rage. They were low cost, low MF weeks and traded exceptionally well into high cost, high end resorts. Then it all went to shit. A combination of takeovers, poor management and the ever changing rules of the exchange companies all but destroyed the value in owning South African weeks.

How about Sunterra? Do you know anything about them?

Sunterra was a major player in the timeshare industry at one point. There were several TUGGER's who made fun of me for owning Marriott weeks while they owned Sunterra weeks, which were MUCH cheaper in MF's at the time, and they could easily exchange into my expensive MVC resorts. So they received the benefit of staying at MVC resorts while paying approximately half the MF's I was paying. Then Sunterra's house of cards collapsed. They where either bankrupt or on the edge of bankruptcy. Diamond Resorts bought them out and changed everything. MF's went as high as my MVC weeks. Changes were made to their internal exchange program and the membership fee went from $135/year to well over $500/year (depending on your level of membership. We were Silver Elite when we left DRI.). The value was lost. We bailed out of DRI around 5 years ago.

Then there is the ever changing landscape of the exchange companies. RCI's point system seems to be built on shifting sands. Interval International is like an airline with all the extra fee's they charge. There's the ever increasing membership fee's and exchange fee's and, of course, the shifting inventory as timeshare management companies find new ways to keep the good weeks for owners in their systems instead of allowing them to go to the exchange company so "outsiders" can exchange in. Timeshare management companies are working hard to keep their products as "exclusive" as they can.

If you want to own a low cost week as an exchange week, it's not a bad idea but, you need to have an exit strategy. Eventually the sands of exchange rules will shift and what was once a good buy is now a cement block around your ankles in the ocean of timesharing.

On the other hand, if you own at a resort or in a resort group you enjoy and can use, then you'll have something you value regardless of what the exchange companies do in the future.

We've owned both exchangers and personal use weeks in the 20 plus years we've owned timeshare weeks. The weeks we used strictly for exchange are long gone. I got tired of playing the game and became frustrated with all the extra fee's the exchange companies kept putting on us. Management companies shifted to more inclusive membership programs that allowed easy inter-company exchanges, which allow me to bypass the deposit and hope method offered by exchange companies. Online instant exchanges with the exchange companies became more of a pain and online reservations with timeshare management systems became easier.

I've always been a proponent of own where you'll be happy to go and you're more likely to be happy with your ownership. But over the last decade changes made by the big two exchange companies has pushed my needle even further to own where you're happy staying or, own in a system that supplies you with the locations you're happy traveling to then ever before.

For the record, we own with Marriott and Hilton and are reasonably content with their systems and resorts. We also own two resorts that are essentially stand alone and don't trade within a timeshare management system. Both of which we purchased for personal usage. We dropped our RCI membership many years ago and, when our I.I. membership runs out in the very near future, it will be gone as well.
 

bogey21

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After dancing with Marriott for a number of years I sold my 4 Weeks for about $80,000 and bought six Fixed Weeks (they were also Fixed Units) at places I would visit every year. When I wanted to go somewhere else I rented. My total investment in my six Fixed Weeks was about $8,000 so I had plenty of money available to rent in other places...

George
 

Panina

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Looking for thoughts on whether you prefer owning a low cost trading property, or whether you subscribe to the buy where you want to stay philosophy? Or both? We’re still trying to figure out what we want to purchase, but know we definitely want to pay cash and buy resale. We do like to travel and visit new properties and locations, but find DC points too be too costly for us. On the other hand, II sounds a bit risky in that you may not always get what you want. We live on the east coast and can drive to several properties, and even to Florida if we had to. Thanks for your thoughts!
I own most of my weeks where I like stay and they are also strong traders. I also have a few that I got for traders only. If you get it for only II trade its important you get a highly desirable location and week so you have high trading power. II trades like for like. You also should think, if I no longer want this, will someone else want it when getting a week just for trading. With careful planning a good trader with descent mfs could be had.
 
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GregT

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Marriott: Maui Ocean Club Lahaina Villas (3BRx5), Ko Olina, Shadow Ridge II, Willow Ridge, Aruba Ocean Club, DC Points HGVC: Flamingo, Sea World, I-Drive, Starwood Bella (x4), SDO, TradeWinds, Worldmark
I think I own all of the scenarios: 1) weeks where I want to visit 2) mini-systems and 3) dedicated II traders.

I definitely prefer 1 & 2 and I do not like to rely on II for a "core vacation" where I need specific dates or resorts. I've been very pleased with the trades that I have gotten, but I do not depend on II.

The combination has been very useful -- as an example, I've constructed a family reunion at Ko Olina this June, and between home resort, points reservations and II trades, I've accumulated 15 different reservations. However, I still need one more II trade (that's right in the middle of everything) and it's been sitting there for months.....we will see.

Best,

Greg
 
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PhilaMom

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Thank you all very much for your thoughts! You’ve all certainly given us food for thought. We have been stuck in decisonmaking-land. We got over the first hurdle of do we even want to buy. And think that is a YES because we are a large-ish family (3 kids) and like at least 2 rooms with beds for everyone, love the kitchens, love the resort atmosphere and the pools, hot tubs, and kids activities, and like the idea of planning ahead and pre-paying for vacations. So, now we are trying to determine WHAT we should buy. Thanks!
 

Dean

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Thank you all very much for your thoughts! You’ve all certainly given us food for thought. We have been stuck in decisonmaking-land. We got over the first hurdle of do we even want to buy. And think that is a YES because we are a large-ish family (3 kids) and like at least 2 rooms with beds for everyone, love the kitchens, love the resort atmosphere and the pools, hot tubs, and kids activities, and like the idea of planning ahead and pre-paying for vacations. So, now we are trying to determine WHAT we should buy. Thanks!
I would suggest you do some planning, dreaming and soul searching. I feel an average of about a week in a 2 BR a year is about the minimum to make owning a timeshare reasonable. After that it's deciding what your style is, how flexible you are, what your expectations are and where you want to go. Then look at your planned trips over the next 5-10 years plus your expectations and see what timeshares might work best to accomplish those trips. For HHI the reasonable choices are completely different from Myrtle Beach or Wisconsin. If you will go shorter than a week, owning a week timeshare makes less sense and a points system more sense. Your exact situation will be unique but this type of thread should give you lots to think about then you just have to put it together, prioritize and make your final decisions. If you're trying to do mostly driving trips from Philly, Marriott may not be a great option for you.
 

Pamplemousse

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I agree with Dean’s post.
Have owned a Harbour lake gold lock off for a dozen years and I’ve had great trades on II to Marriott’s-HI(Kauai), Aruba, St Thomas, Paris, HH (April), Phoenix, etc and non Marriott’s like Big Island and St. Maarten.

But I reserve the highest TDI week in my season, deposit and place my request the same day. I’ve been able to plan far in advance since I know when the kids vacations are.

Now that the kids are off to college and travel time is much more variable I sometimes use DC points for shorter stays.

In terms of buying were you want to go or not, we bought Orlando because we attend a conference there on even years, but we never stay at our home resort. Our saleman told us to always lock off and exchange into Orlando with II since it is such an easy trade and are trips there are not at a busy time. Do this we still had the other half to exchange for a family trip.
 
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ljmiii

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Thank you all very much for your thoughts!...[W]e are a large-ish family (3 kids) and like at least 2 rooms with beds for everyone, love the kitchens, love the resort atmosphere and the pools, hot tubs, and kids activities, and like the idea of planning ahead and pre-paying for vacations.
We too came to timeshares because staying in a multi-room villa instead of just a hotel room makes travelling with kids a lot more enjoyable. But do keep in mind that if you are restricted to the school calendar planning ahead is essential. That said, I offer the following...

HGVC - Much more relaxed than MVCI to book...so long as you want to go to the Big Island of Hawaii, Las Vegas, or Orlando. Oahu is close to that...though you may find yourself paying more points (or staying a shorter time) because the cheapest rooms go fast. I've also read that South Carolina is starting to fall into the 'easier to book' category...but it depends on season. There are also many, many affiliates with limited availability.
In general, stays are from 3 days long to however long you have points for. External trading through RCI is similar but different than II - there are threads to read if you are interested.

MVCI weeks - Dirt cheap to somewhat expensive depending on the resort and season you want to own. Booking can be cutthroat for some resorts and seasons...not so bad for others. Trading through II can be difficult if you are limited to a particular week or resort...seemingly impossible if you are limited by week AND resort. But if you are flexible amazing 'deals' can be had.

MVCI points - Somewhere in the middle to high side compared to MVCI weeks (assuming you purchase resale). Very flexible with lots of locations to choose from. But you only get that flexibility of short stays and discounted stays less than 30 days away once you own 7,000 points...which *is* a lot of money.
 

rickandcindy23

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We only own at one resort that we visit each and every year and never exchange. That is our Hono Koa oceanfront on Maui. The fees are too high to deposit, and we love Maui Everything else we deposit for exchanges to some awesome places.

We just got back from Marrott's Ocean Pointe in Palm Beach, FL, and Marriott's Crystal Shores, Marco Island, FL. We exchanged into those two with our Marriott's Willow Ridge in Branson. We used the full 2 bedroom platinum weeks to get these two exchanges. I wouldn't think it possible to get January weeks for SC Florida and the two nicest resorts, but we did.

We like going to new places, and we don't have to stay at the fancier resorts, but we sure feel blessed to be able to stay in amazing places for less than $200 per night. We stayed at Brewster's Green in Cape Cod and we also went to Olgunquit, ME, this past May. It was cool weather, but we loved every minute. We did some sight seeing, saw whales, visited some national parks, got to park the car in Bar Harbor, which Rick loved to tell the kids, "I pahked the cah in Bah Hahbah." He loved to do that accent. Anyway, it was such a great trip.

We have been to all of the west states and still have some east states to visit. It's a lot of fun for both of us. We are using our airline points pretty regularly. :)
 

taterhed

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Thank you all very much for your thoughts! You’ve all certainly given us food for thought. We have been stuck in decisonmaking-land. We got over the first hurdle of do we even want to buy. And think that is a YES because we are a large-ish family (3 kids) and like at least 2 rooms with beds for everyone, love the kitchens, love the resort atmosphere and the pools, hot tubs, and kids activities, and like the idea of planning ahead and pre-paying for vacations. So, now we are trying to determine WHAT we should buy. Thanks!

So, I own Marriott (just one now) Westin (WKORV) and Worldmark (2)

I bought Marriott to trade (MGR 3br) I'll probably never go there...unless I get some grankiddies soon.
I bought the WKORV to occupy; too expensive to trade and too hard to exchange into Maui (consistently)
I bought the Worldmark to play with and trade and give kiddies some vacations.

The Marriott is a fantastic trader. I'm very pleased. Flexibility is required. School days and limited vacation could be difficult. Depends on the dates/locations. If you're less choosy.... you can find a boatload of options. Pick one weekend in Hawaii in July...you'll be disappointed. It's a great option for trading.

The Westin is what we wanted: Oceanfront, large and premium. Would be a lousy solution for you because it's in Hawaii. But, another Westin/Sheraton with points might be a good option. Good flexibility and good trading. It's a thought.

The Worldmarks. Well, they continue to amaze me. They trade for fantastic trades at prices that are difficult to comprehend.(they are cheap)

If you can't decide and don't want to commit to something large, expensive, difficult to move etc..... Get a Worldmark and play. Easy to buy, easy to trade, easy to use, easy to sell. Not a bunch of east coast 'native' locations, so you'd be trading. But hey, it's a start that won't break the bank....and you can really make a few good vacations a year.


Like I say: If you're worried about sinking thousands into purchase, thousands into MF's, then grab something cheap (WM in this case) and give it a go. Or, maybe a Vistana with at least 81k points (better would be 144k) and take the kids some where fun every year. That's not too much $$$$ and if you're smart, you'll be able to slide into or out of the purchase without a herculean effort.

cheers.
 

elaine

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I suggest getting a trader that you are happy traveling to EOY. Also consider airfare. A “drive to” location saves a lot of $ for 5. And vacation styles can change. We bought 2 non-marriott resale east coast summer beach weeks and then 5 years later our kids didn’t like the beach anymore. Luckily a high value trader.
 

PhilaMom

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Thanks again for your replies. We have lots to chew on. But I’m excited thinking about the vacation possibilities! Will have to do some price comparison reasearch now.
 

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I believe in buy where you want to own. If you want flexibility, the best way IMO is to buy into a points program like MVC or Vistana or others. I have converted all my weeks into points to have the most options and flexibility, since that is important to me.
 

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349
Location
Calera, OK
I believe in buy where you want to own. If you want flexibility, the best way IMO is to buy into a points program like MVC or Vistana or others. I have converted all my weeks into points to have the most options and flexibility, since that is important to me.

But, how is converting to points buying where you want to own? Unless you consider points as everywhere.
 
Joined
Jan 8, 2019
Messages
799
Reaction score
475
Points
73
Location
St. Louis
Resorts Owned
Welk Resorts
For me, points let's me stay where I want and for how long I want in the size unit I want without having to make sure I get a great lock off at a prime resort.
I can take a 7 night in a two BR or multiple 3-5 night stays in a studio or 1BR or even roll my points/borrow from the next year and get a 3-4BR.
 
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