True Value of an Exchange

[Carolinian]

How do you figure the developer knows anything about trading value in the Weeks system? I know of no basis for such a claim. I have never seen anything that would indicate that anybody other than the exchange company would know that.

You say changes will occur in RCI Points numbers? Then WHY haven't they for Points resorts as long as RCI Points has existed????

Actually a company that tries to sluff off inventory to rent to the general public would want the system not to be in balance, so that they can claim that there is an excess. The old conflict of interest from the rentals rears its ugly head again! A system that wants to divert inventory for other uses thrives on imbalance, not balance.

Are trade values dynamic? Of course! anyone who has ever used the system knows that both the trading power of deposits and of the weeks you are after changes. Right after a bulkbanking, for example, when the system is flush with inventory it is much easier to trade into that resort than usual.

If that November beach week you speak about happens to be Thanksgiving it will get an exchange a lot of places that a great many weeks from overbuilt places like Orlando will not.

When one can look at the numbers in a system and see it full of fraud, how is that supposed to make someone want to use such a system?

The developer scam usually comes from the PUBLISHED aspects of the RCI system - like ''all weeks in Orlando are red, so you have great trading power''.
The fact that it is public is what makes it impossible for RCI to change it to make it honest by setting some as blue or white. The developers would scream if they did that. The public portion is the problem not the nonpublished part.

Why are you so opposed to publishing the formula and data for establishing numbers??? You want to publish the results, so why not the whole picture????
Is it because publishing that information would mean that RCI could no longer overpoint places like Orlando?? A secret formula and data benefits certain people - those whose resorts are now overpointed like in overbuilt areas.

Overaveraged, underaveraged, middle aged, secretly or publically detirmined it makes no difference IF YOU KNOW THE RESULTS! Then you the buyer can decide if the resort/area/product is a value or not. If RCI or any system overvalues resorts or areas then the users are going to avoid that area and leave a surplus of time. If they undervalue it the users will flock to it and they will get complaints that it is unavailable. Any system thrives when the demand and supply are in balance. That is what a published system allows. The users to decide if the "price is right" or not. Changes will occur, in public, to get the system in balance.

With the weeks secret society approach only the developers and the exchange companies really know what value they are assigning. No one can say if the values under that system are as dynamic as you say or if they were set in the computer in 1990 and never altered since. We don't know so when we hear "Your trade power is (fill in the blank) ___________ (good) (poor) (OK)" we have to accept it. Talk about the power to manipulate!

While a published system may not be perfect it is far superior to a totally hidden system that has led to the unbelievable amount of owners sold an impossible dream by the slick sales people and the "you can trade anywhere with this November beach unit" garbage. If there was a low number published next to that week and high numbers published next to those weeks they dream of trading into do you think that wouldn't be painfully obvious it couldn't work that way? That, and only that, is the reason they keep it secret. It doesn't and can't benefit the owners.

 

[Carolinian]

I have posted before that for a points system to be honest it has to be dynamic, and it can't be dynamic if it depends on paper and ink publication.
Only electronic publication can do that. Electronic publication could also cure the space problem with a paper and ink system that requires the overarveraging. Yet no points system is all electonic.

The key again, is publication of the formula and data that numbers are computed on to keep the developers from politicking the exchange company.
I know this will make the numbers come down from those areas now overpointed, which will be painful for some, but it is necessary to keep the system honest.

Also ''new'' is a minor driver of demand, but is dwarfed by location. The newest GC resort on the OBX is also the lowest demanded, by far, due to its location far from the beach. Older beachfront resorts with fewer bells and whistles have far more demand. The key drivers of demand are location, location, and location.

Would it be better if RCI would come up with a point value list of all the timeshare resorts (week and point-based) that exchange with RCI for a daily occupancy for all sizes of accommodations? In that case, people can decide immediately if their timeshare is valued properly for them and if they want to go ahead and deposit it or not. I am aware that supply and demand changes constantly but a smart computer system knows exactly what is in the inventory pool and what exchanges have been requested so should be able to give a current point value instantaneously. This would be fair to all members and it doesn't matter what you own (a week or points).

Also, new developers will get a high point value for their new resorts because they are up to date and in excellent condition and will get more points yet if the area is not saturated and the resort is in a prime location. Developers will have an incentive to start building in other popular areas too. Just a thought.

 

[timeos2]

The key drivers of demand are location, location, and location.

Not if the location, location, location is in an area (or time of year) no one wants! What is a great location in July may not be so good in February. So location alone cannot tell the whole story.

 

[timeos2]

A meaningful class action

Why are you so opposed to publishing the formula and data for establishing numbers??? You want to publish the results, so why not the whole picture????
Is it because publishing that information would mean that RCI could no longer overpoint places like Orlando?? A secret formula and data benefits certain people - those whose resorts are now overpointed like in overbuilt areas.

I'm not. Publish it all. But for both weeks and points. I believe we'd quickly discover that the same numbers are being used in both cases.

I'll go one better. Let's get a class action going to do some good. Make RCI disclose the trade values - how they get them and what they are - for every resort, every week. Then we'd have something of value to all owners, buyers and sellers. That's a class action worth fighting for.

 

[PerryM]

Evidence, there is none

Carolinian,

As I’ve said multiple times, the independent CPA auditors find no accounting irregularities at RCI – if they had even the slightest doubt of anything in the company they would not sign off. I would trust the independent auditors.

I think that what the rumors floating around here indicate is a lack of access to the accounting system buried in the RCI computers. I have no reason the doubt what has been said by Bootleg, but my proposed accounting of Trading Power can easily explain the sightings – as I demonstrated. That accounting system is hidden, just like Trading Power.

There isn’t a shred of evidence reported by the news media that support any of these wild rumors – not one reporter has found anything. That is another nail in the coffin for these baseless lawsuits.

To compare what RCI may or may not have done with Enron is just another wild speculation backed up by no supporting evidence of independent auditors or an independent press. Whistler blowers make their first stop at the news outlets – where are the stories?

Nope, voodoo accounting is going to try to be presented to the courts as proof. Whether the jurors are infested with bumpkins remains to be seen.

 

[taffy19]

I'm not. Publish it all. But for both weeks and points. I believe we'd quickly discover that the same numbers are being used in both cases.

I'll go one better. Let's get a class action going to do some good. Make RCI disclose the trade values - how they get them and what they are - for every resort, every week. Then we'd have something of value to all owners, buyers and sellers. That's a class action worth fighting for.

How can you do it for a week if point owners can go just for one night only or has it to be for a few nights minimum? I am not sure about that.

That's why I mentioned a daily point value. I know that the week-based system is mainly for weeks only but there are exceptions here too. Most are weeks and if you cut your week short that is tough luck if you leave early. RCI is not at fault here.

 

[JudyS]

To the Original Poster, Midlife Traveler (if you're still here!) Like many others, I am suspicious of what RCI is doing with its exchange inventory, and wondering why good trades are so hard to find in RCI Weeks. That said, I think the problem that you are encountering was caused by OLCC, not by RCI. There are just way too many timeshare units available in Orlando, especially in the fall. OLCC sold you a week where there is a ton of supply and only so-so demand. OLCC probably didn't lie to you outright -- the week is red, and the resort is Gold Crown -- but those things don't necessarily add to trade power. (In fact, many TUG members feel that Gold Crown status reduces members' abilities to get trades.)

Most of the time you want to use your OLCC week, so that is good. The other years, have you considered trying to rent it out? I'm sure other families in your town would also like to go to Disney during Jersey Week. Is there some place locally that you could advertise your week?

Also, OLCC is moving towards a points-based system. I believe the cost to convert to points is $1295, and is scheduled to go up to $1995 soon. If might make sense to convert to points. The issues are, "Will you get enough points for the amount of annual fees that you pay?" and "Will you get enough use out of the system to justify the conversion fee?" I'd suggest starting a new thread on this on the Points boad, since this thread has gotten off-topic.

 

[Joe M]

... RCI puts some of the prime week exchange deposits into their rental pool immediately when they are deposited by members, and these deposits have nothing to do with cruises, points partners, etc...

Please recall a previous comment from Madge:

Some of the units you see in Extra Vacations that aren't available for exchange were obtained via Cruise Exchanges or Points Partner reservations. Because these vacations were not deposited for the purpose of exchanging, they are not available as exchange vacations. (Note: It is possible that the units are comparable units being offered in place of the actual units that were traded if they were already assigned when the member requested the cruise, etc.)

The direct movement of deposits into the rental pool mentioned by Bootleg may very well related to points or cruises. You may feel that RCI should not have the option of choosing this comparable unit and I can understand that opinion. However we do not know for sure that these rentals are not related to points transactions or cruise exchange.

It works like this:

Case 1...I deposit my SA week into Weeks and remove a summer OBX week. I know that I have the trade power to do so.

Case 2...I deposit my SA week and convert it to Points. I use my points for air tickets. My SA week is taken in trade as, per your own admission, it is very popular with Europeans. Therefore, RCI cannot rent my SA deposit as it is already spoken for. Instead, to pay for my air tickets RCI moves an incoming OBX deposit (like the one I could have traded for) into the rental pool.

Net result of Case 1 is exactly the same as Case 2. One SA week into the Weeks pool, one OBX week out of the Weeks pool.

 

[JudyS]

...As I’ve said multiple times, the independent CPA auditors find no accounting irregularities at RCI – if they had even the slightest doubt of anything in the company they would not sign off. I would trust the independent auditors....

But have the independent auditors actually said that all owner-deposited weeks are made available for exchange? Do they even look at this, now that RCI has snuck language into their contracts saying that they can do whatever they want with deposited weeks? And, where can RCI members get the results of these audits?



I'm not a lawyer and I have no idea whether the class action will suceed. I do have the following comments, though.

First, I accept the fact that RCI isn't holding a gun to people's heads and forcing them to join. However, I think this is irrelevant. The real issue, it seems to me, is whether RCI is misrepresenting what they do with deposited weeks. If they lead members to believe that deposited weeks are made available for exchange, and then rent out the weeks instead, that's a misrepresentation.

I think that, even if RCI puts in the small print that they can do whatever they like with deposited weeks, they are clearly implying that deposited weeks are made available for exchange. If not, then why would people join? "Hi, we're RCI! Give us your valuable timeshare week, pay us $89 every year, and we'll, um, take your week and make money with it and give you nothing! Sign up now!" There is a presumption that when people engage in a business transaction, they do so because they hope to get something out of it. I think RCI would have a hard time arguing that members would give them their weeks, knowing that other members' weeks would just be appropriated by RCI and not be available for trades.

Second, I also do not like the characterisation of the typical American citizen as a "bumpkin." However, regardless of one's opinion of the typical juror, I'm not so sure that jurors would be hostile to "rich" timeshare owners with their "5 star" (not an RCI term, by the way) resorts. I think it would be hard to get a jury where everyone has a postive, or even neutral, view of timeshares. RCI might be able to exclude timeshare owners, but I doubt they could exclude everyone who has had a bad timeshare tour experience, or who has a close friend or relative who was ripped off in timesharing. The jury might start off suspicious of, or even hostile too, RCI.

Third, if the the class action made RCI more transparent and gave its members information on how exchanges work, that in itself would be very valuable. I'm with John on this one.

 

[PerryM]

Auditors audit

JudyS,

THE main business of RCI is exchanging reservations. They branched out into airline tickets for RCI Points and thus all of these areas are open to the independent auditors for inspection. If the auditors found any irregularities they would report them as required by their profession. To assume that the auditors blissfully ignore certain key areas is why these lawsuits still have legs.

My whimsical take on bumpkins is that these folks exist everywhere – we have all met bumpkins in our life – these are the folks who don’t have a lick of common sense and seem to infest our courts as jurors. When I read about some of the wacky verdicts returned I know that there were bumpkins on that jury.

Look at all the trials overturned by DNA evidence – the bumpkins on that jury were obviously wrong – how many folks have been put to death with bumpkins sitting in judgment? I’m not saying that all jurors are bumpkins but there are quite a few out there deciding the future of our country.

The courts have amply demonstrated that the jury system of trials is flawed – however, we just don’t have a better solution yet.

 

[Carolinian]

Not if the location, location, location is in an area (or time of year) no one wants! What is a great location in July may not be so good in February. So location alone cannot tell the whole story.

Not the whole story, but most of it on the demand side!

 

[Carolinian]

At least one Tugger with auditing expereince (I have none) has responded to you before that an auditor would crunch the numbers on this matter based on the guidelines set up by RCI. If the guidelines themselves were screwy, the audit would not reveal that. So this independent audit really tells you nothing.

You probably trusted the Sunterra auditors, too, didn't you? But look where their audits have gotten them in the last few months - suspended from the stock market!

Reports in the news media???!!! Why in the world do you think the news media would be digging around in such matters? The digging that will be done will be in the discovery process in the lawsuit. The news media could not even have access to the documents that RCI will be required to turn over in discovery. Personally, I would bet that they find a lot. In the Bluebeards Castle HOAs lawsuit against Fairfield, discovery produced evidence of another $10 million owed by Fairfield that they hadn't known about when they filed the lawsuit.

Whistle blowers do not necessarily make their first stop at the news media.
Look at former Sunterra exec turned whistleblower Ian Podesta, who has brought Sunterra to its knees. He didn't touch the traditional news media.
He went after Sunterra on the internet, and, hey, it worked didn't it? Nick Benson, the fired Sunterra CEO, probably rues the day he decided to fight Podesta instead of trying to reform when he had the chance. Podesta gave him that opportunity.

RCI in the future might also be ruing the day it decided to fight rather than reform.

Don't be expecting a lot of stories in the news media. As discovery in a lawsuit progresses, this stuff in NOT splashed all over the newspapers.
And it is voodoo accounting that RCI, like Sunterra, is probably going to try to put up as a defense. And it probably won't work.

Are the judges who rule with plaintiffs, such as in the Bluebeards HOA lawsuit, also bumpkins in your mind?

Carolinian,

As I’ve said multiple times, the independent CPA auditors find no accounting irregularities at RCI – if they had even the slightest doubt of anything in the company they would not sign off. I would trust the independent auditors.

I think that what the rumors floating around here indicate is a lack of access to the accounting system buried in the RCI computers. I have no reason the doubt what has been said by Bootleg, but my proposed accounting of Trading Power can easily explain the sightings – as I demonstrated. That accounting system is hidden, just like Trading Power.

There isn’t a shred of evidence reported by the news media that support any of these wild rumors – not one reporter has found anything. That is another nail in the coffin for these baseless lawsuits.

To compare what RCI may or may not have done with Enron is just another wild speculation backed up by no supporting evidence of independent auditors or an independent press. Whistler blowers make their first stop at the news outlets – where are the stories?

Nope, voodoo accounting is going to try to be presented to the courts as proof. Whether the jurors are infested with bumpkins remains to be seen.

 

[Carolinian]

The whole ability of these Points people to take Weeks inventory is one of the issues underlying the lawsuit. If the lawsuit is successful, RCI will not be able to loot Weeks inventory to prop up Points. The fact that they are now doing so is a massive ripoff of their Weeks members. Hopefully the courts will bring that to a screeching halt.

The very first ananlysis of RCI Points in the timeshare media was the front page article by Sing Li on the subject in Timesharing Today. In it he warned that the biggest problem ahead was what he termed ''magic balancing'' between the systems. He was right. And now we have the class action lawsuit to hopefully correct it.

And I look at summer southeastern beach with various exchange deposits frequently. I can pull summer OBX with my tiger European trader, but early June is the best I have ever found occaisionally with one of my SA weeks on the OBX. I have pulled a fair amount in summer HHI and occaisionally summer Va. Beach, but never OBX or Myrtle Beach with an SA. Summer starts in the middle of June.

As to citing Madge, she is a source more of corporate spin than of information.

Please recall a previous comment from Madge:

Some of the units you see in Extra Vacations that aren't available for exchange were obtained via Cruise Exchanges or Points Partner reservations. Because these vacations were not deposited for the purpose of exchanging, they are not available as exchange vacations. (Note: It is possible that the units are comparable units being offered in place of the actual units that were traded if they were already assigned when the member requested the cruise, etc.)

The direct movement of deposits into the rental pool mentioned by Bootleg may very well related to points or cruises. You may feel that RCI should not have the option of choosing this comparable unit and I can understand that opinion. However we do not know for sure that these rentals are not related to points transactions or cruise exchange.

It works like this:

Case 1...I deposit my SA week into Weeks and remove a summer OBX week. I know that I have the trade power to do so.

Case 2...I deposit my SA week and convert it to Points. I use my points for air tickets. My SA week is taken in trade as, per your own admission, it is very popular with Europeans. Therefore, RCI cannot rent my SA deposit as it is already spoken for. Instead, to pay for my air tickets RCI moves an incoming OBX deposit (like the one I could have traded for) into the rental pool.

Net result of Case 1 is exactly the same as Case 2. One SA week into the Weeks pool, one OBX week out of the Weeks pool.

 

[timeos2]

Finding and collecting aren't always the same

In the Bluebeards Castle HOAs lawsuit against Fairfield, discovery produced evidence of another $10 million owed by Fairfield that they hadn't known about when they filed the lawsuit.

Are the judges who rule with plaintiffs, such as in the Bluebeards HOA lawsuit, also bumpkins in your mind?

Two different times making a possible "discovery" or a pretrial ruling to be "facts". Nothing they discover or a judge says can be included in a proceding necessarily means it will hold up should this actually come to trial. Until there is a court decision stating that the HOA gets this and FF has to pay that assuming that either side wins or loses is a big assumption with zero basis in fact. They can discover all the millions due they want. Until the court says FF has to pay - or it is settled by the parties - they are counting unhatched chickens.

 

[Carolinian]

Oh, it WILL come to trial. The judge has already set a trial date, as well as ruling for the HOAs on a raft of pre-trial motions including injunctive relief against Fairfield.

Two different times making a possible "discovery" or a pretrial ruling to be "facts". Nothing they discover or a judge says can be included in a proceding necessarily means it will hold up should this actually come to trial. Until there is a court decision stating that the HOA gets this and FF has to pay that assuming that either side wins or loses is a big assumption with zero basis in fact. They can discover all the millions due they want. Until the court says FF has to pay - or it is settled by the parties - they are counting unhatched chickens.

 

[PerryM]

In conclusion...

As much as I love politics, this chat room isn’t the venue to continue the debate on the legal system.

To summarize my position and my final post on this thread (anyone changed their mind on this topic?):

Stockholders see no evil:
Stockholders are full of lawyers patrolling for weaknesses to sue the corporations they own stocks in. This is a great sign that nothing is wrong.

Independent, outside, CPA firms, see no evil:
Exchanging reservations is the MAIN business of RCI, of course the auditors audit these areas. The lack of scathing audits on RCI’s practices is a great sign that nothing is wrong.

Whistleblowers see no evil:
Where are the whistleblowers? They don’t exist, a good sign that nothing is wrong. I'm talking about folks who are in the right place to have evidence, in writing, of wrong doings.

News organizations see no evil:
Where are the hard hitting reporters? None have found even a slight hint of wrong doing. This is a great sign, nothing wrong here.


Lawyers will make everything ok:
Against all this, only conspiracy theories can explain why folks can’t get the ideal exchange they want. Come on guys these guys are not here to help with anything but fill their pockets with cash that we RCI members will be paying for.

Can bumpkins be found to support guilty verdicts or findings in favor of a plaintive? Of course they can. Doesn’t mean RCI is doing anything wrong.

 

[Carolinian]

1. Stockholders only get geared up to sue if the wrongs cost them money. That only happened at Sunterra after the info on other wrongs caused their stock to go south.

2. The Sunterra (former) auditors saw no evil either. Yet the mess has really hit the fan there.

3. Whistleblowers have given info here and on other internet boards. Hopefully they have also taken what they have to the class action attorneys, where it will do the most good under wraps until deployed in the most effective way. Bootleg diappeared from the timeshare boards about the time the lawsuits were filed. Most people thought RCI had either found him out or was searching more thoroughly for him because of the suits so he went to ground. Suppose instead, he made what he had availible to the class action attorneys and they told him to keep quiet until the proper time. With a lawsuit in progress, the attorneys are going to want to use any whistleblowers at the appropriate time for their case.

4. There is not a thing to suggest that any reporters have even looked, and if they haven't looked, of course they haven't found anything!

5. Common sense tells you that if inventory is rented out, there will be less there to trade for. This is hardly a ''conspiracy theory''!

6. Jurors in this case will come from New Jersey, an urbanized state. Calling them ''bumpkins'' is simply not accurate.

As much as I love politics, this chat room isn’t the venue to continue the debate on the legal system.

To summarize my position and my final post on this thread (anyone changed their mind on this topic?):

Stockholders see no evil:
Stockholders are full of lawyers patrolling for weaknesses to sue the corporations they own stocks in. This is a great sign that nothing is wrong.

Independent, outside, CPA firms, see no evil:
Exchanging reservations is the MAIN business of RCI, of course the auditors audit these areas. The lack of scathing audits on RCI’s practices is a great sign that nothing is wrong.

Whistleblowers see no evil:
Where are the whistleblowers? They don’t exist, a good sign that nothing is wrong. I'm talking about folks who are in the right place to have evidence, in writing, of wrong doings.

News organizations see no evil:
Where are the hard hitting reporters? None have found even a slight hint of wrong doing. This is a great sign, nothing wrong here.


Lawyers will make everything ok:
Against all this, only conspiracy theories can explain why folks can’t get the ideal exchange they want. Come on guys these guys are not here to help with anything but fill their pockets with cash that we RCI members will be paying for.

Can bumpkins be found to support guilty verdicts or findings in favor of a plaintive? Of course they can. Doesn’t mean RCI is doing anything wrong.

 

[Dean]

gmarine:

Unfortunately, I'm only just realizing the REAL trading power issue. It's unfortunate that I did not understand exactly how it worked at the time I purchased the unit. The week number itself was left out of the equation and the concept was sold on the "rare 3 bedroom, gold crown, many amenities,etc". It is unfair for me to have to wait 2 years, however, and line up behind rentals! Maybe RCI can do as they wish with the weeks but this only motivates people to rent or guest their weeks to friends, which only further depletes inventory and is of no benefit to RCI or owners!.

I know I'm getting in late but I think you're getting a skewed view. While some people believe that RCI is renting out weeks which should be destined for exchange, there is no real evidence to prove that that I have seen. And while posting by anonymous employees would not be enough to convince me, I have never seen either of those two RCI employes (or former employees) specifically state on TUG that RCI is indeed diverting legitimate deposits to the rental system. I tend to agree with Perry that the auditors would pick it up but also know that's not specifically what they are auditing.

But there are legitimate sources of rentals as well and these include points traded for weeks exchanges and anything traded for cash equivalent options. You should also know that your position in line while waiting for that exchange is always being reshuffled. So if there are two people in line and the person ahead of you gets their exchange and someone else joins your line, they may move ahead of you. For a low season Orlando week, this is very likely. But there are ways to maximize you options and you need to figure out what those are for your situation.

 

[Dean]

Except, that like anything RCI makes public, the season codes are bent. Every week in overbuilt Orlando or the Canary Islands red??? What a laugh!
And size alone doesn't really matter. A hotel unit in London or New York is always going to be far more valuable than the largest unit availible in Orlando.

The factors that determine what is an equal trade are supply and demand. Period.

I know I have had blue and white week trades in Europe that I have been tickled to give my red week elsewhere for. There are blue and white weeks in Europe that have far better supply/demand dynamics that most weeks in Orlando, which are aribtrarily all called red.

The factors that determine trade power for II include the resort rating/demand, demand of the week, size of the unit, how far out it was deposited and any home resort or internal trading preferences. The last two being far less important to trade power itself. I'd assume they are similar with RCI. Given that this is a general rating system and assuming that the exchange companies don't want to micromanage this issue, I wouldn't be surprised if there are some non red weeks/resorts that have a higher trade power than a specific red week/resort. But the implication that there is an agenda behind it, as you've suggested previously, is very suspect at best and I think is highly unlikely but you never know. I find you make way to many assumptions about WHICH factors have the most impact on trade power. Either you know a lot of info that most of the rest of us do not have any access to or you have your personal opinions and experience that you are attempting to present as fact.

 

[Carolinian]

Bootleg has specifically stated that here, and Anon has on TimeshareTalk (see the Ask RCI Insider thread).

I know I'm getting in late but I think you're getting a skewed view. While some people believe that RCI is renting out weeks which should be destined for exchange, there is no real evidence to prove that that I have seen. And while posting by anonymous employees would not be enough to convince me, I have never seen either of those two RCI employes (or former employees) specifically state on TUG that RCI is indeed diverting legitimate deposits to the rental system. I tend to agree with Perry that the auditors would pick it up but also know that's not specifically what they are auditing.

But there are legitimate sources of rentals as well and these include points traded for weeks exchanges and anything traded for cash equivalent options. You should also know that your position in line while waiting for that exchange is always being reshuffled. So if there are two people in line and the person ahead of you gets their exchange and someone else joins your line, they may move ahead of you. For a low season Orlando week, this is very likely. But there are ways to maximize you options and you need to figure out what those are for your situation.

 

[Dean]

Bootleg has specifically stated that here, and Anon has on TimeshareTalk (see the Ask RCI Insider thread).

I haven't seen it on TUG and when we've discussed this issue before, you've never quoted bootleg saying it that I recall, only stated that he had said it previously. He would certainly have had the opportunity to confirm this on more than one occasion as well as on this thread. I'm not a member of Timeshare talk and haven't any plans to be one. Regardless, as I stated above, it would take more than one former and one current employee even specifically agreeing with this issue to convince me, maybe I'm just TOO cynical. It may or may not be accurate but I would not consider this sufficient proof. Even then, renting out high demand weeks/resorts is not the same as diverting units specifically targeted for the exchange system.

 

[Carolinian]

If you had kept up, Bootleg vanished from the three t/s boards he was posting on several months ago, and his email address went dead about the same time. The theories were: 1) that he had been id'ed by RCI or outed to RCI by a pro-RCI staff member at one of the websites, 2) that because of the lawsuits, RCI's search for people like Bootleg had gone into high gear and he went to ground to avoid being id'ed, 3) that he was providing info to help out on the lawsuits and the attorneys, naturally would want him to keep info useful for the lawsuits close to the vest for now. His sudden vanishing act and the timing of it, coming shortly after the filing of the lawsuits, certainly do raise some questions.

Bootleg initially brought this info in question forward in a private email to another Tugger, and he subsequnetly gave permission to that Tugger to post in on the old TUG boards.

I only quote Anon from TimeshareTalk, because his bonafides have been checked out. There are others who say they work for RCI that post similar info there, such as TripleTim and Timesharecrook. One of them did post a screen shot from RCI's computer of a prime exchange deposit diverted to rental, and Bootleg confirmed that it had all the info of an RCI screeen but was compressed.

With this and the scads of circumstantial evidence out there, I think would would not like to have you on a jury if I had the burden of proof, but would love to have you on the jury if I were representing the defense.

I haven't seen it on TUG and when we've discussed this issue before, you've never quoted bootleg saying it that I recall, only stated that he had said it previously. He would certainly have had the opportunity to confirm this on more than one occasion as well as on this thread. I'm not a member of Timeshare talk and haven't any plans to be one. Regardless, as I stated above, it would take more than one former and one current employee even specifically agreeing with this issue to convince me, maybe I'm just TOO cynical. It may or may not be accurate but I would not consider this sufficient proof. Even then, renting out high demand weeks/resorts is not the same as diverting units specifically targeted for the exchange system.

 

[Dean]

If you had kept up, Bootleg vanished from the three t/s boards he was posting on several months ago, and his email address went dead about the same time. The theories were: 1) that he had been id'ed by RCI or outed to RCI by a pro-RCI staff member at one of the websites, 2) that because of the lawsuits, RCI's search for people like Bootleg had gone into high gear and he went to ground to avoid being id'ed, 3) that he was providing info to help out on the lawsuits and the attorneys, naturally would want him to keep info useful for the lawsuits close to the vest for now. His sudden vanishing act and the timing of it, coming shortly after the filing of the lawsuits, certainly do raise some questions.

Bootleg initially brought this info in question forward in a private email to another Tugger, and he subsequnetly gave permission to that Tugger to post in on the old TUG boards.

I only quote Anon from TimeshareTalk, because his bonafides have been checked out. There are others who say they work for RCI that post similar info there, such as TripleTim and Timesharecrook. One of them did post a screen shot from RCI's computer of a prime exchange deposit diverted to rental, and Bootleg confirmed that it had all the info of an RCI screeen but was compressed.

With this and the scads of circumstantial evidence out there, I think would would not like to have you on a jury if I had the burden of proof, but would love to have you on the jury if I were representing the defense.

I didn't know he had left, I don't have time to read everything. I did know it was a question a few months back. Sorry to hear that, I felt he was an asset. I'd make a great juror either way if the truth were the issue.

 

[Carolinian]

Dean - I agree. Bootleg has been a tremendous asset to all of the t/s boards he has participated in. He has provided a lot of useful info, and always seemed a straight shooter - neither being an apologist for his company nor with an axe to grind with it either. He called as he saw them. I hope when whatever circumstances caused him to depart have changed that we will see him back.

 

["Roger"]

I realize that at this point there are probably only three people left reading this thread (that might be a generous estimate), but just in case ...

The following thread exemplifies two of the deep rooted problems with the way in which trading power is currently administered within the Weeks system
The wonders of the Weeks trading power system

1. One person deposited her week, found out that it had low trading power, asked for it back (and, in this case, was able to get it) and then redeposited the unit. The second time around, it had much improved trading power.
   
   How could that happen (apart from some dirty dealings)? Easy. If the first time the person deposited her week coincided with when a number of other owners of the same resort or a number of other South Africa owners deposited their weeks, by the dynamic formula of supply and demand, the trading power would be reduced (high supply). And once the trading power of a deposit is set, it stays fixed.
   
   But why would a whole bunch of people deposit their weeks about the same time? There are a number of possibilities: Maintenence fees due. Time of year. (People are beginning to think of their next year's vacation.) Etc.
   
2. Several people think that RCI has mistakenly assigned the incorrect trading power to their unit. Given that the interface between RCI North America and RCI South Africa is shakey at best, that could well be. Unfortumately, since the trading power is kept secret, the owners have no way of documenting what they suspect to be true.

There is a third negative consequence of the Weeks secret trading power system reflected within that thread. Aldo presumes that there must be dirty dealing. When things happen in secret (and, when going to places like TUG you read messages about "loose lips sink ships" -- that is, here are some ways to manipulate the system that we need to keep secret), suspicions of dirty dealings are inevitable.

All of this, so that developers can tell someone that there red, three bedroom (in November) has great trading power.