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TS or Points System, or neither?

Discussion in 'New to Timesharing? Look Here!' started by ChaeTwo, May 14, 2018.

  1. ChaeTwo

    ChaeTwo Guest

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    1) Is there a vacation destination you wish to visit most of the time or on a regular basis? if so where?
    We have traveled several places and want to continue exploring new paces.

    2) Do you want to visit your home resort at least half the time, or do you want to trade more than half the time? at least half time- our boys are 6 and 9 so a little bit of stability would be good, but we want to explore a lot, too.

    3) What are your 5 top trade destinations?
    Hawaii, Europe, Florida, any cool new places

    4) How many people do you usually travel with? Varies! Either just my husband and me, or with our boys, or extended family, or take another couple with the two of us.

    5) Can you travel any time, or are you locked into the school schedule?
    Travel anytime without our kids, school schedule for when we take the boys.

    6) Can you make firm plans 12 or more mos. in advance?
    Yes

    7) Can you vacation for a full week at a time?
    Yes. We each get 3 weeks a year, so we'd like to travel at least two of them.

    8) What level of accommodations do you prefer on a scale of 1 to 5 stars?
    3-5

    9) How much can you afford to spend upfront, without financing?
    about 5k easily, don't want to spend more than that

    10) How much can you afford to spend every year for a maintenance fee that will come due right after Christmas, and increase each year?
    about $800 - 1500

    11) Are you a detail oriented planner?
    mostly

    12) Do you understand that once you buy a timeshare, it may be very difficult to sell or give away, and you are responsible for all fees, until you do? yes

    We bought over the weekend with Hilton, and I like their points system, but have no idea if it really is as easy to navigate as they say. (Obviously we are rescinding now that we are home and doing our homework. My husband is doing that while I research options.) Looking through here I am overwhelmed and have no idea what system, if any, would fit us. I need some advice and expertise! Thoughts?
     
  2. Passepartout

    Passepartout TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Your last paragraph pretty well nails it. For now, I'd advise renting timeshares. Primarily for the variety and to educate yourselves. Hang around TUG for 6 months or so before buying ANYTHING. I think that your budget for annual expenses is a little light for 3-5 star 2 bedrooms (that's the size you will need as the family grows) and 5 stars are just the hotel branded TSs like Hilton, Marriott, Hyatt. 3+ stars are going to be Wyndhams and the like (I wonder what 4- stars are?)

    The buy-in cost at resale is very do-able, so that kind of helps the annual nut. Remember, since you want to trade (we call it exchanging) there are additional costs to join exchanges, each exchange costs $200-$300, plus traveling expenses. You have to figure those expenses in.

    So good luck. Stick around. You'll learn a lot.

    Welcome to TUG!

    Jim
     
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  3. ChaeTwo

    ChaeTwo Guest

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    Thank you Jim, that is helpful!
     
  4. VacationForever

    VacationForever Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    If you buy a points system timeshare, there is no additional exchange fee when booking within the same system.
     
  5. ChaeTwo

    ChaeTwo Guest

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    Do you find it is fairly easy to book what you want as long as it is in advance?
     
  6. VacationForever

    VacationForever Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    It depends where and which system. I do not know enough about Hilton to answer that question. I am very familiar with Marriott, Vistana and Worldmark. Marriott has a point system that is very expensive to get into and very flexible and you can get pretty much what you want if you have enough points right at the 13th month. Its week system can only use II to trade. Vistana has many sub-systems. Worldmark is a pure points system.
     
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  7. GT75

    GT75 Moderator

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    For HGVC, there will be a fee ($65-80) to book during the club season.

    HGVC club is actually a very good points based system (IMO). It is fairly easy to book when the club window opens, as long as you have some flexibility.
     
  8. ChaeTwo

    ChaeTwo Guest

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    Is there anywhere I can see how many points it costs to book at different resorts at different times? For instance will a 2 bedroom in Orlando high season be fewer points than a 2 bedroom in Hawaii, or is it the same price but one is just harder to get? I am unsure how many points I would want.
     
  9. K2Quick

    K2Quick TUG Member

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    I'd classify most Hilton/Marriott/Hyatt timeshares as 4-star resorts with each of them having a few 3- and 5-star resorts in the mix. 5-star properties would be limited to very high-end accomodations like the Four Seasons.
     
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  10. VacationForever

    VacationForever Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    Got it. It is free to book witihn Marriott, Vistana and Worldmark point systems.
     
  11. ChaeTwo

    ChaeTwo Guest

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    Are Marriott, Vistana, and Worldmark part of the same system? How do I find points/properties in that line? I have found Hilton points available to purchase but not sure about anything else.
     
  12. geist1223

    geist1223 Guest

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    Point System provide variety and options. But in almost all of them you have to be able to plan and Book 12 to 13 months in advance. Unless you like to call and ask what is available in 2 months and simply take whatever is available. Deeded Weeks have 2 varieties. Pure Deeded Week. You are at the same Resort for the same week every year, unless you get into trading. Deeded Week but with float Booking. The float can be by Season or 50 to 52 weeks of the year. This type also involves advanced planning.

    You have to analysis your vacation habits. We have had several friends fail at Timesharing because they did not understand their vacation habits or did not take the time to learn the system they bought into.

    They are not part of the same system. Worldmark Points can be bought from Wyndham the developer, EBAY, on the Market Place on TUG, or at www.worldmarkowners.com/forum.
     
  13. ChaeTwo

    ChaeTwo Guest

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    Thank you so much, this has been very helpful. Is there somewhere that I can see what a certain # of points buys you in each system? If I am looking to purchase 1000 or 5000 points, I don't know what that will get me and I don't then know if it fits what we need. Or if it is a good deal. I have looked but can't find charts like that.
     
  14. VacationForever

    VacationForever Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    3 separate systems. Marriott's point system is very expensive and out of your budget range. Vistana (Westin and Sheraton) point system can be acquired at a very low cost under $1,500 for one of their mandatory resorts - Sheraton Vistana Villages (Key West and Bella phases) to about $12-14K for Westin Kierland Villas (Platinum season) with annual club dues of $145. Worldmark is the most cost effective, owner and resale friendly system. It has more than 90 locations, mainly in the West Coast, and booking within the system into the 90+ locations is free. If you decide to trade outside of their system, then you will utilize II or RCI external exchange companies and pay membership and exchange fees.

    You need to learn about each system before deciding which one to buy - Vistana, Hilton, Hyatt, Marriott, Wyndham, Worldmark... to name a few. Go back to each sub-forum here on TUG and you can drill down to get more details for each system.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2018
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  15. Passepartout

    Passepartout TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    ALL the 'points' systems use some proprietary mystical number system You'd have to have owners of each system volunteer how many points it takes in each system- and it depends on size, season, and in some cases, view. For instance, I find that for us, using RCI points, I get 'acceptable' 1 bedroom units in high or shoulder season, for 35,000 points. 'Better', or bigger units can go for 60,000 points a week. And off season in more modest properties can be had for 7,000 or less- plus RCI's ubiquitous exchange fee.

    Jim
     
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  16. geist1223

    geist1223 Guest

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    You can go to www.worldmarktheclub.com. At the bottom of the page is Sitemap. When you scroll through the sitemap you will find each Resort listed. Pick a few and look at them. They will show you how many Worldmark Points for what sized Unit for each season. In the older resorts it will take you about 10,000 WM Points for a 2 Bedroom during high season. The newer resorts cost more. Their are New Zealand and Australian Resorts listed. You can only Book these directly if you buy Travelshare Points from the Developer. There is no direct correlation between different Point Systems. With Worldmark it will take you about 10,000 Worldmark Points to Book a 2 bedroom through RCI.
     
  17. TravelTime

    TravelTime TUG Member

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    I would never buy into Worldmark because it is a lower end product. I would recommend sticking with the major brands and picking what you can afford in upfront fees and annual MFs. Perhaps buying a week somewhere inexpensively and trading within II would be your best bet if you are on a tight budget.
     
  18. ChaeTwo

    ChaeTwo Guest

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    Thank you for all the info! It's a bigger world of options than I ever imagined, but it is starting to come together.
     
  19. Panina

    Panina TUG Review Crew: Expert TUG Member

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    Hilton could work for you. I would suggest a Hilton affiliate getting a desirable fixed week or flex winter week. In SW Florida they are on Marco Island, Sanibel, Captiva or Fort Myers, all highly desirable areas.

    At $5000 they are out there, I got them, but you have to look and be ready to buy when you see them as most desirable weeks cost more. Less desirable travel weeks cost less.

    I would also recommend an affiliate that trades in Interval International as they have a better quality of resorts to trade into. A pure hgvc week that is not an affiliate can only trade in HGVC or RCI thru HGVC.

    For example I own a week at Eagles Nest, Marco Island. I can use the week I have, I can become a hgvc member and get points the years I choose and trade within hgvc or through hgvc trade thru RCI, or I can trade directly with RCI or Interval International, or I can rent my week. I personally like the flexibility.
     
  20. K2Quick

    K2Quick TUG Member

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    That was my original thought when I first got into timesharing about ten years ago. I bought initially bought a cheap Starwood unit which I used exclusively to trade with II and that worked out really well. However, once my kids started getting to school age, I had to re-evaluate and find an option which would fit with school calendars and our geography. That led us to Worldmark. I thought that we'd end up using within the Worldmark system about 1/3 of the time and exchanging out the rest of the time, but that's really been flipped as I've enjoyed the Worldmark resorts a lot more than I thought I would.

    Here are the pros of Worldmark from my perspective:
    • They have the western U.S. and Canada blanketed with units. No other chain comes close to their coverage in the west. I especially like the proximity of the units to several national parks.
    • It is somewhat unique in being a 100% pure points play. I have equal footing access with other owners to every single WM unit when the booking window opens.
    • The units have been impeccably clean and furnishings kept up to date in my experience.
    • You can book anywhere from a day to as long as you'd like without having to worry about set check-in days, home-week booking periods, etc.
    • If you need more credits to book a reservation or you find yourself with too many you can't use, you can easily rent them in or out to other owners.
    • WM trades very well within both II and RCI. As long as a unit isn't within a Marriott or Starwood preference period, WM will be able to trade for the unit. If there are Marriott/Starwood units in the same area as a Worldmark, I'll reserve the WM unit at the 13-month mark and immediately put in a trade request with II for the Marriott/Starwood units. If the trade comes through (and I've had really good luck with them coming through), great. If not, I'm still set for a solid vacation.
    There are some cons:
    • The level of accommodations and resort amenities are generally a noticeable step down from Hilton/Marriott/Starwood. A Worldmark experience is more similar to a Springhill Suites/Hampton Inn experience than it is to a full service Hilton/Marriott/Westin.
    • Maintenance fees are capped at 5% annual increases, but they have been going up at exactly 5% each year for the past four years or so. That's definitely stripping away some of the value proposition.
    • There's not a lot out east. There are a few options and it seems like they are actively looking to expand out east, but
     
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  21. ChaeTwo

    ChaeTwo Guest

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    That kind of flexibilty sounds great. I've seen sales of HGVC for 5000 points in my range, enough to get a 1 bedroom for a week in red season or two bedroom in white. Is that a good option or not quite flexible enough you think? How do I look for a Hilton affiliate that isn't HGVC? Is it desirable to get points directly into RCI or II?
     
  22. ChaeTwo

    ChaeTwo Guest

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    How does one buy Worldmark points? I've had a tough time trying to figure out how to find what's out there to purchase points-wise, except HGVC. Those seem easier to find and more straight-forward.
     
  23. K2Quick

    K2Quick TUG Member

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    Probably the easiest place to find points is on the WM owners forum:

    https://wmowners.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=71

    There are several brokers, most of whom post sales from time to time in that forum. If WM was something you were interested in, I'd recommend an account of 10K or 12K points in your situation. That's good for a 2 bed unit year round in most locations (some will be slightly higher but you can rent in points easily). WM accounts are easy to value since points are points and there are no home resorts. Expect to pay about 32 cents per credit for an account with one year's worth of credits banked and add or subtract 7 cents per credit depending on whether the account has more or fewer banked credits. Pricing on ebay can be even better if you're patient and time it just right.
     
  24. Panina

    Panina TUG Review Crew: Expert TUG Member

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    I own affiliates at Eagles Nest and Surf Club on Marco Island and both are members of II where they trade nicely. I get equivalent quality, areas and times. I would not use RCI directly for these. Maybe other tug members can respond on what other hgvc affiliates trade in II. I believe quite a few Sanibel and Captiva places do too.

    As far as points, many will tell you get as many points as you can if trading in the hgvc system as points are points. I look at it differently. I would suggest you get a place and week you could see yourself using at times. If trading within Interval, I find point value not as important. With a high demand area, resort and week I have always received great trades. This would be one week for one week. Trading directly in hgvc will give you more flexibility.
     
  25. stumahlin

    stumahlin TUG Member

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    RE: ChaeTwo wrote: "We bought over the weekend with Hilton, and I like their points system, but have no idea if it really is as easy to navigate as they say. (Obviously we are rescinding now that we are home and doing our homework.)

    Congratulations on your Great Escape.

    Worry not about points and point systems. Buy (1) deeded weeks in (2) high demand locations (3) that you like (4) and would be willing to go to frequently (5) with Interval International affiliations so you can make good trades. And (6) buy from people running ads on T.U.G., Redweek, tstoday, MyResortsNetwork and -- yep, no kidding -- eBay. The cheaper you buy -- $1000 to, say, $4000 total -- the faster you effectively amortize your purchase price. No matter your age, there was no way you were going to amortize your Hilton "We're Not a Timeshare" Vacation Club points.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2018

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