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TUG - LM rental board, normal to see exchange rentals??

Discussion in 'Buying, Selling, Renting' started by mdurette, Feb 9, 2018.

  1. mdurette

    mdurette TUG Member

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    I normally don't pay much attention to this section of TUG - but since I am searching for something right now, I have been taking a peek at it.

    There appears to be a couple posters that are obviously renting out exchange company inventory as whatever they offer on a particular day I can match up exactly with available inventory. (a lot of it with II ACs - so profit making is happening)

    I know not TUGs responsibility to police this. But, I feel bad for the legit people out there trying to rent what they have....getting loss in barrage of other units.

    Since I don't watch this board much, is this typical to see so many people doing this? Personally, I would never rent from such....to much risk to show up and find out my reservation cancelled because the exchange company found out.
     
  2. davidvel

    davidvel TUG Member

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    How do you you know they are listing II inventory?
     
  3. rickandcindy23

    rickandcindy23 TUG Review Crew: Expert TUG Member

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    I have always suspected it. But if you think about it, there is such risk in doing it. Losing II or RCI privileges would be tragic for anyone on TUG who loves to exchange. I notice some inventory is pretty prime.
     
  4. mdurette

    mdurette TUG Member

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    I don't know 100% - but I have been watching for a week now and can easily match up some of these last minute rentals with what pops up in II. I am watching LM inventory heavily right now looking for something.
     
  5. DeniseM

    DeniseM Moderator

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    The terms posted at the top of that forum ask posters not to post exchanges for rent. When you see a problem post on TUG, please click the blue Report link at the bottom of the post.
     
  6. theo

    theo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Personally, I have no sympathy for anyone who gets caught trying to make money by improperly renting out weeks they've obtained by exchange. If it jeopardizes their exchange company membership, so be it; they've dug that hole for themselves.

    However, I do feel very badly for any innocent person who may very well have absolutely no knowledge of the impropriety of their rental. It may be statistically unlikely (but it's nonetheless still possible) that said would-be, good faith tenant gets turned away at check-in if the improper nature of the rental was somehow discovered. What do they do then? They are "out" the rental money they've paid and they are "out" the travel costs incurred. They may have a young family in tow --- and it's now late on a Saturday afternoon in a busy seasonal area quite possibly fully booked up, with no readily available options.
    That potential scenario frankly just gives me a very sick feeling --- and an admitted measure of disdain for those who would knowingly and willingly put innocent and clueless others (and their families) at risk, just to make a few extra bucks.
    Sad --- and a bit pathetic, IMnsHO.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2018
    WackyLucy, Panina and Sugarcubesea like this.
  7. Egret1986

    Egret1986 TUG Review Crew: Expert TUG Member

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    We always hear on TUG that renting out exchanges is always against RCI and II policy (which it is). However, I few years back, I noticed many "exchanges" being posted in the LMR by a fairly new poster. I contacted the person about one such posting and asked questions. I was told that a guest certificate would be issued. That indicated to me that this person was listing exchanges. I called this person out on the listing. I somewhat got blasted by that person, as well as a couple of other Tuggers for my post. This person continued listing these exchanges on TUG. I was perplexed about being chastised. Apparently, RCI (and maybe II also) make this inventory available to people that can turnover high volumes of last minute inventory. I see "exchange" inventory regularly posted on the LMR board by several folks very blatantly. One particular person is a long-time Tugger. This person no longer actively posts on the forums, except for their LMR listings. Therefore, I want to believe that these folks have "access" to this inventory by the exchange companies through agreements. When I got ripped for calling the person out previously, I tried to get definitive information on this "program" here on TUG and asked how one would know whether the person listing was indeed "authorized" or if it was just a case of listing exchanges that could be cancelled because they were against exchange company policy. A couple of people currently stand out as renting exchanges. Will I call them out or report them? No way. Been there, done that. However, I am still curious (like I was then) whether there are indeed high-volume renters that are given access to this LMR inventory by the exchange companies. I would love to hear from one of these folks or the moderators regarding this.
     
    Panina likes this.
  8. rickandcindy23

    rickandcindy23 TUG Review Crew: Expert TUG Member

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    I think there is definitely one former TUG member who posts quite a bit on the LMR board. There are times when the poster literally puts 20-30 units for rent there, and when I am stuck with a unit that I own and cannot rent, it's a bit annoying to have my LMR buried under all of the junk, and some of it is just that--junk.

    I remember calling out one person who literally copied and pasted the inventory from one of the alternate exchange companies for LMR. I know that company well and knew exactly what they were doing, but that company doesn't have the rules that II and RCI have, so I guess it's okay to do that. If I had a week expiring on one of the alternate exchange companies, I would consider doing the same thing. I don't think the LMR board works very well, anyway. I cannot think of a time it really worked as well as Craig's List.
     
  9. jwalk03

    jwalk03 TUG Member

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    I have a question that is sort of related- Are RCI or II "points" owners allowed to rent their reservations? I rented a Marriott unit and I asked why the guest certificate was from II instead of Marriott- he explained to me that he was a "points" owener with II and that it was not an exchange so he was permitted to rent it.

    I believed him and we checked in and stayed with no issues, but now I am curious if this was really allowed or if he rented me an exchange impermissibley
     
  10. cerralee

    cerralee TUG Member

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    I posted a wanted to rent ad a week or so ago and received a phone call from someone who had other units available besides the one I wanted. I talked to him and he said he has a las vegas week and it was banked with RCI and II. I explained to him on the phone that it was Illegal for him to rent out an exchange. I explained to him that I could see the same inventory he was trying to rent to me with my accounts. He just wouldn't give up. I finally just had to hang the phone up on him and tell him no way, that there was way that I would ever rent from him as what he was doing would be too risky on me as a renter in case RCI caught on to what he was doing and cancelled the reservation. I carefully explained he could have his membership revoked as well. He still argued with me. I posted on the next rental he put up that he could not rent out units that he himself did not own. H.e just does not "get" it or could just care less
     
  11. cerralee

    cerralee TUG Member

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    I think he is at it again this morning, a 3 bedroom last minute in New Orleans? When I asked where he owned he specifically said las vegas and it shows up on his profile. He has several units listed over the last few days.
     
  12. theo

    theo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    It's not "illegal" (i.e.,in violation of a law) for people to attempt to rent out weeks acquired by exchange.
    More accurately stated, it is overtly prohibited by RCI and II terms and conditions of membership to do so.

    To be very clear, I completely disapprove of the practice and I would never participate on either side of any such rental; I am merely pointing out the distinction between "improper" and "illegal".
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2018
  13. cerralee

    cerralee TUG Member

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    Your right, illegal isn't the right term. But I do know they can terminate your membership over an "improper" rental. I would hate to rent thinking all was ok just to have the vacation taken out from under me because the wrong channels were gone through.
     
  14. mpumilia

    mpumilia TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    When you use your points to make a reservation, that is like a reservation for your "home" resort so you could rent it out. I have rented from Wyndham and Worldmark owners- in fact- they specifically booked the dates and units at resorts I wanted.
     
  15. vacationhopeful

    vacationhopeful TUG Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    Mary Ann ... Wyndham owners who reserved using their Wyndham points are trading thru their own internal trading platform. UDI points are Undividual Interval ownership. It is their ownership and their CLUB owned resorts.

    RCI Points used reserving at their HOME RESORT are an internal trade within the Home Resort interval on cost a $40 fee for book keeping. Still it is an RCI Points reservation ... BUT a HOME WEEK is their ownership and would be 'listed' as an exchange, too. I just spent an hour this weekend hanging around the Front Desk at my resort with the new(er) Front Desk supervisor who was reading off to me the RCI inventory for my units ... "that is a RCI week", "the is a RCI Week", etc. I kept saying THAT is my WEEK ... getting told, "that is in RCI inventory coming to us" ... ie AN EXCHANGE in her eyes. Discussing it further was NOT going anywheres after 15 minutes ... 2 senior Front End people off (Front Desk manager was running temporarily another resort in the chain; assistant manager was OFF for her 1 day a week) ... Front Desk person had less than 2 months experience.

    So my thoughts: RCI Points membership is NOW crap; fees; booking windows and resorts NOT policing rentals. The resorts are overwhelmed with RCI this, RCI that, II weeks, II points, exchanges, exchange rentals and resort rentals. Plus OWNERS at a fixed week resort do NOT argue over their view; exchangers of all FORMS want a GREAT VIEW ... anything less incurs a 'DING' on their review for the resort. Renters can scream at the week owner who should have given them a UNIT number when they rented; if the renter whines at the FRONT DESK ... I was PROMISED OCEAN FRONT, the Front Desk should ask the Owners' Name and explain, "the person you rented does NOT own a fixed week here to promise a view. Who did you rent from?" And then report the rental to RCI or II. And the exchange company should CANCEL that membership after 1 warning.

    BUT that won't happen. The exchange companies gets exchange fees and guest certificate fees by ignoring their own RULES. The resorts get MFs paid on offseason weeks ... their resales office get 'new meat' for selling more offseason weeks.
     
    mpumilia likes this.
  16. mpumilia

    mpumilia TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Well- that is craziness. People converted to RCI points knowing they still owned their underlying week and unit. If they book their OWN underlying week and unit, to me that is THEIR ownership.

    I didn't like points ownership as soon as it was introduced at our resort and I am so very glad I never converted. As you said, it is one BIG convoluted mess at these resorts today.
     
  17. Mosescan

    Mosescan TUG Member

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    The resorts are going to do what’s in the best interest of the resort period. Sometimes that’s also what’s in the best interest of the owners, sometimes not. I suppose it also depends on your point of view.
    Ensuring all units are always booked means that there is income coming in and owners who can rent out their offseason weeks means they are going to keep paying maintenance fees. This ensures less delinquency and keeps fees lower for everyone.
    This also means less availability for owners that want to trade in from another resort in the system and causes frustration especially when you see people blatantly flouting the rules.
    Either way, someone’s not happy.
     
  18. silentg

    silentg TUG Review Crew: Expert TUG Member

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    Sometimes things come up at last minute and a person may try to rent an exchanged Week because they can’t go. I know this is against RCI or II. But if they are just trying to rent it so they don’t lose it. Is that so bad..?
    (I have not done this by the way)
    Silentg
     
  19. mdurette

    mdurette TUG Member

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    No, it is not so bad. It is a violation of terms and I have done this with friends in the past when I can use a week. That is why tug has distressed posts in sightings. More the topic here though is not the people that do it from time to time when in need, but the people that seem to be renting any bargain they can find with LM inventory, basically making a small business of it.

    Although I started this thread and the instruction notify the mods of posts like this.....personally, I won't do it because I don't know with 100% certainty that this is what the poster is doing....although it appears they are. But, I'm glad to bring it to like for any potential renters out there. Maybe one will simply think twice about renting something from a fairly new tugger that appears to have WAY more inventory available that would be normal.

    Egret - interesting thought. Is there a side business out there from exchange companies that offer say a commission for getting rid of their extra weeks? If you google some of the phone numbers from the ones with multiple units, you will see that many post LM rentals not only here, but on other sites. Might be a nice retirement job one day!
     
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  20. chapjim

    chapjim TUG Member

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    Some things are prohibited because they are wrong (malum in se). Some things are wrong because they are prohibited (malum prohibitum). Renting exchanges is the latter.
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2018
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  21. Egret1986

    Egret1986 TUG Review Crew: Expert TUG Member

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    I have had my own little side business for about 12 years in renting my timeshares. When this all happened a few years ago, I considered checking into it further and trying to get a piece of the action for myself. While I've considered myself to be successful over the years, the last few have required much work work and effort. I believe there are so many more opportunities to find rentals that this is now something that I am moving away from for the future. It was a good ride and fun for many years (a paid hobby). I can now see retirement on the horizon. I thought a vacation rental business in retirement would be great. Not so much now. Heck, I'm even working myself away from timeshare ownership so that I can take advantage of some of the rental opportunities that exist today.
     
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  22. Saintsfanfl

    Saintsfanfl TUG Member

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    Am I missing where these terms are stated? It says suggested. A few years ago I called out a posting that I thought was an exchange and I got mildly chastised that it was not against the rules. I am not for renting out exchanges but at the time it was clearly pointed out to me that it was perfectly fine to post exchanges on the LM board. If something has changed let everyone know.

    Not in a public place, especially where you can take a $300 getaway and list it for $700. Offloading an exchange was never the point in the last minute forum.

    That is supposed to be the point in the distress forum. That is why the allowing of exchange reservations to be placed on the LM forum is frustrating. It allows people to circumvent contractual rules and place reservations that are not allowed on a public forum.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2018
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  23. DeniseM

    DeniseM Moderator

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    From the LMR Forum: IMPORTANT: Major exchange company rules prohibit the rental of time deposited with them or of exchanged weeks, bonus weeks, etc., obtained through them. Further, exchange companies have been known to take disciplinary action against violators of their rules when discovered via online sources such as this one. There have been cases reported of renters showing up at the resort and finding that the reservation has been canceled when the exchange company learned of a transaction violating their policies. While we are not in a position to enforce exchange company policies for them, we discourage such rental offers on this board, and caution users of this practice.
     
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  24. eschjw

    eschjw TUG Member

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    I have posted a few of these types of deals in the Sighting/Distress forum but let me warm you not to call it a distress. Read the sticky note first about what a distress really is on that forum. If you do, DeniseM will set you straight.

    Just call it a crazy good deal and point them to the exchange company.

    I have seen several bargain rentals available for less from DAE on the LMR forum. I am sure a lot of this comes from other exchange company bargain deals, "getaways", etc. for members. This type of poster on LMR gets paid by the renter, purchases the bargain deal from the exchange company and puts it in the renters name. DAE membership is free, but others may not be.
     

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