* NEW * : Starwood is starting a new points program

DeniseM · Jan 29, 2015

I pulled this quote out of another thread - looks like this is similar to the new phase at WSJ:

mirish said:
I just attend an update at vistana last week. We did not get the "hard sell" -thankfully. We did learn of the new way they are selling SVV SVR SDO SBP and Sheraton Jensen Beach.

They are now selling them as a trust and you will buy into that for a staroption amount and will have 12 month priority for all 5 resorts. No more seasons.

Example given was you would buy a one bedroom - 44000 options that would give 12 month priority in 5 resorts. Cost is 44000 x .325

Star point conversion at 44000 x .52

mirish · Jan 29, 2015

I did not get any new charts to take with me, I tried. I collected all of the charts etc I was shown and was told I couldn't have them as they were her (salespersons) only copies. We were told that the day we were there was the first day they were selling this new system, they were at meeting until late the night before. She did not have all the answers we were asking as it was brand new. Since it was VERY evident we were not gong to buy when she went to ask her manager if she wanted to speak with us, the manager declined.

I do not know if they will allow us owners to convert and the cost to do so. Also unclear what will happen with options for those that currently own a season that is less then platinum, since in the new system there will be no low season.

As I see it there are many unanswered questions, if anyone else does go to the "presentation" maybe they will get more answers

mirish · Jan 29, 2015

sorry Denise did not see new thread until after I commented, but it copy my response to the new thread

DeniseM · Jan 29, 2015

No worries - thank you so much for posting this BRAND NEW info!

carpie99 · Jan 29, 2015

So I am not clear ... is this applicable to current SVV owners? I guess this would be a benefit if I was looking to go to Myrtle instead.

tschwa2 · Jan 29, 2015

carpie99 said:
So I am not clear ... is this applicable to current SVV owners? I guess this would be a benefit if I was looking to go to Myrtle instead.

I doubt it unless you paid to convert or enroll your week into the trust.

DeniseM · Jan 29, 2015

carpie99 said:
So I am not clear ... is this applicable to current SVV owners? I guess this would be a benefit if I was looking to go to Myrtle instead.

My guess is that this is just the tip of the iceberg, and that we are going to see this offered at other resorts in the future. It's similar to Marriott offering DC points to their owners. They had to pay ($3,xxx ?) if they wanted to convert their week to DC points.

I'm SURE there will be a buy-in…

***If anybody has an "in" with a sales person, see if you can get more info. for us.

It will be really interesting to see if they allow VOLUNTARY owners to buy in...

mirish · Jan 29, 2015

They noted that they were not changing what we have now. What we have will stay the same unless we are looking to make a change. Not sure what they are going to do in the future.
Seems like there would be some issues in changing current owners to the new system as there currently is seasonal differences and that means there are different star option amounts. This will not exist in the new system a week is a week is a week in the new system.
Also unclear as to how they will bill maintenance fees in future. New system you "own" a week in the trust and maintenance fees are billed dependent on unit size, not on unit size and resort as is the current way.

Many many questions, few answers.. so far anyway

tschwa2 · Jan 29, 2015

For owners that are already in SVN bumping up your priority to 12 months at these resorts really wouldn't be that much of a draw and certainly not worth any money. I imagine it will be more like club wyndham access. They probably have enough inventory to put in the trust now. Many of these resorts have such broad float periods, it isn't like they have to go chasing after re-acquiring platinum weeks. I don't think there will be a buy in. It would just be an opportunity to trade in and buying points in the trust, similar to what you can do now at many resorts trading in and getting something else either at the same resort or somewhere else in SVN.

GregT · Jan 29, 2015

DeniseM said:
It's similar to Marriott offering DC points to their owners. They had to pay ($3,xxx ?) if they wanted to convert their week to DC points.

When Marriott rolled out their system, people who had purchased directly from Marriott could pay $595 for the ability to enroll their week, or $695 if they had two or more weeks to enroll. Resale purchasers had to pay $1,995.

I think only the Resale Purchasers would have an enrollment option, because a direct purchaser already has StarOptions.

This is an interesting deviation from Starwood, and perhaps makes it easier to sell those 5 properties.

I will be curious if similar regional clubs come out (a Hawaii club? a Caribbean club?) but not sure if Starwood has the same issues Marriott had. The StarOptions feature was a core function that Marriott lacked, and Marriott needed to do something fairly radical to change its system.

Will be interesting to follow -- thank you for posting this.

Best,

Greg

DeniseM · Jan 29, 2015

tschwa2 said:
I don't think there will be a buy in.

Really? We all know that Starwood doesn't have much of interest to sell these days, so like many other resort systems, they have re-invented themselves, so they have something else to sell.

If they allow current owners to "convert" PLUS they sell new pkgs. to new owners, that gives them the opportunity to make even more money - we'll see!

tschwa2 · Jan 29, 2015

I think it will be a trade in, not a conversion. I don't think they would be looking for $600-$2000 in a conversion. They will be looking for $10,000+ or so in a new sale which may include taking back what you have and selling you something in the trust and then later converting what they bought and depositing in the trust.

PamMo · Jan 29, 2015

mirish said:
...I did not get any new charts to take with me, I tried. I collected all of the charts etc I was shown and was told I couldn't have them as they were her (salespersons) only copies...

If anyone else goes to a sales presentation, a tip to keep this information to examine more fully (if they don't have copies to share), is to take photos of the pages with your cellphone. There is almost always a time when you're left alone with the paperwork, while the sales person goes to retrieve their manager to talk with you.

I did this at a resort we owned, which was not very transparent about our conversion to a completely different system in their new phase (they tore down our old units). Having information when we got home helped us better understand what they wanted us to do - and we could decide what was best for us.

PamMo · Jan 29, 2015

mirish said:
They noted that they were not changing what we have now. What we have will stay the same unless we are looking to make a change.

That's exactly how Marriott handled owners when they introduced the DC points system. My deeded Marriott weeks that I did not enroll work exactly the same as before.

mirish said:
Seems like there would be some issues in changing current owners to the new system as there currently is seasonal differences and that means there are different star option amounts. This will not exist in the new system a week is a week is a week in the new system.

Interesting...if you treat EVERY week as a red week, you can charge more for the points. But, there will be a lot more competition to book those prime holiday weeks. Marriott's points allotments/requirements which vary by resort, size, view, and season, make more sense (from an owner standpoint).

mirish said:
Also unclear as to how they will bill maintenance fees in future. New system you "own" a week in the trust and maintenance fees are billed dependent on unit size, not on unit size and resort as is the current way.

Currently all units the same size at the same resort have the same MF's - no matter what season you own. Since theoretically you could book at the most expensive resort in the trust, perhaps everyone will be asked to pay those MF's, plus a little extra for the trust, plus the SVN fees... Starwood will have to figure out SOME way to make money off this new program!

DeniseM · Jan 29, 2015

PamMo said:
If anyone else goes to a sales presentation, a tip to keep this information to examine more fully (if they don't have copies to share), is to take photos of the pages with your cellphone. There is almost always a time when you're left alone with the paperwork, while the sales person goes to retrieve their manager to talk with you.

Great tip - and it doesn't have to be SVR - chances are that they are selling the same thing at all of these resorts: SVV SVR SDO SBP and Sheraton Jensen Beach.

alexadeparis · Jan 29, 2015

Maybe this is why they recently realigned the staroptions for Vistana?

gregb · Jan 29, 2015

In a trust arrangement, I think you can expect the MF fees to be the average of the MFs for the included resorts. So if you come from a low MF resort, your MFs would go up, because of the inclusion of the high MF resorts. But if you are in a high MF resort, your MF should go down.

One way to address the differences in MFs across resorts is to do what I think they are doing, regionalize the trusts. That is a trust for the Florida properties, where the MFs are generally low, and a different trust for the Hawaii properties, where the MFs are high.

That's my two cents.

Greg

sjsharkie · Jan 29, 2015

For the 5 resorts (assuming those were the only ones included), I'm not too worried of any impacts. Those are lesser demand resorts in the portfolio anyway. I do wonder if this will be extended to other resorts -- maybe this is to test the waters to some extent.

The challenge for Starwood is that they do not have ROFR with the exception of a few resorts. This will present larger challenges to them should they extend to other properties.

I don't think the every week is the same approach will work too well. With those properties, they will end up with the same leftovers that they usually do but maybe the trust will buy the underlying deeds accordingly.

-ryan

cubigbird · Jan 29, 2015

I wonder how this could/will change for voluntary weeks that could be retro'd. I now have a fixed SVR week that I'd like to retro eventually but no way would I give it up, or spend $$ for just a pure points week like Marriotts DC.

DeniseM · Jan 29, 2015

cubigbird said:
I wonder how this could/will change for voluntary weeks that could be retro'd. I now have a fixed SVR week that I'd like to retro eventually but no way would I give it up, or spend $$ for just a pure points week like Marriotts DC.

What advantage would it be to Starwood if you don't pay them anything.

sjsharkie · Jan 29, 2015

DeniseM said:
What advantage would it be to Starwood if you don't pay them anything.

...and can they be paid in Strawberry Greek yogurt?

Seriously though, they may take your fixed week 52 if you offer it for points. But I think those deals would be far and few between.

-ryan

DeniseM · Jan 29, 2015

alexadeparis said:
Maybe this is why they recently realigned the staroptions for Vistana?

No doubt...

cubigbird · Jan 29, 2015

sjsharkie said:
...and can they be paid in Strawberry Greek yogurt?

Seriously though, they may take your fixed week 52 if you offer it for points. But I think those deals would be far and few between.

-ryan

I would never trade in a fixed week right for just their pure points idea to be essentially never guaranteed availability. I would however retro my existing fixed week into SVN. That I would be willing to negotiate.

DeniseM · Jan 29, 2015

cubigbird said:
I would never trade in a fixed week right for just their pure points idea to be essentially never guaranteed availability. I would however retro my existing fixed week into SVN. That I would be willing to negotiate.

Starwood will spin this new program, so the great unwashed masses will think this is the best offer ever. They will make (uninformed non-TUG) owners believe that they will have a hard time making a home resort reservation, if they don't convert. They will make up a bunch of minor perks associated with this offer, and make them sound fabulous. This is the standard ploy for any kind of sales pitch where they are trying to sell points...

cubigbird · Jan 29, 2015

DeniseM said:
Starwood will spin this new program, so the great unwashed masses will think this is the best offer ever. They will make (uninformed non-TUG) owners believe that they will have a hard time making a home resort reservation, if they don't convert. They will make up a bunch of minor perks associated with this offer, and make them sound fabulous. This is the standard ploy for any kind of sales pitch where they are trying to sell points...

Otherwise know as: "we'd rather not expand and offer new resort inventory. Instead, we'd rather churn the accounts of existing owners and oversell the existing resorts."

In a sense inventory could be unlimited then // How high can you pile sand??

What good are the points if what you want isn't available??

Got it!!

* NEW * : Starwood is starting a new points program

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