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Coconut Plantation vs MVW litigation

Marathoner

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An Important Message from the majority of the Board of Directors at Coconut Plantation:


As promised the Board wants each and every owner to be up to date on the important issues that concerns your ownership at the Coconut Plantation (Cove).


First the Association/Board legal counsel has filed in Lee County Florida a lawsuit regarding the sale of the undeveloped property by Marriott Vacations Worldwide to the London Bay Group. The suit was filed in late July and both MVW and London Bay were served subpoenas that require a response roughly by the first of September. The basis of our suit is that MVW conveyed the property illegally without our approval and because of that the shared area responsibility still exists. As you know, because of the land sale MVW has suspended making any payments to the shared area expenses which will result in a very large deficit this year and an enormous additional burden to each and every owner in the future.


The recent destinations issue from MVW included substantial information about the hurricane Ian recovery effort and in particular emphasis on the elevators. More to come on the elevator issues and the hurricane preparedness and recovery! In prior years and issues, the Coconut Plantation Board President always included a message from your association. The board has decided to no longer contribute to the destination newsletter for a number of reasons. First, it has become too much of a corporate self serving propaganda publication. Second, several submissions by the board have been edited in an effort to make the MVW/ management company look better. Thirdly, we now have this, our own Association newsletter.


At the most recent board of directors meeting held last week, the MVW/ management company presented to the board their proposed 2024 budget. Their submission calls for a maintenance fee of just under $2500.00 per unit week which represents approximately a $800.00 increase over last year's operating budget. Last year’s budget was approximately $2000.00, however $300.00 of that was a one time special assessment for hurricane Ian recovery. As you might expect over half of the increase is due to MVW no longer contributing to the shared area expenses. Presently the board is working with our professional financial and legal teams in an effort to respond to this ridiculous budget. We will keep you posted on any new developments and we would very much like your assistance and thoughts on this matter.


Please know that the board sincerely wishes that this communication was more optimistic and upbeat. We all purchased our weeks with the goal of having an enjoyable place to take our families on vacation. Unfortunately the timeshare world has changed dramatically in the last 6-10 years, and despite all the corporate hype with new name changes, more this, and better that, not for the better! Behind all the smiling faces at the resort, which we feel are sincere, is a multinational, multi billion dollar corporation who’s corporate greed knows no limits. While the tasks are difficult, your board of directors is committed to protecting all of your owner rights and financial obligations. Once again, please do not hesitate to reach out to us with any questions or concerns you may have.


With every good wish, we remain

Your Coconut Plantation Association Board of Directors



Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk
 

bdh

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Interesting word selection ... "An Important Message from the majority of the Board of Directors at Coconut Plantation"
 

dioxide45

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Interesting word selection ... "An Important Message from the majority of the Board of Directors at Coconut Plantation"
I suspect they had to vote on it and at least one person voted nay.
 

AJCts411

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During this litigation, my hope is that the huge conflict of interest that exists with Marriott the corporation selling points ONLY and owning/operating II and the "Club" and Marriott the corporation managing Hyatt branded resorts is confronted and resolved in favor of week owners.
 

sponger76

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During this litigation, my hope is that the huge conflict of interest that exists with Marriott the corporation selling points ONLY and owning/operating II and the "Club" and Marriott the corporation managing Hyatt branded resorts is confronted and resolved in favor of week owners.
Based on the description of what the lawsuit is about, the issue being litigated has absolutely nothing to do with the issues you are raising and wouldn't be germane to those proceedings. If you want those items litigated, you probably have to file your own lawsuit.
 

dioxide45

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Based on the description of what the lawsuit is about, the issue being litigated has absolutely nothing to do with the issues you are raising and wouldn't be germane to those proceedings. If you want those items litigated, you probably have to file your own lawsuit.
I am also not sure what conflict of interest there would even be. Perhaps that a company with "Marriott" in the name is managing timeshares affiliated with "Hyatt"? I suspect if Hyatt Hotels is okay with this, then there shouldn't be an issue. I forsee at some point in time that Marriott Vacatios Worldwide will change their name. Much like HMSHost did many years ago.
 

sponger76

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I am also not sure what conflict of interest there would even be. Perhaps that a company with "Marriott" in the name is managing timeshares affiliated with "Hyatt"? I suspect if Hyatt Hotels is okay with this, then there shouldn't be an issue. I forsee at some point in time that Marriott Vacatios Worldwide will change their name. Much like HMSHost did many years ago.
Yeah, I thought the same thing. My thinking is that his points wouldn't even be raised in the above lawsuit, so the only way to raise them is a different lawsuit. I also think that he doesn't have snowball's chance in hell of whatever resolution he's dreaming of.
 

rdc

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Another disappointing thing about this as that the land used to be hyped and promo'd as a larger future build out resort with more buildings and accommodations. This is not what, I would suspect, most would have envisioned when purchasing the CP timeshare, that the remaining property would be sold off to other concerns to develop.
 

dioxide45

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One good thing is that a full build out would have made for much busier pools. Only four buildings makes for quiet relaxing pools with not a lot of people.
 

ivywag

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Based on the description of what the lawsuit is about, the issue being litigated has absolutely nothing to do with the issues you are raising and wouldn't be germane to those proceedings. If you want those items litigated, you probably have to file your own lawsuit.
I think that the additional issue being described is that Hyatt/Marriott changed the program that the legacy owners bought into and never fulfilled the promises of new resorts, etc. We were also promised WOH status for life which was provided for a few years and then disappeared and they refused to reinstate. Now, they are only selling points and are encouraging legacy owners to GIVE them their deeded weeks for points which don’t have the security of the deed week thus slowly eroding the value and trading power of the legacy owners. The deeded weeks are slowly being absorbed by the Portfolio. Frankly, I’m not sure how the various states’ real estate departments let them get away with this. But, it’s timeshares.

Regarding the Coconut Plantation/Cove lawsuit, what makes it even worse is that they sold the land to an entity that is going to build a resort which features a Ritz Carlton. Guess who owns Ritz Carlton. Yep, Marriott! Marriott will get the contract for the management of the resort. Not a bad deal for them, but the owners at Coconut Plantation/Cove are the losers and Marriott will make a lot more money than they would have if they built more timeshares.
 

sponger76

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I think that the additional issue being described is that Hyatt/Marriott changed the program that the legacy owners bought into and never fulfilled the promises of new resorts, etc. We were also promised WOH status for life which was provided for a few years and then disappeared and they refused to reinstate. Now, they are only selling points and are encouraging legacy owners to GIVE them their deeded weeks for points which don’t have the security of the deed week thus slowly eroding the value and trading power of the legacy owners. The deeded weeks are slowly being absorbed by the Portfolio. Frankly, I’m not sure how the various states’ real estate departments let them get away with this. But, it’s timeshares.

Regarding the Coconut Plantation/Cove lawsuit, what makes it even worse is that they sold the land to an entity that is going to build a resort which features a Ritz Carlton. Guess who owns Ritz Carlton. Yep, Marriott! Marriott will get the contract for the management of the resort. Not a bad deal for them, but the owners at Coconut Plantation/Cove are the losers and Marriott will make a lot more money than they would have if they built more timeshares.
You do realize that the Marriott hotels entity is actually a completely separate company from the Marriott timeshares entity that owns Hyatt Vacation Club and sold the land, right? The company selling the land (timeshare company) won't make any money from running a Ritz-Carlton hotel. The management contract money would go to the hotel company that has a similar name, but is actually a completely separate corporation that only leases the name to the timeshare company.

In addition, while it sucks not to have them (I'd also like to see new resorts and loyalty program status stick around, in any system), the promise of new timeshare resorts or lifetime WOH status are not guaranteed in any contract that I'm aware of.
 
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timsi

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During this litigation, my hope is that the huge conflict of interest that exists with Marriott the corporation selling points ONLY and owning/operating II and the "Club" and Marriott the corporation managing Hyatt branded resorts is confronted and resolved in favor of week owners.

Some people may criticize Marriott for small things, but they will always defend the company against any criticism that actually matters to its core business structure and corporate decisions.

Marriott rents out a significant inventory, manages bookings for both regular owners and its own inventory (without clear public rules on how the conflict is avoided), can keep or selectively convey to the trusts inventory acquired at privileged prices, manages the trusts without disclosing the criteria for accepting inventory, and selects the individual board of directors and has a say in who is elected, thus altering the say the regular owners may have.
 

GTLINZ

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I got into my first timeshare (HGVC) many years ago after attending a presentation and loving the resort. I recinded a sampler package after finding TUG and realizing that i could buy resale and apply those proceeds towards it. Buying resale made the numbers work - paying they price they were asking did not and I just wanted to get out of the presentation and do some research and the sampler package gave me a return trip (or two).

I was very thankful to find TUG and after a lot of reading learned two important facts - the contract and club rules were the guiding factors as opposed to anything i was told in the presentation.

The club rules basically stated that they could change the rules if they wanted. So i realized quickly that my ownership could deteriorate - and all of them certainly have over the years to some degree. But i was willing to take the risk and have tried to maximize all of my ownerships. The original Hyatt HRC system that i also got into was spectacular.

This appears to be an extreme case and it is sad really for all of us who love and use that property - especially the owners. That land was worth a lot of money and I am sure the original purchasers knew if they held it for a while it would appreciate significantly since the original purchase. My question centers around what rights did the HCP / HCC association have related to the use/ownership of that land? I am hoping there are some actual legal damages here to bring some level of compensation to the owners.

The key phrase seems to me to be this - "The basis of our suit is that MVW conveyed the property illegally without our approval and because of that the shared area responsibility still exists."
 

dioxide45

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How many buildings were originally planned for Coconut Plantation? Was it 12?
 

dioxide45

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I can't seem to find any press release or announcement in quarterly earnings about the sale of the undeveloped land. All I could find is what was mentioned in this thread. Does anyone have a link to a press release or other information confirming the plans for the land that was sold?
 

dioxide45

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You do realize that the Marriott hotels entity is actually a completely separate company from the Marriott timeshares entity that owns Hyatt Vacation Club and sold the land, right? The company selling the land (timeshare company) won't make any money from running a Ritz-Carlton hotel. The management contract money would go to the hotel company that has a similar name, but is actually a completely separate corporation that only leases the name to the timeshare company.

In addition, while it sucks not to have them (I'd also like to see new resorts and loyalty program status stick around, in any system), the promise of new timeshare resorts or lifetime WOH status are not guaranteed in any contract that I'm aware of.
Another thing about the Ritz Carlton Residences is that it won't even be managed by Marriott International. These deals are usually just a licencing agreement only. The property will be built and managed by another company altogether. Marriott International (not the timeshare company) will just get paid for the licensing of the name and usually gets paid based on sales.
 

Sullco2

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I was part of the sales team during the construction and early sales period. I had a lot of experience with branded resorts, including Marriott, and believed that Hyatt had cobbled together all the best approaches to timeshare for the owners’ benefit. Then they, like the rest of the industry, ruined it in the quest for “something more to sell you.” I was very sad to see the Hyatt system debased and am equally disturbed to learn of this latest corporate heist.
 

rdc

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An Important Message from the majority of the Board of Directors at Coconut Plantation:


As promised the Board wants each and every owner to be up to date on the important issues that concerns your ownership at the Coconut Plantation (Cove).


First the Association/Board legal counsel has filed in Lee County Florida a lawsuit regarding the sale of the undeveloped property by Marriott Vacations Worldwide to the London Bay Group. The suit was filed in late July and both MVW and London Bay were served subpoenas that require a response roughly by the first of September. The basis of our suit is that MVW conveyed the property illegally without our approval and because of that the shared area responsibility still exists. As you know, because of the land sale MVW has suspended making any payments to the shared area expenses which will result in a very large deficit this year and an enormous additional burden to each and every owner in the future.


The recent destinations issue from MVW included substantial information about the hurricane Ian recovery effort and in particular emphasis on the elevators. More to come on the elevator issues and the hurricane preparedness and recovery! In prior years and issues, the Coconut Plantation Board President always included a message from your association. The board has decided to no longer contribute to the destination newsletter for a number of reasons. First, it has become too much of a corporate self serving propaganda publication. Second, several submissions by the board have been edited in an effort to make the MVW/ management company look better. Thirdly, we now have this, our own Association newsletter.


At the most recent board of directors meeting held last week, the MVW/ management company presented to the board their proposed 2024 budget. Their submission calls for a maintenance fee of just under $2500.00 per unit week which represents approximately a $800.00 increase over last year's operating budget. Last year’s budget was approximately $2000.00, however $300.00 of that was a one time special assessment for hurricane Ian recovery. As you might expect over half of the increase is due to MVW no longer contributing to the shared area expenses. Presently the board is working with our professional financial and legal teams in an effort to respond to this ridiculous budget. We will keep you posted on any new developments and we would very much like your assistance and thoughts on this matter.


Please know that the board sincerely wishes that this communication was more optimistic and upbeat. We all purchased our weeks with the goal of having an enjoyable place to take our families on vacation. Unfortunately the timeshare world has changed dramatically in the last 6-10 years, and despite all the corporate hype with new name changes, more this, and better that, not for the better! Behind all the smiling faces at the resort, which we feel are sincere, is a multinational, multi billion dollar corporation who’s corporate greed knows no limits. While the tasks are difficult, your board of directors is committed to protecting all of your owner rights and financial obligations. Once again, please do not hesitate to reach out to us with any questions or concerns you may have.


With every good wish, we remain

Your Coconut Plantation Association Board of Directors



Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk
Thank you for the update. It has the look and feel that MVW is ready to play a David vs. Goliath long game since they have the financial and legal resources to drag this along if need be. Might be helpful to get some press coverage if MVW continues to play dirty hardball. Initially developed by Hyatt on this beautiful property, it was deemed to be a secluded resort with a smart layout with expansion. Selling of the property and not expanding is not what most ever expected. I know more buildings mean larger crowds, but the facilities were built to support this as well as more owners equal better shared expenses for maintenance. Some timeshares have proven to be shady in the past, but maybe a bit naively this behavior wasn't expected from the likes of a Marriott.
Hard work by the board, but its appreciated.
 
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There is a court hearing on October 23, 2023 regarding the Defendants' Motion to Dismiss the Complaint. The "dockets" of the Circuit Court of the Twentieth Judicial District in and for Lee County, Florida are available to the public online. You need to sign in and register if you want to follow this lawsuit, which is case number 23-CA-008717. I sent a letter to the court because I am a retired lawyer who is very disappointed in the quality of the Complaint filed on behalf of the Association asking that the Motion to Dismiss be denied and that the lawsuit move forward. I raised two points that I believe to be relevant: (1) there is an implied fiduciary duty on Pelican Landing Timeshare Ventures because it paid 70% (about $2 million a year) of Shared Expenses for 20 years and I cited a Florida Bar Journal Article supporting this; and (2) that a Warranty Deed conveying the property to Kersey Smoot was done prior to the undeveloped land being "deleted" from the Master Declaration so that the deletion is void and ineffective.

I wonder if the Association's lawyers or the Defendant's lawyers will address these issues - - and I hope that the judge will MAKE them address them.

My letter is on the court's docket if you are interested in reading it.
 

SunandFun83

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I suspect they had to vote on it and at least one person voted nay.
I suspect that Hyatt / MVC has a member on the board. They do at many MVC resorts.
 

GTLINZ

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Interesting case to follow, especially to see if there are any damages.
 
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