Top reasons NOT to Join Marriott Destination Club

[suzannesimon]

From a legacy perspective, it can still work, for some people.

I inhereted a Royal Palm week in hurricane season (Sept). For some reason that points out higher than May. I prefer May, so I point out and reserve May. There are enough point left over to swap Orlando resorts every other year.

In this particular case, it works for me. Just another viewpoint.

I think it works for most owners, especially those who take their vacations for less than/more than 7 days and if they received a fair amount of points comparable to the places they want to go. My ah-hah moment, however, came when I converted my 3 bedroom MFC to 6250 points and used it to reserve MGC 3 bedroom for about 5,300 points and I rented the leftover points for about $500. The Grande Chateau rents for about $2,400 cash + $500 for my leftover points, so I got about $2,900 in value for my MFC that rents for $5,000 (conservative number). In this case, the numbers just don't work for me. Marriott dramatically undervalued the Caribbean resorts for some reason.

 

[Toppermom]

I think another thing that many fail to take into account is changing vacation patterns over time. Lives change--children start school, children graduate and go to college, children marry and have other family obligations. Health changes, spouses divorce or pass away. The point I am trying to make is that the greater your flexibility, the greater the value of your timeshare ownership. None of us can predict what tomorrow may bring. When you have owned timeshare for 20 years or so, many of those things will happen. Enrollment of legacy weeks made sense for us.

 

[Fasttr]

{I am stictly talking a points purchase here and not enrolling}

Do you ever think that maybe it would be cheaper to just pay cash? I can get a 1BR suite at Timber Lodge for this New Years week for $519 per night on marriott.com. Or I could buy 5,225 points and use that instead. I can list examples all day long on the nonsensical nature of a points purchase. Marriott has fooled some 55,000 people so far but I am still beside myself on why it is cheaper to just book online.

There are extremes in any argument and by my calc, the break even point in your example would be about 31 years (calculated by taking your cash price +15% for taxes, less cost of MF's on the 5,225 points and dividing that into cost of points at $11/pt). I can't disagree, 31 years is a long time, and that's not even taking the time value of money or lost investment income into consideration.

That said, if you booked an Aruba Ocean Club 2BR OV in mid June for 3500 points, the cash price is $599, and once you do the same math as above, you get around an 11 year break even on that deal. Depending on your age, that might be acceptable. Also, assuming your kids grow up timesharing with you and like to vacation in better than hotel accommodations, it likely has value in handing it down to them as a nice incentive (bribe?) in hopes they will choose a nice nursing home to stick you in.

There are many other factors which might have mitigated your upfront costs of purchasing DC points, such as incentives, ability to deduct a cash paid stay at the MVC resort from your purchase price, etc, which might allow you to get your potential break even below 10 years.

And if you hedged your bet on your pricey Trust points purchase by buying some VAC stock below $20 a share (rationalizing if there were others like you who were willing to pay this much for points, how can the stock lose) and have now ridden that up to $44 a share, your overall "investment" in MVC might look even better.

You might also be able to stretch your points usage because you have friends and/or relatives who are also points owners, allowing you to occasionally split a two or three bedroom with them to make your points go even further.

Everybody's situation is unique and what looks stupid to one, makes sense to another. I say, if it feels good....do it!!

Just pointing out not all Trust purchasers are total morons....some of us might just be partially impaired.

All that said, if I had to do it all over again, I would have purchased 1500 points and rented the rest....but I only came to that conclusion after finding TUG and then VPE.

 

[m61376]

Some really good points in this thread! I agree with Sue that we tend to lose sight of the fact that most Marriott owners aren't as obsessed as we are here. Buying from Marriott, and then using the points even for what many consider over-priced packages, is just easier, plain and simple, for some people.

You see it, you want it, you buy it versus seeing and wanting something, but searching and /or waiting for a sale- two very different mentalities, but the majority of stores thrive on most people having the former rather than the latter mindset. Buying points directly from Marriott, and hopefully being able to book what you want when you want is worth the extra expense, and most people just don't look at the alternatives.

If they did, as Suzanne suggests, you'd see virtually every owner of an Aruba, St. Thomas or St, Kitts week, excepting perhaps the Silver season owners, renting their weeks rather than trading them for the relative paltry point allotment, esp. when considering what Marriott itself charges for rentals. I know I get fewer points for my Aruba weeks than properties where Marriott charges half the rates to reserve, and I can easily rent for double the rate, yet many owners are willing to accept the lower point allocations and still trade their weeks rather than being bothered renting them, accepting the skim and, in some cases, inequitable point allocations as a cost of convenience.

The bottom line is that the DC offers convenience, albeit at a cost that many consider worth the price.

 

[puckmanfl]

good evening....

There is a "skim" on rentals as well. It is called Federal Income tax. Is not the difference between MF's and your rental rate considered taxable income? That can be a nice skim if you are in the 39% bracket, higher when loss of deductions for higher income is factored in.

I am not a tax professional, but I did play hockey today!!!!

 

[suzannesimon]

You are correct, of course, Puckman. Aside from the timeshares, I rent 2 vacation properties - one breaks even and one loses money. I have them because I hope to retire to them someday. The timeshares are the only ones that actually make money so the timeshares cover the loss of the money-loser so I don't have to pay tax on the timeshare profit. Being in the real esrate business, I am more comfortable with renting than a lot of others. Years ago I would never have gotten imvolved with renting these and it wasn't my intention to rent them when I bought them. I'd love to just use them for vacations and trading.

 

[EKniager]

LOL, I'm not sure there is a point I can disagree with here!

• Buying into the club made zero economic sense to us but everyone has different values and needs. It is more expensive than the original developer weeks pricing and in annual MF's.
• Although converting our Aruba Surf Club into points is a bad financial deal (versus renting), adding the conversion option to our legacy week was worth the $595 last year. If nothing else the ability to rent points when needed is an interesting enhancement. Plus, the 800 "incentive" points gave 7 family members on the DW's side a Thanksgiving in Williamsburg they'll remember forever!
• And... the new, fixed price II membership saves us money as we almost always lockoff and trade at least half our unit. Years when we trade both, the savings over the old II account are significant.
• Renting our unit and then having cash to rent another has usually been a better option than trading. (Although the little studio unit has almost always traded for more than its ~$1,000 rental value!) Maybe, even more importantly, when you rent you can choose your view category.
• We often forget TUG'ers are in the minority in the TS world. Most owners/prospects are lacking the knowledge and guidance available here.

I probably don't thank all of you enough for helping my family understand our options and enabling us to maximize our TS assets. Great thread gang! Thanks for continuing to share your ideas, experiences, and opinions!

 

[vlapinta]

I only own 1 Marriott week. The thing that stopped me was the fee I would have to pay every year regardless of wether I wanted to trade my week for DC points or not. True I would have to pay a fee to II IF I wanted to trade my week. This year, through II I traded my Gold OW for Marriott Maui. I am hoping this continues IF I want to trade my week. To me it was one more expense I did not need.

 

[GaryDouglas]

When the new trust program was initiated, I reviewed much of the legal documents that were available at that time. Since it was written in lawyereze, it was not a straight forward read. But my overall impression was, Marriott can change the rules at any time and it would always be in Marriott's favor. To me, deeded weeks are tangible, whereas trust points can eventually and effectively be vapor. We'll keep on reviewing what they are offering and listening to those that have bought into the system. We continue to be content legacy owners...

 

[dansimms]

Fan of the Destination Program

I decided to purchase 2500 Trust points in order to qualify for Premier Plus. I was concerned that in future years it would be a higher qualifier to get to that level. I am banking on the fact that I will be able to take advantage of the 30% reduction in Points required for bookings in less than 60 days. I figure realistically, with our flexibility, not having kids, that it would make my 13,300 points (potentially) worth another 1,000.......about a $450-$500 value annually to us. We place a high value on the convenience of using the web site to browse and book trips. When we have wanted to book a trip, the Premier Desk Customer Service Reps are a lot easier to work with in exploring our options and making suggestions. I also figured that over time, between II and Marriott, the costs for not being on the Destination Program would only tilt higher in order to make their case for enrolling. There are not many memberships where we could achieve the very top status, so affordably for us, so we did it and are glad. Friends of ours just bought a small condo in Manhattan that they plan to use for a couple of nights a month.......this investment pales in comparison to what they signed on for, so there are many ways to look at an investment. If we use our lock offs, we still have the option of having 6 weeks just from our Legacy holdings and then the 2500 Trust Points are enough to treat the occasional friend or family member to tag along as our guest....which we do a couple of times per year. There is absolutely a skim factor, but we feel in trading down to non-peak seasons and getting change back is a way to minimize the impact of that. All in all, we see it as easily being ahead to the tune of one thousand to a couple of thousand dollars per year in the way that we use the program as compared to not being in the Destinations Program. Getting Platinum Elite Status in the Hotel program benefits us quite a bit as well (for 3 years), as we do a fair amount of travel that is paid for by work and we don't always hit the 75 night qualifier by doing it the old fashioned way. Being on a concierge floor, particularly in Europe can save you hundreds of dollars in a single stay! Who knows what the future brings, but I would guess that down the road Marriott will dangle even more carrots in the Premier Plus program to get others to make the leap we did. We are banking on that too....but if that doesn't happen, we will still feel it is worth our while. I think with purchase promotions the 2500 points ended up costing us about $23,000......which is a lot......but was something we could fortunately afford and we no longer have to weigh the decision to upgrade any longer. (No more tours !)

 

[puckmanfl]

good evening...

well said with good points..just one more query...??? When they raise PP to 14,000 points will you purchase 1000 more. If you are flexible to travel off season, with less than 60 days you can get some unbelievable deals on II flexchange, even with studio units. Good news, you don't lose this option but you gain the 13 months less than 7 day perk, which is just huge!!!

enjoy...