Timeshare Closing Services, VIN, and Ebay --my experiences

[TimeshareTraveller]

I bought a 2 BR floating winter week at Eagle Point off of Ebay with a VIN Inc reseller. The closing costs quoted were $399 and a $25 transfer fee using Timeshare Closing Services as the closing company.

I would recommend TCS and VIN, but I simply can't. I had a lot of trouble getting a valid signed contract out of the company, VIN Inc. (Vacation Interval Network or Vacations International Network). I actually made the mistake of trying to buy other weeks from them after this first transaction, and had the same issues. It seems they would have understood from the first that I was serious given that I'd completed the transaction prior, though with major pain in trying to get the signed contract of sales. So much of a pain that I don't think it's a legit operation.

Here's how they work. First, they hold meetings around the country where they get owners who want to shed their timeshares to give them (VIN Inc) $3500 to take it off the owner's hands. The owner signs a limited Power of Attorney to allow them to record the deed later with the new owner.

Note: I have no real issue with this. If someone is desperate enough to want this off their backs and don't know how to handle it, well, this is their financial decision. This is how the world works.

Then, they auction them on Ebay. The closing company that they are using is very integrated with them, Timeshare Closing Services (TCS). TCS supposedly provides escrow. However, when you send payment for your VIN purchased timeshare to TCS, you are instructed to use the address, paypal@timeshareclosingservices.com (the domain of TCS). That email address is listed to VIN Inc in PayPal. So, you are sending the money directly to VIN, not TCS. There is no escrow.

Now, where I had snags was that they require full payment to "TCS" in 5 days and shipped me the Contract of Sales in email with everything filled out except the seller's signature. I signed it and asked the seller to send me back a fully signed copy. This seems to be a huge problem for them. The contracts go to TCS, not VIN, except that they share offices for some services. Not all services --there is a separate VIN location in Florida. The seller is listed as a "Name, as Selling Representative of VIN Inc" on the Contract of Sales. In my first transaction, the demand for the signed contract did eventually get me a contract copy that had everyone's signature on it. Then 3 days later, I got a phone call from TCS telling me that my salesperson (bonefissh) had "quit" and that I had to sign a new Contract of Sales with my new agent. This is, of course, after all money was in TCS's hands. I sent it in as soon as I had the signed contract.

I pointed out to our TCS rep that the Contract of Sales had the seller listed as an agent of VIN Inc, and that money had been accepted under that contract. Therefore, I had a valid sales contract with VIN Inc and had no need of signing a new document. They were on the hook to give me the timeshare on those terms --Legally. I told the TCS agent to check with their in-house attorney, but he'd tell them that I was correct.

About a week after that, we got a scorching phone call from TCS on a home phone number that we had not provided them (though it is our public line) telling us that if we didn't get a signed contract in, we'd lose all of our money that we paid. I called our rep (it wasn't her calling), and asked her what that meant. I pointed out the valid Legal signed contract and offered to send her another copy. After a few hours of investigation, they informed me that it had been a mistake. Everything was in order.

The rest of that first transaction went smoothly. Except that when they sent me the recorded deed, they sent me the copy that the original owners had signed with VIN, not me. VIN doesn't record the original owners deed until they have a new owner ready to record. What that means to the original owner is that they've paid $3500 to this company, but if anything happens to the company, they will still own that timeshare until the deed is recorded. VIN has been good about paying maintenance fees for the original owner before sale, but that's because they are usually turning these around in weeks.

So, eventually the actual recorded deed for Eagle Point came in. I was happy. Happy enough to bid and win on two more timeshares that I'd wanted.

One was another Eagle Point, only this one was a winter Every Odd Year 1 BR. The other was a resort in VA that we stay at every summer and I was hoping to pick up another unit to host family parties. Two different salesmen this time.

This time, the effort to get a signed contract was unbelievable. I was about 15 days getting the contracts signed and in. That was my fault, but mainly I missed getting it done in the first 3 days and then one of the signers was gone for 10 days on a business trip. But, they wanted the payment immediately, in full. Normally, I'd have deposited 10% in escrow to hold it until we could get everything done. However, the previous experience made me hold off since it isn't really escrow that you're putting it in.

The 1 BR Eagle Point timeshare guy refused to send me the signed contract. Actually, he never outright refused, he just kept ignoring my requests to send me a signed copy of the contract, and he kept demanding the full payment. I refused to comply until I got my contract. Eventually, they threatened to relist the property, and I just let it go.

The VA property is a bit different. The VIN agent here did seem to be puzzled at why I balked at sending in $6K to a shadowy company with no signed Contract of Sales to offer the slightest protection. He offered to get TCS to fax him a copy of the contract, sign that, and send that copy to me. Let me just put that in perspective --that means that the original contract would never be signed by both parties. I'd have a document that I don't know if it would hold water in court. Once I realized that the contracts go to one place, money goes to another, I was really spooked. I insisted that the agent sign the contract, send it to me, we'd sign it and take copies, then send the original to TCS. The agent did that. I was ready to finish the contract.

And my husband refused to sign that document. He wants nothing to do with this company given that they are so adamant about NOT giving you a signed Contract of Sales. He killed the deal. I actually want to go through with this, but he won't have anything to do with it. I think that the seller for the VA property is really trying to be legit. But it's a really rotten organization he's fronting.

Why are we so hung up on the Contract of Sales? If you don't have that signed copy, then if the company goes under in the middle of the transaction (say, like Vacation Solutions did) then you don't have anything to prove that you entered into a legal agreement with them. There's a PayPal transaction, but who knows what is your reason that you gave them several thousands of dollars.

And why don't they want to give you the Contract? Why do they do anything to leave you without one? I don't know. But it probably has to do with liability. Maybe the agents are all very independent and could rob the office (like Vacation Solutions did). But basically, they act as a middleman without any liability on them for the transaction if it goes south. I think we had so many problems with them because we demanded that they give us our legal protection. That scorching phone call in the first transaction telling us that we had to give them a Contract of Sales or lose all of our money really bothered us. Bothered my husband enough that he wanted to wash his hands of them, good price or not. Because it would be a lousy deal if it went south.

I would still complete the VA deal if I could. The agent sent us a signed contract. But my husband won't sign. And I won't go against that. We make deals as a couple, not a pair of singles. If he's uncomfortable, I won't push. I'll look elsewhere for my family getaway purchase.

The Eagle Point 1 BR transaction, however, well, the salesman wouldn't even acknowledge my requests for the signed Contract. I have no regrets in washing my hands of that deal altogether. I'd like the property, but even for a $1000 purchase I won't negate that legal protection step.

And TCS. They did record the deed. But their website promises title insurance, which you do not receive. And for the steep price of $399, if I requested a copy of the original deed, I should get it. I should get gold-plated service for that fee. I didn't even get escrow, though. Nor did they actually do the estoppel with the resort. In my first transaction, the current year's interval had been used. I was paying for it and told that I'd get it. When I called this issue to their attention, it took a while to get it fixed in the Contract of Sales (the one we eventually signed and got in). So, they don't really do estoppel either unless pushed for a copy of the estoppel findings. Gold-plated service.

Protestations of "If anything is wrong, we'll make you happy" doesn't go far with me if they won't make me happy in providing me legal protection on the sale.

This post has run on a long time. I won't say that you shouldn't use them at all. But use some caution. Force them to sign the Contract first and send it to you. Ask for the copy of the deed to prove they've got that interval, unit, and resort. Call the resort to check on the fees and any outstanding mortgage or assessments. Once they have your money, they don't have incentive to provide these things. Remember that the closing company, Timeshare Closing Services, has a close enough relationship with VIN that they allow VIN to use the TCS domain to run their PayPal account.

The prices on Ebay are good. But we've seen some sharks out in those waters.

--TimeshareTraveller

 

[Spence]

Here's how they work. First, they hold meetings around the country where they get owners who want to shed their timeshares to give them (VIN Inc) $3500 to take it off the owner's hands. The owner signs a limited Power of Attorney to allow them to record the deed later with the new owner.

Note: I have no real issue with this. If someone is desperate enough to want this off their backs and don't know how to handle it, well, this is their financial decision. This is how the world works.

Verbose, but pretty much right on target. Better watch out or RickandCindy23 will try to convince you otherwise because you have no real issue with their 'feeder' companies like Timeshare Relief.

 

[Carolinian]

. . . don't you mean ''bottom feeder companies'' ?????

And, I would have a local attorney in the state where the timeshare is located look at the deeds from those out of state closing companies, and particularly the deed INTO the bottom feeder company. Too many of those are invalid.

This whole TCS / VIN mess should be handed over to the Real Estate Commission in the state where the timeshare is located. There appear to be a number of violations in your narrative.

 

[STEVIE]

Hi,
a few weeks ago I won a bid through the same seller- Vin. It took over a week for a contract to come via E-mail. I filled in our info. and signed. I faxed the contract back to the closing company as instructed. When I received the contract the sellers sig. was not on it. I assumed, because I have never bought resale before, that I would then receive the contract back signed by everyone. Well, over a week has gone by, and I have not heard a word. I don't know what to think. Am I being scammed, since I have paid in full, or will I eventually hear from them. I thought I had read here before, that the closing company is legit. HELP!!!!!
Sue

 

[johnmfaeth]

Hi All,

I have bought almost 20 timeshares from VIN that closed through Timeshare Closing Services.

I have always had good experiences with them. This fall, when their clerk "lost" the closing stuff for two units (same resort) that still had 2006 weeks left, I cancelled the deal in mid-December as it was to late to reserve those weeks and got a full refund of $1,444 issued right away. The check was drawn on the Timeshare Closing Services Escrow Account. Twice in the past (during 2005), I cancelled deals with them due to material issues withthe timeshare and they refunded my money when asked.

The Ochoa brothers moved last year from VIN to whatever they are now called and close through Title Outlet. About 10 purchases later, they are still good in my book.

I have on numerous occasions spotted errors in VIN/Ochoa EBay listings and they always correct them immediately. Once, they cancelled two auctions (had significant defects) and relisted them after correction. That was impressive as it cost them about $100 in listing fees to do that.

So, sloppiness or onesidedness of contract administration aside. I do business with them the old fashioned way, I call them and the do what they say they will. Can't get better than that.

John Faeth

PS. I am a partner in a competing closing company, wish I could knock TCS or TO but they get the job done as promised - I am quicker though

 

[STEVIE]

Thank you for the reply. I feel better hearing your success stories. Can you give me any idea of what to expect from them, and in what kind of timely fashion? Thankyou, Sue

 

[johnmfaeth]

Hi Sue,

You will see an escrow account number on your contract. It will usually begin "VIN" for their closings. Call TCS and ask to speak to the closing person on your deal, they will look up that person by escrow account # in the computer and connect you.

I recommend calling that person on a weekly basis for status. many steps are just "hurry up and wait" but what you want to avoid is them getting busy and your paperwork sitting on their desk for a week or two before proceeding to the next "step".

John Faeth

 

[STEVIE]

John,
thankyou, sue

 

[PeelBoy]

I had a deal with TCS in December. Because of the holidays, I didn't anticipate any smooth service at all. TCS kept me posted with all steps by both email and snail mail. Yesterday, I received a certified recorded deed. I called the resort, which had received the request for change from TCS. Everything is done in 3 weeks, despite the holidays.

Overall, my experience is very different. I would buy from TCS, since in my limited encounter with them, they have done an excellent job.

 

[JudyS]

.....I pointed out to our TCS rep that the Contract of Sales had the seller listed as an agent of VIN Inc, and that money had been accepted under that contract. Therefore, I had a valid sales contract with VIN Inc and had no need of signing a new document. They were on the hook to give me the timeshare on those terms --Legally. I told the TCS agent to check with their in-house attorney, but he'd tell them that I was correct.

About a week after that, we got a scorching phone call from TCS on a home phone number that we had not provided them (though it is our public line) telling us that if we didn't get a signed contract in, we'd lose all of our money that we paid. I called our rep (it wasn't her calling), and asked her what that meant. I pointed out the valid Legal signed contract and offered to send her another copy. After a few hours of investigation, they informed me that it had been a mistake. Everything was in order....

I spent a while reading this, but I'm still not sure that I understand all of it. It seems to me that the main problem was that VIN would not provide a copy of the sales contract with the sellers' signatures on it. Is that correct? I don't understand, though, why you weren't willing to sign a second sales contract after "bonefissh" (what a name!) had left. They already had your money, so why not sign again?

I also bought an Eagle Point unit from VIN, but it was a very inexpensive off-season unit, so I didn't mind sending in the money before I had a signed contract. My main problem with VIN was that they wanted me to fax the contract, and I didn't have a fax handy. I emailed and asked if snail mail was OK, but got no response. I eventually snail mailed the contract, with no problems. My deed has been recorded and the resort says I'm listed as the owner now. It took maybe two months, and part of that was me not knowing where to send the contract.

One discrepancy is that the letter I just got from Eagle Point says I have an every-year unit, and VIN said it was every-other-year. I need to check my deed and see which is correct.

Overall, I am happy with the transaction.

 

[TimeshareTraveller]

I spent a while reading this, but I'm still not sure that I understand all of it. It seems to me that the main problem was that VIN would not provide a copy of the sales contract with the sellers' signatures on it. Is that correct? I don't understand, though, why you weren't willing to sign a second sales contract after "bonefissh" (what a name!) had left. They already had your money, so why not sign again?

I also bought an Eagle Point unit from VIN, but it was a very inexpensive off-season unit, so I didn't mind sending in the money before I had a signed contract. My main problem with VIN was that they wanted me to fax the contract, and I didn't have a fax handy. I emailed and asked if snail mail was OK, but got no response. I eventually snail mailed the contract, with no problems. My deed has been recorded and the resort says I'm listed as the owner now. It took maybe two months, and part of that was me not knowing where to send the contract.

One discrepancy is that the letter I just got from Eagle Point says I have an every-year unit, and VIN said it was every-other-year. I need to check my deed and see which is correct.

Overall, I am happy with the transaction.

I didn't want to sign another contract because we already had a valid signed contract. Bonefissh was the agent on the first property. He signed something, probably a fax from TCS with our signatures on it, and sent it to us. So, we had a copy of a document with signatures on it from both buyer and seller. VIN took money based on that contract. Therefore, it's a legal deal with legal protections. After the money was in, TCS called to tell us that the agent had quit and that we needed to sign a new contract with a new agent. There wasn't any need, because we already had a valid contract signed by both parties. Bonefissh was listed on the contract as an Agent for VIN, so the contract was really with the seller VIN, not just Bonefissh.

If we signed another contract after that with a later date, then there is a possibility that we would not really have legal coverage. I wasn't interested in taking that chance. Or getting our lawyer to look at the contract again.

I don't understand still why VIN/TCS is so adamant not to issue copies of contracts signed by both seller and buyer.

In my second purchases, it was nearly impossible to get the contract signed by the VIN agent. We did eventually get that after we refused to budge on the issue, but by that time my husband wasn't going to sign anything with them. We're buying from another sales office for about the same price, but without the dodginess in the contracts.

One other thing to note, I have never dealt with a closing service that took escrow funds without a contract in place to direct the closing. This is evidently common with TCS.

As I said, the way the deal is set up, if anything were to happen, you'd have a hard time pressing for your rights without that signed contract. It's a risk that we don't care to take.

--TimeshareTraveller

 

[johnmfaeth]

Hi Timeshare Traveller,

I can certainly respect your position that you wanted a contract for legal protection. And with small amounts of money it is economically feasible to pursue your rights in a local small claims court (so longs as the contract does not say something like "the laws of Florida apply"). But if you win, how would you affordably collect an interstate judgement against a fraudulent seller? Would there be assets left at that point or will you just be another unsecured creditor in a bankrupcy with insuffienct assets vs. debts?

I come from the old school (for small dollar transactions - let's say anything under $3K) where you perform due diligence and talk with a person to feel them out and then follow your gut.

Escrow agents will take money at any point in a deal. For example, when buying a house, you submit your downpayment with a contract that is not countersigned. The broker (as escrow agent) deposits the check and sends the contract to the other party to sign. Happens thousands of times every day in the US.

The important thing is that the escrow company does not disburse the monies prematurely. But not only is that a criminal offense, but in the case of Timeshare Closing Services, they are bonded and the bonding co. will make good. I have never investigated whether the bonding company listed on their references sheet really insures them, that would be another criminal violation if they didn't.

John

 

[icydog]

Hi All,

I have bought almost 20 timeshares from VIN that closed through Timeshare Closing Services.

I have always had good experiences with them. This fall, when their clerk "lost" the closing stuff for two units (same resort) that still had 2006 weeks left, I cancelled the deal in mid-December as it was to late to reserve those weeks and got a full refund of $1,444 issued right away. The check was drawn on the Timeshare Closing Services Escrow Account. Twice in the past (during 2005), I cancelled deals with them due to material issues withthe timeshare and they refunded my money when asked.

The Ochoa brothers moved last year from VIN to whatever they are now called and close through Title Outlet. About 10 purchases later, they are still good in my book.

I have on numerous occasions spotted errors in VIN/Ochoa EBay listings and they always correct them immediately. Once, they cancelled two auctions (had significant defects) and relisted them after correction. That was impressive as it cost them about $100 in listing fees to do that.

So, sloppiness or onesidedness of contract administration aside. I do business with them the old fashioned way, I call them and the do what they say they will. Can't get better than that.

John Faeth

I have had dealings with Vin and with Tom Ochoa. I tried to cancel a deal with Ochoa and he sent me a nasty note telling me there was a $500 cancellation fee, aka the $500 I sent Timeshare Outlet held in escrow for him. It took almost 5 months to close a 7K contract for Bluegreen points. I wanted out of the deal since it had long past a reasonable time period for closing and was way past the signed upon closing date. Unlike you John, a frequent purchaser and reseller, he offered me no recompense for keeping my money on ice for five months. (I found out later what he was doing was doing a double transfer from the original owner to me and that is what took so long. I never knew that until I posted my experiences on TUG.) So for you John, he may be your best bud and you may get terrific service, but for myself I wouldn't do business with him again if you gave me a free timeshare.
As far as Vin, I closed a number of contracts for RHC and and for an Embassy Resort in Fl with this company, and all were finally closed. In my dealings with TCS, sometimes they lose things, don't call back, don't remember facts, are slow, are lazy, but eventually things get done. But, in my experience they don't get done unless I call constantly to check up, and to ask them to push the paper from desk one to desk two.

My biggest concern with these companies is if I do not follow through with their contracts I will get a negative rating on ebay.

 

[johnmfaeth]

Hi Icy,

I can certainly understand your frustration. I didn't say my closings were any quicker, I have waited up to 6 months for a closing I do for my clients in 6 weeks. Thus my first posting of the thread to get the name of the closing person and call them every week. The squeeky wheel theory certainly applies here. Maybe some of my longer closings were because of a transfer to them "clogging" the pipe ahead of mine. Thus my PS.

I've never requested a refund from the Ochoa's during their VIN days, I requested it from one of the two ladies who manage the closing team at TCS. In fact, never previously spoke to the woman who issued the $1,444 in December (it wasn't an Ochoa deal either - they were gone from VIN at that point). Obviously, TCS wanted to keep me happy as a frequent customer, but I had them on a time-constrained deal where they clearly blew it.

Here's how I look at it, 51 weeks of the year, a timeshare is just a folder sitting in my files. One week a year it becomes a physical place for me or a friend/renter to use. So I rarely care or even track the closing status of the deal, eventually it happens. Every few months I look for things that are overdue and inquire.

Feedback can only be left on Ebay for two months or so, so if you go to the feedback section and do not see the purchase listed. Neither party can then leave feedback. So that is not really an issue.

These days, the Ochoa's using Title Outlet who are faster than TCS, but still relatively slow.

Here are my experiences with closing companies, listed in order from slow to fast:

1) Resort Closings - one just took 8 months that finished in Dec, 2006
2) Timeshare Closing Services - see above
3) Holiday Group - other than Peggy Hidaka who walks on water IMHO
4) Timeshare Transfer
5) Title Outlet
6) Time Travel Traders (Alan Schnoll & his wife) - this mom and pop team just create and record deeds but are lightening fast, they offer no escrow, estoppel, nor have a lawyer on staff (all dangerous unless you perform your own full due diligence and trust the seller with your money prior to closing). But they are just good people in general and if you just need a deed cut, you will never go wrong with them.


Companies #1 - 5 take two to three times as long as they would in closing versus if every day they reviewed what had come in and turned it around to the next step immediately. Most of the time is wasted with stuff sitting in a pile for a couple of weeks before moving ahead. It takes some of these people a month just to cut the internal check for the recording fees AFTER the package is ready to send out.

My brother always gets very annoyed when the McDonald's drive thru messes up his order. His wife asks him what he expects from someone making minimum wage. The same theory applies with these closing companies, the work is all done by overworked low paid clericals, not professionals (other than the Schnoll's)

Hope this clarifies a bit....

John

 

[icydog]

Yes it does. Can you pls sene me a PM or email the information on the Schnolls? Thanks, Marylyn from NJ

 

[dmarcin]

I have purchased 4 time shares on ebay and so far havent had any problems from any of the transactions. On 2 of these I have done my own closing and found the process very easy although a bit time consuming. One of these was in Tennessee and the others in Florida. Florida has a web site to research the deeds and I live in tennessee and was able to go to the court house myself and research/record the deeds. The deeds were very simple to do as I just used a computer program to generate a deed. I am wondering why almost any individual couldnt close most time share deeds himself? I have found that a sales contract is a must. with such a small amount of monies involved I felt an escrow company was not needed. Any coments or sugestions?

 

[Carolinian]

Using a computer program to create a deed can be dangerous UNLESS the program is specific to the state where the timeshare is located. If one is going to do it themselves, it is MUCH safer to copy the previous deed into the seller EXACTLY, not assuming any detail is unnecessary and essentially just changing the names.

I have seen too many invalid timeshare deeds for North Carolina drafted by out of state attorneys or out of state timeshare closing companies. The detail they most frequently miss, that is not required in many states, is not one that the Register of Deeds usually checks for in recording, so they think they have a good deed due to it being recorded, but in fact they have a document that does NOT transfer legal title.

A party to the transaction CAN legally draw a deed, but cannot receive compensation from the other party for that deed, even if they are not licensed to practice law in the state. Any other situation that does not involve an attorney licensed in the state where the timeshare is located may involve violating one or more criminal laws (up to three of them in the case of North Carolina).

There was a thread not long ago involving local attorney t/s closings on HHI and several Tuggers recommended local attorneys whose fees were at or under those of many of the out of state timeshare closing companies. A local attorney with a reasonable fee is the best bet to get it done quickly and correctly.

I have purchased 4 time shares on ebay and so far havent had any problems from any of the transactions. On 2 of these I have done my own closing and found the process very easy although a bit time consuming. One of these was in Tennessee and the others in Florida. Florida has a web site to research the deeds and I live in tennessee and was able to go to the court house myself and research/record the deeds. The deeds were very simple to do as I just used a computer program to generate a deed. I am wondering why almost any individual couldnt close most time share deeds himself? I have found that a sales contract is a must. with such a small amount of monies involved I felt an escrow company was not needed. Any coments or sugestions?

 

[BocaBum99]

Hi Icy,

I can certainly understand your frustration. I didn't say my closings were any quicker, I have waited up to 6 months for a closing I do for my clients in 6 weeks. Thus my first posting of the thread to get the name of the closing person and call them every week. The squeeky wheel theory certainly applies here. Maybe some of my longer closings were because of a transfer to them "clogging" the pipe ahead of mine. Thus my PS.

I've never requested a refund from the Ochoa's during their VIN days, I requested it from one of the two ladies who manage the closing team at TCS. In fact, never previously spoke to the woman who issued the $1,444 in December (it wasn't an Ochoa deal either - they were gone from VIN at that point). Obviously, TCS wanted to keep me happy as a frequent customer, but I had them on a time-constrained deal where they clearly blew it.

Here's how I look at it, 51 weeks of the year, a timeshare is just a folder sitting in my files. One week a year it becomes a physical place for me or a friend/renter to use. So I rarely care or even track the closing status of the deal, eventually it happens. Every few months I look for things that are overdue and inquire.

Feedback can only be left on Ebay for two months or so, so if you go to the feedback section and do not see the purchase listed. Neither party can then leave feedback. So that is not really an issue.

These days, the Ochoa's using Title Outlet who are faster than TCS, but still relatively slow.

Here are my experiences with closing companies, listed in order from slow to fast:

1) Resort Closings - one just took 8 months that finished in Dec, 2006
2) Timeshare Closing Services - see above
3) Holiday Group - other than Peggy Hidaka who walks on water IMHO
4) Timeshare Transfer
5) Title Outlet
6) Time Travel Traders (Alan Schnoll & his wife) - this mom and pop team just create and record deeds but are lightening fast, they offer no escrow, estoppel, nor have a lawyer on staff (all dangerous unless you perform your own full due diligence and trust the seller with your money prior to closing). But they are just good people in general and if you just need a deed cut, you will never go wrong with them.


Companies #1 - 5 take two to three times as long as they would in closing versus if every day they reviewed what had come in and turned it around to the next step immediately. Most of the time is wasted with stuff sitting in a pile for a couple of weeks before moving ahead. It takes some of these people a month just to cut the internal check for the recording fees AFTER the package is ready to send out.

My brother always gets very annoyed when the McDonald's drive thru messes up his order. His wife asks him what he expects from someone making minimum wage. The same theory applies with these closing companies, the work is all done by overworked low paid clericals, not professionals (other than the Schnoll's)

Hope this clarifies a bit....

John

John,

What is the name of your closing company? I'd like to use it someday.

 

[johnmfaeth]

Faeth Closing Services Inc.
168 Gould Avenue
North Caldwell, NJ 07006
973-699-4118

Incorporated in and regulated by the State of New Jersey.

Insured escrow accounts managed by Commerce Bank.

 

[ownsmany]

Faeth Closing Services Inc.
168 Gould Avenue
North Caldwell, NJ 07006
973-699-4118

Incorporated in and regulated by the State of New Jersey.

Insured escrow accounts managed by Commerce Bank.

What do you charge for closings?

 

[johnmfaeth]

Rates renge from $100 for deed creation and recording (plus actual recording costs) through $375 (plus actual costs) for complex non-US deeded timeshares including escrow and estoppel services.

We also provide foreclosure and "deed in lieu of foreclosure" services for HOA's worldwide.

One of my partners (and inhouse attorney) is the former NYC Recorder of Deeds. The other is a former Ernst & Young/Cap Gemini Principal.

Every transaction is managed by a partner, not a clerical.

 

[PA-]

Rates renge from $100 for deed creation and recording (plus actual recording costs) through $375 (plus actual costs) for complex non-US deeded timeshares including escrow and estoppel services.

We also provide foreclosure and "deed in lieu of foreclosure" services for HOA's worldwide.

One of my partners (and inhouse attorney) is the former NYC Recorder of Deeds. The other is a former Ernst & Young/Cap Gemini Principal.

Every transaction is managed by a partner, not a clerical.

Are those fees set by law, or is a New Jersey firm allowed to charge whatever they want?

I close a lot of deeds myself, and it seems difficult to believe you could be making much profit at those rates. It's mundane work, but it is a bit time-consuming. Especially if you're dealing with various timeshares you aren't familiar with.

 

[johnmfaeth]

No, rates are not set by law but the free market. We are just one year old and keeping our rates low while providing a team whose qualificatons are unmatched in the timeshare industry.

That is the model for quickly growing a business with a loyal customer base, we have a very long term outlook while others are looking for a quick buck. So far that has been a great business plan and the only way we want to run a closing company.

 

[ownsmany]

No, rates are not set by law but the free market. We are just one year old and keeping our rates low while providing a team whose qualificatons are unmatched in the timeshare industry.

That is the model for quickly growing a business with a loyal customer base, we have a very long term outlook while others are looking for a quick buck. So far that has been a great business plan and the only way we want to run a closing company.

Do you have a web site? Do you offer title insurance ? If so how much?

 

[Walt]

My dealing with TimeShare Closing Services have not been good

I have dealt with Timeshare Closing Services 2 times. Both transactions have not been done to my satisfactory. :annoyed:

The first one was for a bid on Ebay for a 2 bedroom Red week in a Resort in Wisconsin. It took 7or 8 months to get a closing done. The reason (so they said) was that the owner had 2 weeks. One week was a Red week. The other week was a White Week. The owner gave back a week to the Resort and sold the other on Ebay. When it came time to close, I found out that the week on the copy of the Warranty Deed listed the White week not the Red Week as they week I was buying. Only because the Resort was willing to give back the Red Week and take the White week did the deal go through. Of course, the trading power was reduced by 7 months

The second transaction was cancelled yesterday because they did not have the week to sell.

The Ebay ad was for a 2 bedroom red week at a Resort in Florida. I will call it Resort A. The Name listed, the address of the Resort, the Maintenance Fee amount, the pictures of the Resort all showed it to be Resort A. When I got the copy of the Warranty Deed yesterday, I saw on one line of the Warranty Deed stating the Resort commonly known as Resort A which was correct. However on the very next line of the Warranty Deed, they listed the unit as unit 616 at a resort I will call Resort Z. How could a Closing Company not know something was wrong when doing the Warranty Deed?

Since Resort A didn’t have a floor over 4 stories and no unit higher than 411, I knew something was wrong. I called them and got this Story.

I found out that the person selling the week had ownership in both Resorts. The story I got (And I do think it is a Story) was that they called the wrong Resort and got the wrong information to put in their listing on Ebay. And they would be willing to sell me the week in Resort Z for half the amount I would have paid for Resort A. It is my view, since I know both Resorts, I would NOT take the week in Resort Z for 'Free." I am waiting for a full refund. I found out about this deal yesterday and will let you know how long it will take to get the full refund.

Walt